State Rd 9B

[tufsu1]

Keep in mind that the 9B itself will serve much more than just the Flagler office park...it is just the one ramp that is "self serving".

But what if the development led to the creation of new jobs, which thereby increased the tax rolls?  If so, why wouldn't it be appropriate to spend public dollars for infrastructure that served the development?

[cline]

I have a problem when taxpayer monies is used to enhance or direct traffic to what is looking like a high dollar developement, jobs notwith standing!

Like I mentioned previously, this project has been planned for quite some time.  If you have a problem with it, you should have brought it up when it was still in the planning stages, not once ground is broken and its too late.

[CS Foltz]

Gentlemen...........I would love nothing better than to just keep track of whats taking place and where and when! Not possible though, still come back to the issue of who is paying for this? FDOT or Federal money means taxpayer money that is allocated by people who supposedly plan for these kinds of things. Not sure but I don't think there is any oversight and maybe there should be! The timing of this is suspect with Amendment 4 on the horizen and to me looks like...........giterdone! Unless Fortress is paying for it, which I doubt, taxpayer money is involved and those jobs stay in Flagler do they not?

[tufsu1]

It is reckless with the public trust to be spending hundreds of millions on 'what ifs', tufsu1.

I think the existence of the Citi complex and Baptist South take away the 'what ifs' on this development....I'm betting there's 5000+ jobs down there today.

Also, keep in mind that the office park is in Duval County, which means the business tax $ stays here.

[CS Foltz]

OK.........I will buy that, but you neglected to answer just whose money is paying for the interchange?

[cline]

but you neglected to answer just whose money is paying for the interchange?

Actually, it was answered earlier.  The first part of the project is a stimulus project.  The part of the project with the ramp you are referring to is not funded yet.

[CS Foltz]

OK cline..........stimulus project which I believe would translate into "Federal" money? My tax dollars hard at work again but there is no interchange funding slated as of yet?

[cline]

My tax dollars hard at work again but there is no interchange funding slated as of yet?

Yes, the same tax dollars that bailed out all the banks. 

The segment of 9B south of US1 is not currently funded.

[tufsu1]

OK.........I will buy that, but you neglected to answer just whose money is paying for the interchange?

I have stated earlier that this ramp may in fact be funded by the development....but lets just assume that it isn't...

My guess is that traffic engineers estimated future demand and determined that the 9B interchange/intersection with US 1 would not meet LOS....this seems entirely possible in the AM when workers to the Flagler area would be arriving via 9B at the same time as others were driving up US 1 (including workers headed to downtown and the baymeadows area).

Providing a direct entrance from 9B into the development eases congestion at the intersection w/ US 1, therby making the commute for many others easier...which could be deemed as a "public good".

[CS Foltz]

Gotcha.............Federal funds again! Ok since that part of the 9B is not funded then no work will be done at this point until funding from somewhere is allocated for that section which means it will be on hold. Unless Fortress decides to fund it themselves which I would have no problem with! The primary issue I would have is taxpayer money being used to fund access to a private developement..........that is my primary issue! Private funding, go for it, taxpayer money needs to be substanciated and then some! No oversight provided beyond what planners plan and all of the public notice given does not allways filter down to my level! tufsu.........still have issues with what is basically a private road to a developement, interchange does nothing but give access to a private business park. It is of no use unless you cross over from 95 to US1 and there are plenty of places ranging from 16 to Golf World Village to Range Line (9Mile) Road.

[thelakelander]

Did Flagler donate the land for the second phase of 9B?

[tufsu1]

tufsu.........still have issues with what is basically a private road to a developement, interchange does nothing but give access to a private business park. It is of no use unless you cross over from 95 to US1 and there are plenty of places ranging from 16 to Golf World Village to Range Line (9Mile) Road.

Hardly just a private serving road....I can tell you that the 2035 adopted model for the region shows 50,000 vehicles per day on the segment from 9A to US 1...and 62,000 on the segment from US 1 to I-95....without the dedicated ramp into Flagler or access to anything else along the way!

As to Lake's question about donating land, I don't know...but at a minimum, they've set aside an easement through the development (it can be seen on aerials)...in fact, if you look at the property lines on Google Maps, you'll notice that land has already been reserved for the roadway and the interchange w/ I-95.

[tufsu1]

Its just reckless sprawl breeding isnt it?

I'm sure the folks who already live down there and now have a hospital close to them would disagree.

[north miami]

Is it true I-95 level of service was allowed to downgrade under the assumption St.Johns County agreed to 'improvements'/future roadways?

[tufsu1]

Is it true I-95 level of service was allowed to downgrade under the assumption St.Johns County agreed to 'improvements'/future roadways?

Yes...St. Johns County was granted a variance to the LOS standard for I-95 about 15 years ago with the agreement that they would fund parallel improvements (like CR 2209)....the portions of I-95 that will be "relieved" by 9B are in Duval County...and in fact construction of 9B (and the Outer Beltway) are expected to add traffic to I-95 in St. Johns County

btw...Baker County just got a similar variance for I-10.