Roost Cafe and Coffee shop trying to open on Oak St?

[mtraininjax]

No one seems against another restaurant in Riverside...

Amen, no one is against another restaurant in Riverside or Avondale or Brooklyn, the issue here is that the ROOST owners LIED to the residents, the City and fellow businesses. They submitted a plan for 60 seats, then decided to change it to 150 using the same zoning.

If I was a resident near there, I would not trust them either.

And now this has made its way to the JBJ

Residents of Riverside come out against planned Roost restaurant in Oak Street building - Jacksonville Business Journal http://snip.ly/E4Va

[BoldCityRealist]

RAP & Co are spearheading this anti-development movement (from what I saw on this new FB group "P.R.O.U.D."), surprise, surprise. Funny thing, I've seen RAP folks climb out of their big ol' honkin Amerikan SUV at Snap, the fitness center they live three or four blocks down from.

No wonder they are so concerned about the cars!

I lived off College and walked blocks to Five Points/Oak St all the time, in the sunshine, in the rain, in the cold. Because that's what you do in a walkable neighborhood. This type of infill will FORCE people (like the elite folks of RAP) to WALK or BIKE to places. Isn't that a crazy thought? I now live in Avondale and bike to Snap instead - screw cars.

Who knows, maybe all of this infill will force the city to start looking at better mass transit solutions when Riverside is thriving with bars, cafes, restaurants all around and cars can't fit any more!

Sorry RAP/Anti Development people, I welcome businesses coming into these beautiful abandoned buildings and creating some new wonderful content for me to WALK to.

[BoldCityRealist]

I just skimmed through the thread - and if people are not in fact against a new spot opening and the disagreement stems from seating, that's a different story. While 150 may be too much, I don't think 80-100 is bad. Again, it forces people to pursue other methods of getting around the 'hood. Like a bus, or an Uber, or a bike. Or walking...

[dp8541]

We recently purchased a house in Avondale, and the immediate development around the homes we looked at played a huge factor in our ultimate decision.  If having commercial property across the street is an issue with a renter or buyer, look somewhere else (which is exactly what we did).  People move to riverside for the reason of having establishments such as Roost within walking or biking distance.

[Sentient]

If they're playing head-banging music at 2am, great, we have noise ordinances for that. If their customers are rowdy drunks, great, we have a statute addressing drunk and disorderly conduct. These gripes (that haven't actually happened) aren't zoning issues, they're things that if they happen, there is already a set of laws to deal with them. You call the cops and they stop the offending behavior. I really don't know how a biscottis'esque restaurant/coffeehouse somehow translates into automatic mayhem, but on the 1% chance it did, so what, we have laws for that. Something that likely will not happen, and that is already addressed by laws outside the zoning context if it does, isn't a valid basis to stop the place from opening, IMHO.

Exactly!!!!  enough of the NIMBY BS fear mongering.  Has anyone eve rbeen out at 1AM?  Do you know how few places are even open in Jax, let alone restaurants with full menu kitchen service (required under SRX) at that time?  Very very few...

And all this BS of "historical uses"...  that shouldn't be a factor AT ALL.  History is about change.  Be aware of that...  Almost none of the restaurants around started out that way...

[Sentient]

I have mixed feelings on this one. Full disclosure I am actively engaged in moving into Riverside. I love all of the shops, bars and restaurants.  I can also see the need to manage the needs of different parties.

I love all of those things too. I particularly love the fact that most everything I could want is with a five-minute walk of my house. That's fantastic, and far enough away not to be a burden. My thinking is only that the neighborhood will be better served as a whole by intelligent planning of incoming development. Houses where people want to live, and restaurants where people want to eat.

No one seems against another restaurant in Riverside... I know I am not. I am only making the observation that it could be easily placed where it did not interfere with anyone's lives.

Intelligent planning... oh the hubris of you people...  Soviet Union mean anything to you?  You think your little coffee klatch is smarter than the market?  Hahahahahahahaha

[Sentient]

I just skimmed through the thread - and if people are not in fact against a new spot opening and the disagreement stems from seating, that's a different story. While 150 may be too much, I don't think 80-100 is bad. Again, it forces people to pursue other methods of getting around the 'hood. Like a bus, or an Uber, or a bike. Or walking...

I've said it many times... the SRX/alcohol licensing laws discriminate against small landlords and small business...  they force 100 or 150 seat requirements for no other reason than to restrict access to alcohol.  which is absurd in 2015.  Ackwardsbass J'Burg again at work...  Bold New City stuff here...

Do you know how much more it costs to build out and then staff a 150 seat restaurant?  It's unreal.  In NYC, SFO, LA, Chicago...  you see plenty of sub 50 seat places...  hell many sub 25 seat places... but you can't here because you can't make the margins with just beer and wine and food...

[Sentient]

We recently purchased a house in Avondale, and the immediate development around the homes we looked at played a huge factor in our ultimate decision.  If having commercial property across the street is an issue with a renter or buyer, look somewhere else (which is exactly what we did).  People move to riverside for the reason of having establishments such as Roost within walking or biking distance.

Better to have an unmitigated environmental hazard site as a prominent feature of your neighborhood.  That will preserve it's character and drive up land values!

Whew... we kept out those bastards with their restaurant and preserved our cancer cluster...

[JeffreyS]

I hate the way this conversation is devolving. No need to call people anti Developement for disagreeing about the use of one building.

[edjax]

I hate the way this conversation is devolving. No need to call people anti Developement for disagreeing about the use of one building.

Agree.  But the new MJ Way. 

[thelakelander]

Residents push back against planned restaurant in Riverside

Some Riverside residents are pushing back against a requested change in zoning that would allow a restaurant to open in a vacant building on Oak Street.

The pushback comes after two local developers, JC Demetree and Ted Stein, put forward the possibility of opening a 150-seat restaurant called Roost in the former Deluxe Laundry and Dry Cleaners at 2216 Oak Street. The developers are looking to change the zoning for that building, as well as half of the adjacent De Luxe Launderette building, from a commercial residential and office space to a planned unit development.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2015/11/18/residents-push-back-against-planned-restaurant-in.html

[fsujax]

so they would rather just have a vacant building?

[Sentient]

Residents push back against planned restaurant in Riverside

Some Riverside residents are pushing back against a requested change in zoning that would allow a restaurant to open in a vacant building on Oak Street.

The pushback comes after two local developers, JC Demetree and Ted Stein, put forward the possibility of opening a 150-seat restaurant called Roost in the former Deluxe Laundry and Dry Cleaners at 2216 Oak Street. The developers are looking to change the zoning for that building, as well as half of the adjacent De Luxe Launderette building, from a commercial residential and office space to a planned unit development.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2015/11/18/residents-push-back-against-planned-restaurant-in.html

Holy smokes....   this reporter is an absolute idiot letting Kevin write an anti development article for her and seeking NO other sources for comment...  like not one direct sourced comment from the developer.

and this Pettway sounds like a complete tool.  such arrogance...  should be allowed just for this alone.

"Kevin Pettway, who lives across the street from the property, said he's concerned about the proximity of the in-the-works restaurant to homes. The restaurant would have 32 outdoor seats in addition to the interior space.

"The primary concern of the community is the fact that the Oak Street corridor between King Street and Margaret Street is vulnerable to commercial encroachment," Pettway said. "Our best use for that property is residences. We actually would love to see something put in there and see that property develop, but we would like to see it develop intelligently."

""It would be fine in a different place," Pettway said. "Many of our neighbors have expressed that if this were a few blocks away, they'd be happy to go there.""

really...  he speaks for the whole community it appears... and will be the arbiter of what constitutes "intelligent" development...  But all is not lost, he would deign to allow it in someone else's backyard...


Hey Kevin... if you are so intelligent why not buy the place and do something with it yourself?

Oh but if I would hit the Mega Millions.  I'd raze that place and put up a 10 story HUD project for you to look at... LOL  Or a methadone clinic, in keeping with the historic "character" of the area...

[Kay]

Mellow Mushroom is not a PUD as the article states; it is zoned CCG-1.  5 Points Village is an example of why not to have PUDs.

Residents push back against planned restaurant in Riverside

Some Riverside residents are pushing back against a requested change in zoning that would allow a restaurant to open in a vacant building on Oak Street.

The pushback comes after two local developers, JC Demetree and Ted Stein, put forward the possibility of opening a 150-seat restaurant called Roost in the former Deluxe Laundry and Dry Cleaners at 2216 Oak Street. The developers are looking to change the zoning for that building, as well as half of the adjacent De Luxe Launderette building, from a commercial residential and office space to a planned unit development.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2015/11/18/residents-push-back-against-planned-restaurant-in.html

[Kay]

Perhaps you need to read it again if you did not comprehend the developers point of view in the article.  It may be too much to ask that you raise your level of discourse.

Residents push back against planned restaurant in Riverside

Some Riverside residents are pushing back against a requested change in zoning that would allow a restaurant to open in a vacant building on Oak Street.

The pushback comes after two local developers, JC Demetree and Ted Stein, put forward the possibility of opening a 150-seat restaurant called Roost in the former Deluxe Laundry and Dry Cleaners at 2216 Oak Street. The developers are looking to change the zoning for that building, as well as half of the adjacent De Luxe Launderette building, from a commercial residential and office space to a planned unit development.

http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2015/11/18/residents-push-back-against-planned-restaurant-in.html

Holy smokes....   this reporter is an absolute idiot letting Kevin write an anti development article for her and seeking NO other sources for comment...  like not one direct sourced comment from the developer.

and this Pettway sounds like a complete tool.  such arrogance...  should be allowed just for this alone.

"Kevin Pettway, who lives across the street from the property, said he's concerned about the proximity of the in-the-works restaurant to homes. The restaurant would have 32 outdoor seats in addition to the interior space.

"The primary concern of the community is the fact that the Oak Street corridor between King Street and Margaret Street is vulnerable to commercial encroachment," Pettway said. "Our best use for that property is residences. We actually would love to see something put in there and see that property develop, but we would like to see it develop intelligently."

""It would be fine in a different place," Pettway said. "Many of our neighbors have expressed that if this were a few blocks away, they'd be happy to go there.""

really...  he speaks for the whole community it appears... and will be the arbiter of what constitutes "intelligent" development...  But all is not lost, he would deign to allow it in someone else's backyard...


Hey Kevin... if you are so intelligent why not buy the place and do something with it yourself?

Oh but if I would hit the Mega Millions.  I'd raze that place and put up a 10 story HUD project for you to look at... LOL  Or a methadone clinic, in keeping with the historic "character" of the area...