Is Springfield Regressing??

[nvrenuf]

Defending no one. I deal in facts not innuendo. If I know of a falsehood in reference to an organizaton I work with, in this case SOS then I will work to state the truth. As an attorney, I would think you also expect facts to build cases. Regarding #1, who at SPAR called who at SOS complaining about the artwork? Oh never mind, I'll go straight to the horses' mouth and ask the rest of SOS themselves and disregard hearsay.

[sheclown]

To me, it doesn't matter who filed the complaint. And I have no facts or proof as to who did. I will say that Preservation SOS did a hell of a lot in a short period of time to prevent all preventable demolitions and make way for legislation change for mothballing and protecting our homes. If painting over hearts saves more homes, I'll go paint over all the rest. And honestly, I giggle when I think that that is all someone could complain about, the art and hearts. From time to time I am reminded that "hey" damn it, we stopped demolitions! And I smile with great content.

A group of mindful and committed citizens can change the world. Let's go out there and do it.

[ChriswUfGator]

Defending no one. I deal in facts not innuendo. If I know of a falsehood in reference to an organizaton I work with, in this case SOS then I will work to state the truth. As an attorney, I would think you also expect facts to build cases. Regarding #1, who at SPAR called who at SOS complaining about the artwork? Oh never mind, I'll go straight to the horses' mouth and ask the rest of SOS themselves and disregard hearsay.

Why are you attacking me?

I've done nothing but try my best to help Gloria, and I was offended that SPAR would call code enforcement to report the artwork hearts as "graffiti." If you don't have a problem with insipid actions like that, then you've got a screw loose. Regarding "innuendo" you're the one arguing with me without a single fact, and you're wrong. You might consider taking taking your own advice rather than lecturing others with it, that way it winds up where it's obviously needed.

[ChriswUfGator]

And perhaps they ride flying assmonkeys instead of cars.

That leaves a mystery as to who's posting under nvrenuf's screename while she's busy providing transportation services.

[sheclown]

Defending no one. I deal in facts not innuendo. If I know of a falsehood in reference to an organizaton I work with, in this case SOS then I will work to state the truth. As an attorney, I would think you also expect facts to build cases. Regarding #1, who at SPAR called who at SOS complaining about the artwork? Oh never mind, I'll go straight to the horses' mouth and ask the rest of SOS themselves and disregard hearsay.

Brenda complained to me about the artwork at our meeting saying that locals were complaining about it.

Brenda brought it up at the HPC subcommittee meeting (artwork on the houses and neighbor's complaints).  

Twice I have heard Brenda talk about mothballing and twice she brought up "The graffiti".  

Like Nicole, I don't really care about the "graffiti" BS, I "just want to save houses."  

(And I"m the one who painted the bloomin' hearts to begin with).

[sheclown]

& Chris you have been wonderful to me. 

[nvrenuf]

Defending no one. I deal in facts not innuendo. If I know of a falsehood in reference to an organizaton I work with, in this case SOS then I will work to state the truth. As an attorney, I would think you also expect facts to build cases. Regarding #1, who at SPAR called who at SOS complaining about the artwork? Oh never mind, I'll go straight to the horses' mouth and ask the rest of SOS themselves and disregard hearsay.

Why are you attacking me?

I've done nothing but try my best to help Gloria, and I was offended that SPAR would call code enforcement to report the artwork hearts as "graffiti." If you don't have a problem with insipid actions like that, then you've got a screw loose. Regarding "innuendo" you're the one arguing with me without a single fact, and you're wrong. You might consider taking taking your own advice rather than lecturing others with it, that way it winds up where it's obviously needed.

Attacking you? Wow.

[strider]

When some of us said that SPAR Council was supporting the appeal of the car wash, we got told no way.  We got told it was a vicious rumor. Odd thing though, a few months later the official minutes of the Board meeting came out and low and behold, SPAR Council did indeed vote to support the appeal of the car wash. Things are often just what they seem to be.

Now can we move on to bigger and better things?

[nvrenuf]

Defending no one. I deal in facts not innuendo. If I know of a falsehood in reference to an organizaton I work with, in this case SOS then I will work to state the truth. As an attorney, I would think you also expect facts to build cases. Regarding #1, who at SPAR called who at SOS complaining about the artwork? Oh never mind, I'll go straight to the horses' mouth and ask the rest of SOS themselves and disregard hearsay.

I think you might find that common sense wasnt ejected from the legal arsenal, nvrenuf.

But come to think of it, I suppose it is mildly possible that marauding art critics from San Marco managed to accidentally drive down Ionia Street and then simultaneously all complain to the relatively hard to find building codes department about hearts painted on windows.

After all, there is a long and clear record of guerilla art critics descending like locusts on urban core neighborhoods.

Its plausible.

And perhaps they ride flying assmonkeys instead of cars.

Flying assmonkeys would be an interesting sight now that we've managed to move most of the hookers out of the area. I, we, whatever, have some ideas of who was involved but since we do not have PROOF, we aren't going on public websites making claims. Just seems reasonable to me. But then what do I know, I think flying assmonkeys would be cool to see.

[iloveionia]

Preservation SOS doesn't want to be accused of making statements that we have no facts to base them on. Particularly when it comes to SPAR. We have done our best to remain neutral and go about our business of saving houses.

We do try our best to keep our nose out of things. That's all nvrenf is saying. We don't want folks to say "Preservation SOS said you (fill in the blank.)

I started a thread about bringing life to Main Street. Let's bring it.   

[ChriswUfGator]

Preservation SOS doesn't want to be accused of making statements that we have no facts to base them on. Particularly when it comes to SPAR. We have done our best to remain neutral and go about our business of saving houses.

We do try our best to keep our nose out of things. That's all nvrenf is saying. We don't want folks to say "Preservation SOS said you (fill in the blank.)

I started a thread about bringing life to Main Street. Let's bring it.   

Except I haven't made any comments that aren't based on fact.

The reality is that you're being polite about it in order to avoid ruffling SPAR's feathers, but they most certainly reported the Preservation S.O.S. hearts to code enforcement as "graffiti" and everyone knows it. Sorry, but sometimes something is just so abhorrent that it needs to be aired out and I don't particularly care who at SPAR might be offended that someone called them out on it. What are they going to do, call code enforcement on this website? Lol

And regarding Nvrenuf, she wants to play innocent these days but I don't have much use for wise-assed lectures from that particular source. The fact of the matter is that she and her husband were SPAR members and at least one of them was actually on the SPAR board during DeSpain's reign of terror when most of the businesses on Main Street closed and 1/3'rd of the neighborhood got demolished.

She was in that mess up to her eyeballs, including the "rooming house" witch hunts, which I find especially ironic as she now wants to name-drop Gloria on me. She spent the better part of a year implying that me, Stephen Dare, and others, were liars for pointing out what was going on, or earlier for pointing out that Emperor VanHorn had no clothes. Oddly I can't seem to find a few of the most notable quotables, but enough still remain to give you the general idea.

So while it's been a long year, I've hardly forgotten her previous antics;

Any chance of getting back to the topic of another group home trying to be rammed down Springfield's overflowing throat?

Um okay, I guess we shouldn't give a shit about our property values or anything that might possibly affect them?? I'd like to get rid of the ho's and crack houses, dealers & thieving addicts too. Just because you complain about one issue doesn't mean you've forgotten the others. And if I recall the question also had to do with desirability. Do a random survey of potential homeowners, given the choice of a bunch of halfway houses or not, which would they choose?

The truth is that there aren't that many rooming houses of any variety left in Springfield, compared to a few years ago, and that figure will continue to decline into nonexistence due to the zoning/overlay revisions (with the apparent exception of the new one the CEO of Clara White is trying to start).

The terms "not that many" and "a few years" are vague enough to leave those amounts up to interpretation. How many is "not that many" and is "a few years" ago 5-10-20? And how will that number decline if the zoning/overlay revisions continue to allow exceptions for people who weren't able to sell their house at the $$$ they wanted in these tough economic times? Maybe next year they make 10 exceptions? Then you end up with the same cycle starting over again. People won't want to be surrounded by boarding or rooming houses, they start selling, values drop and more people sell before the bottom hits. Then the city ends up losing more money from the falling tax values.

The pros are that it is a use for an abandoned building and will bring walking traffic to the neighborhood as well as give people a possibility of stopping without makin uturns.

How does a car wash help to bring walking traffic to the neighborhood? Honest question. Is the hope that they will go across to 3rd & Main or to 6th & Main? Or that some stores will open in the nearby area where they can shop? Otherwise I don't see how a specifically car-related business would bring walking traffic. I would suspect most people would just wait in the convenience store like at Car Spa. I rarely see people leave there to shop at Regency across the street.

Panera opening in Springfield = good

I mean, if you want to see a real miniseries on everything asinine that was wrong with SPAR and on the ideology that destroyed Springfield, just go back 2 years or so and start reading Nvrenuf's post history. So pardon me if I'm not prepared to accept a wise-assed lecture from this recently-come-to-Jesus former cause of the problem.

Especially when so much of it turns out to be total fabrication. Case in point;

As to the 2007 'we hate the car wash SPAR conspiracy'. At the time I was a SPAR member and I can tell that I never received a phone call, email, telepathic emission, smoke signal or even organized flatulence that informed me as a SPAR member that I should be contacting ANYONE about the car wash. At the time there were far more than 5 SPAR members, so if only 5 called in then it was a pretty crappily executed conspiracy.

So the conspiracy conversation is more of the same shite, different day. It really does NOT apply to every discussion about Springfield. But please do continue to carry on with the ubiquitous tripe.

Obviously, we know how true all of that was, following release of SPAR's meeting minutes where they actually all took a vote to file a zoning appeal to stop the new business from opening. Not to mention Silas Jones' open letter to COJ wherein he listed the dates, times, and names of the SPAR members who had called in bogus code enforcement complaints (some of them 5 or 10 times each within the span of a day). Or this;

Doug V., did you circulate a petition against rooming houses at the last Shadco meeting?

sheclown, I was at the meeting and one was not circulated.

We all know how that one turned out. SHADCO did in fact circulate an anti-rooming house petition, and SPAR jumped the shark and actually circulated an anti-rooming house petition with the name on the form covered up and told people it was a "sign in sheet" to get them to sign it. Seriously this stuff is mind-boggling.

To her credit, 2010 was definitely a new leaf, and she's done the right thing since then as far as I can tell, and has certainly assisted with Preservation S.O.S. and from word of mouth has evidently done a complete 180 on all of her former SPARbarian positions. But I guess I take issue with the assertion that a year of good behavior somehow qualifies her to lecture me on this sort of thing, when the last several years have gotten me quite accustomed to receiving her lectures and to their mostly being absolute BS. Especially when I always did the right thing, and never needed a come to Jesus moment. Being agnostic, I'm not required to believe in absolute and instant forgiveness just because one asks. I do have a functioning memory, after all. And if I only had a dollar for every time Nvrenuf has implied I'm a liar or didn't know what I was talking about, only to wind up being correct. And, FWIW, I didn't choose to take it here. I don't post lies or make random comments not based in fact, and don't appreciate the implication otherwise.

[letters and numbers]

Wow who ever thought rooming houses were good for a area trying to revitalize and gentrify?  Thats sort of crazy you know! Hey man this conversation is strange!

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

for all of his liberal views, I really think that CWUG is a republican in disguise - he indubitably has the memory of an elephant.   

[ChriswUfGator]

Wow who ever thought rooming houses were good for a area trying to revitalize and gentrify?  Thats sort of crazy you know! Hey man this conversation is strange!

I can't really explain the past 4 years' worth of history in one post. There's just a lot more to it than that.

Things aren't always what they're labeled. "Rooming Houses" included. Sometimes labels are assigned to something that doesn't fit the description, simply because it enables people to treat one thing as though it's something else for personal reasons. And that's what happened with this issue. Sometimes people also identify a legal business as the root of all evil, simply because they don't personally like it. The fact that it's been there for years before they showed up doesn't apparently matter. Exactly like the folks who move in next to an airport and complain about the noise. Duh. There was a good bit of that nonsense going on here too.

[iloveionia]

Ha!  I'm definitely being polite Gator, thank you.  It IS important now with SOS.  I'm a gal who speaks my mind freely, and still will, but for the sake of saving our houses I do practice being subdued and hope I am relatively successful.

Again.  Good things are coming from Springfield (as Miss Fixit posted,) regardless of past acts.  We do need an active commercial corridor on Main Street in Springfield.  Let's move on and go discuss that, okay?