How to bring people downtown

[rjp2008]

The baseball field, basketball arena, library and courthouse were obviously a start. The courthouse will bring with it more high-powered individuals who have money to spend, and thus, benefit businesses at lunch time.

I would focus on two keys - attracting more tourism traffic and attract more private business downtown with incentives. The port is a major advantage for international business. A convention center would certainly go a long way towards drawing more business interest, and if you could combine it with a modest attraction, would also pull people off 95 to take a look

[hillary supporter]

an artifical surf park.  Theres only a handful one of which is the primitive typhoon lagoon in Disney World.  Its so expensive that competion is not any problem.
Ive heard price quotes around $20 million but sponsers would cover a lot of that cost.
I think you could get a big out of town market as surfers are rabid for waves. And mother nature doesnt provide a lot for many places in the world. Jacksonville tself has a lot of surf enthusists.

[Sportmotor]

an artifical surf park.  Theres only a handful one of which is the primitive typhoon lagoon in Disney World.  Its so expensive that competion is not any problem.
Ive heard price quotes around $20 million but sponsers would cover a lot of that cost.
I think you could get a big out of town market as surfers are rabid for waves. And mother nature doesnt provide a lot for many places in the world. Jacksonville tself has a lot of surf enthusists.

if your gonna do that then (which I would die for btw) then might as well throw in a Decent skate park as well

[JeffreyS]

I still think we should start with a drug store and selling some parking meters on ebay.

[hillary supporter]

f your gonna do that then (which I would die for btw) then might as well throw in a Decent skate park as well

yeah, there are several modifications to choose from, the flowrider, good for bodyboarders. And a skatepark.

[thelakelander]

I don't think any expensive gimmick (aquarium, gondolas, fish market, movie theatre, etc.) will attract suburbanites to downtown.  Instead of worrying about suburbanites, the focus needs to be on making downtown and the surrounding urban core a self-sustaining urban district.  If you can make the core self sustainable by attracting and retaining urbanites, the vibrant atmosphere alone will attract suburbanites.

[CS Foltz]

lake I agree! All of the gimmicks in the world have nothing to do with something that is self sustainable! Infrastructure  would be nice.......transportation support, ok.........but attracting urbanites will take more than what is taking place today! No vision, no plan and no cents!

[Ocklawaha]

I don't think any expensive gimmick (aquarium, gondolas, fish market, movie theatre, etc.) will attract suburbanites to downtown.  Instead of worrying about suburbanites, the focus needs to be on making downtown and the surrounding urban core a self-sustaining urban district.  If you can make the core self sustainable by attracting and retaining urbanites, the vibrant atmosphere alone will attract suburbanites.

I think the gimmick idea's are great for downtown, we need to capture the tourist dollars flowing right through our funnel. But to say a giant fish tank, theater, baseball park or anything else is going to cause suburbanites to flock into the central city is delusional. I'd love to see a urban designed IKEA, MEGA THEATER, BASS PRO, etc... in some sort of shipyards high rise and retail complex would be super cool. It would bring in folks from Valdosta to Gainesville and Brunswick, but I don't see them living here. So not a bad thing to have, provided we don't depend on it delivering a sustainable community in a box.

As for the "gondola's" (Rope Cable Tram) it would actually be a fast, cheap and beneficial way to get around our river problems and create real mass transit mix. Until you see these things in action, your mind will always think "amusement park," or "ski resort," you can bet the bank it's WAY better then that. It might indeed be about as useful as Streetcars in creating a rapid development core. This is NO gimmick and can be multi station, long distance, rapid transit --- WAY CHEAPER THEN BRT.

OCKLAWAHA

[thelakelander]

They (gondolas) don't fit into the historic urban neighborhoods that mass transit needs to connect DT with.  Imo, the connection/integration of DT with nearby neighborhoods is the main thing lacking.  DT was never an island unto itself so we should not plan like it is.  As you know, viable mass transit in an urban area can be a game changer.  To me, based on the continued success of these projects across the country, I'd say its streetcar or bust.  Everything else is can help, but they are more complementing projects rather than game changers.

[Ocklawaha]

This system carry's cement, imagine this sort of access over our rivers into the core.

I would agree with you on streetcars being the absolute star performer on bringing $$ investment into any downtown.  What I'm mostly referring to is the damnable river crossings we have to deal with and the convoluted route around the FEC or CSX lines South.

As you well know I support immediate construction of streetcar throughout downtown and the urban neighborhoods, hell, I STARTED THE IDEA!  But consider just as an example a few connectors to downtown:

Beaches - Regency - University - Stadium / AP Randolph district - Intermodal connection

Intermodal connection - Stadium / AP Randolph district - Beach Bl - Gate Parkway - Town Center

Or even the Orange Park Mall - Yukon / NAS - intermodal connection to downtown...

Like the Skyway concept, there is a lot to be said for going up and over stuff, expecially when it can be done without breaking the bank, like BRT would do.

There is just no reason for the City not to embrace many modal choices fitting the best technology to each region of the "River" or Core. What starts off as Streetcars and perhaps some Skyway extensions may well end up being a world class mix of various transit modes, all layering in a matrix, into the Urban Core. Want to see us REALLY grow? On a Jacksonville Scale, Duplicate Medellin, or San Francisco!

OCKLAWAHA

[hillary supporter]

I don't think any expensive gimmick (aquarium, gondolas, fish market, movie theatre, etc.) will attract suburbanites to downtown

i disagree, a surfpark, skatepark, southern r%r museum, etc could actually run hand in hand. The surfpark would be unique worldwide. having a commercial venture like ikea, bass pro shops, macys etc is out of our hands seeing that those private entities have no desire to locate downtown. Commercial business as decided to locate to properties to accommodate their workforces automobiles.
I dont believe we have any solutions to draw suburbanites to downtown

[mtraininjax]

I think a golden trolley placed at the right location would bring MJ posters together as a symbol of the greatness of nothingness.

This thread is so basic, city has no money, will have to borrow to spend and grow downtown, it needs more shopping, more residents, more nightlife and private sector will not start the revolution.

Paint the ACL engine at the prime in gold paint.

[thelakelander]

The city has money, it just being used for programs and projects that many here may not agree with. So what are things the city can invest in (assuming some funding priorities were changed) that will spur market rate development for generations?

[thelakelander]

I don't think any expensive gimmick (aquarium, gondolas, fish market, movie theatre, etc.) will attract suburbanites to downtown

i disagree, a surfpark, skatepark, southern r%r museum, etc could actually run hand in hand. The surfpark would be unique worldwide.

While they would be great things to have, people and businesses aren't going to move to and invest in the urban core because they are there.  Imo, these are things that can improve the quality of living in the core but they aren't the basic essentials needed for the creation of a vibrant urban district.  Right now, Jax is struggling to provide the basics (connectivity, mass transit, zoning, maintenance, tax incentives, etc.).

having a commercial venture like ikea, bass pro shops, macys etc is out of our hands seeing that those private entities have no desire to locate downtown. Commercial business as decided to locate to properties to accommodate their workforces automobiles.

If you can build a viable urban community, commercial business will locate and invest in them on their own.  This is beginning to happen in long time sprawlers like Charlotte, Nashville, Houston and Orlando.  It can happen here as well......if we can get our act together.

I dont believe we have any solutions to draw suburbanites to downtown

My view is why bother?  Instead focus on building an urban core (not just downtown) that appeals to urbanites.  If you can create a viable urban community, one of the side effects will be the attraction of suburbanites to an atmosphere that can't be replicated in the burbs.

[CS Foltz]

lake........I agree! There is nothing there now to attract much of anyone! 11E or Carling are basically in stand alone mode and not much else there to act as a magnet! Not to mention a severe lack of mass transit, but yah BRT is coming along with BRT lanes and one way streets more than what is there now! With a lack of overall vision and plan to meet that vision, what little City Hall is planning is just scratching the surface and not much more! Tax breaks and incentives can only do so much but need to be integrated with some kind of a plan or a vision and so far .......not much on that!