Nathan Beford Forrest High: Time For a Name Change

[TheCat]

I'm reposting what I wrote a few pages earlier. It was directed at Ock but he's not feeling well so I'll divert the questions to i-10east, cayohueso and anyone else who thinks it's just "political correctness" to change the name.

"Do You think the fine families of Ponte Vedra would be okay if we developed a Nat Turner Park near Ponte Vedra High? Or, maybe we should just change the name of that school to Nat Turner High School of Leadership Development? Nat Turner was a leader amongst the oppressed. That's a powerful message.

You're right. Maybe, that's what needs to happen. Change the names of more schools not just Forrest! How do you feel about Huey Newton Elementary (founder of the black panthers) instead of Alamacani? Or,  Elijah Muhammad Middle School instead of Fletcher? I'm sure the the people who are soooo tired of being politically correct will jump at the opportunity! Plus, history and heritage and stuff. "

[Cheshire Cat]

it's not just dcps.  many cities have been going this route as well when it comes to naming public places, parks, bridges, etc.  It seems it is far to easy to apply today's morality on the past, which is completely unfair to the past.  60+ years from now people will be able to find fault in the names chosen today and wonder what the heck we were thinking.  the use of personal names usually has the greatest chance of becoming an ethics lightning rod in the future.  If you dig into most of our country's forefathers pasts (heck even our city founders), you can find something to be offended by base on today's standards.  the era is which one is born has the greatest impact on what types of skeletons they may be hiding.

I don't think it is about applying today's standards to yesterday's choices.  It's about growing beyond the type of mentality that would name a school as an in your face insult to the Black community.  At some point we must acknowledge poor judgments in the past and learn from them.  Renaming the school not only says that the people of today "get it" but it also says that we are willing to move beyond racist attitudes going forward. 

[I-10east]

Like many issues concerning the black community, it seems like this whole Forrest thing irks local white liberals (because after all, liberal whites 'represent' the face of the black community) more than anything. I don't see any enraged black folk marching up and down Firestone Rd. Sure anyone can make a petition, and say 'this man was the white Devil etc..'. As long as the tilt is FAAARRR left for the liberals, everything is a-okay; Some of yall would probably be cool with naming a school after some nutcase like Edward Snowden, or Christopher Dorner, SMH....

[I-10east]

^^^Couldn't you come up with something that resembles mature content Stephen? Really, name calling??? I must've said something right that hit a nerve sense you stooped to your usual low level. You'll be trying to change the name of the city if you had your way.

[I-10east]

^^^Having a clear stance on something that may be unpopular = trolling, okay....

[Cheshire Cat]

Like many issues concerning the black community, it seems like this whole Forrest thing irks local white liberals (because after all, liberal whites 'represent' the face of the black community) more than anything. I don't see any enraged black folk marching up and down Firestone Rd. Sure anyone can make a petition, and say 'this man was the white Devil etc..'. As long as the tilt is FAAARRR left for the liberals, everything is a-okay; Some of yall would probably be cool with naming a school after some nutcase like Edward Snowden, or Christopher Dorner, SMH....

I dunno I-10, I believe you did mention once that you are Black but my guess is that you are in your late 20's or 30's?  Correct me if I am wrong.  I am not Black but have spent a number of years working closely with my dear friends in Jacksonville who suffered through the struggles of the 50's, 60's and beyond and to give their time and experiences in Jacksonville the respect that they are due.  Truth of the matter is that many whites have always been disgusted by the rancor and hatred with which the Black community has been treated.  I do believe that if you came from the time of these injustices, you would more readily understand that this is not about political correctness and is really about turning our back as a city on the ugly side of racism.  Yes, that coming from and "old" not "elderly" white lady who doesn't like being called a liberal most of the time, just a free thinker.  lol

[I-10east]

^^^Having a clear stance on something that may be unpopular = trolling, okay....

adding an uninformed and racist opinion to an already contentious issue = trolling.

Why not stick to the sports threads where no one notices this kind of thing?

How I'm I being being a 'uninformed troll' that happens to be 'racist' against _____ race? Explain that? Those are some strong buzz words to throw around. Are you saying that white liberals don't have a strong presence in the black community? How come a school like my alma-mater Raines High isn't boycotting games against Confederate named schools? Use attack words when you disagree with another, typical liberal. Conservatives have their tactual-like mind games also.

You still have yet to explain why I'm offbase. FWIW, I don't like arguing on posts like this in which I already had a take, but when someone brings up your name, I sorta have an obligation to reply. 

[I-10east]

I dunno I-10, I believe you did mention once that you are Black but my guess is that you are in your late 20's or 30's?  Correct me if I am wrong.  I am not Black but have spent a number of years working closely with my dear friends in Jacksonville who suffered through the struggles of the 50's, 60's and beyond and to give their time and experiences in Jacksonville the respect that they are due.  Truth of the matter is that many whites have always been disgusted by the rancor and hatred with which the Black community has been treated.  I do believe that if you came from the time of these injustices, you would more readily understand that this is not about political correctness and is really about turning our back as a city on the ugly side of racism.  Yes, that coming from and "old" not "elderly" white lady who doesn't like being called a liberal most of the time, just a free thinker.  lol

Thanks for the very cordial post Cheshire. I'm a 36 year old black man that haven't experienced a ton of racism like my Mom have in that Jim Crow era. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that all non-black people involved in the black community are white liberals. Although IMO it's sort a waste of money, I'm not really against a Forrest name change, but the continue PC-overload in the future is what scares the hell outta me; Because of the 'Trail of Tears' change the name of the city, knee-jerk reaction this, knee jerk reaction that.... When will it stop?

[I-10east]

Continue on with your attack buzz words, and faux outrage Stephen.

[I-10east]

^^^

^^^Having a clear stance on something that may be unpopular = trolling, okay....

[Cheshire Cat]

I dunno I-10, I believe you did mention once that you are Black but my guess is that you are in your late 20's or 30's?  Correct me if I am wrong.  I am not Black but have spent a number of years working closely with my dear friends in Jacksonville who suffered through the struggles of the 50's, 60's and beyond and to give their time and experiences in Jacksonville the respect that they are due.  Truth of the matter is that many whites have always been disgusted by the rancor and hatred with which the Black community has been treated.  I do believe that if you came from the time of these injustices, you would more readily understand that this is not about political correctness and is really about turning our back as a city on the ugly side of racism.  Yes, that coming from and "old" not "elderly" white lady who doesn't like being called a liberal most of the time, just a free thinker.  lol

Thanks for the very cordial post Cheshire. I'm a 36 year old black man that haven't experienced a ton of racism like my Mom have in that Jim Crow era. I'm sorry if I gave the impression that all non-black people involved in the black community are white liberals. Although IMO it's sort a waste of money, I'm not really against a Forrest name change, but the continue PC-overload in the future is what scares the hell outta me; Because of the 'Trail of Tears' change the name of the city, knee-jerk reaction this, knee jerk reaction that.... When will it stop?

Well then by my standards your are indeed young.   I can understand the angst with the political correctness we are so often confronted with today it seems at almost every turn.  In this case, I honestly believe the situation goes beyond the workings of a PC mindset and embraces the attitude that once we as a collective people understand that past racist actions or decisions are hurtful to many (especially the older folks who lived the struggle) it is no big deal to change a name on a school when in fact that name "embraces" past hurts and serves as a constant reminder of how badly some among us were treated.  I see it as a step into the light of understanding as opposed to bending to a PC attitude.    As far as changing "everything" that won't happen, especially in the case of our city's name, but other issues can be looked at and decided on a case by case basis and if the majority feels a change is prudent, then why not if it brings peace of mind and sense of justice?  I don't see that as a problem in the big scheme of life. 

[sheclown]

Petition grows to change school's name
Students, community voice concern over Nathan Forrest High School's name
Author: Tarik Minor, Anchor-reporter, tminor@wjxt.com

New push for name change

DUVAL COUNTY, Fla. -

Michelle Nance graduated from Nathan Forrest High School in 1987 and told Channel 4 that she wants her kids to graduate from the same school with the same name.

"Our history made us who we are, that's our heritage, our background, it's who we are," said Nance. "It's just like Robert E. Lee, Ed White, Nathan Forrest."

Nathan Forrest was a lieutenant general in the Confederate army and he also served as the first Grand Wizard of the KKK, before distancing himself from the Klan. Some parents say it's all part of history, but an online petition calling for a name change is gaining popularity.

"There are other people that we can look forward to, more positive. It's not about hate, so to name someone to glorify it is absolutely wrong," said Kim Mower.

"One thing I've been talking a lot about is the need to modernize Jacksonville," Dr. Nikolai Vitti told Channel 4 Tuesday night. "If we want folks to come here, whether it's business, it's high level employees to Jacksonville, names of schools, names of parks, it all matters."

Vitti, the Duval County School Superintendent, told Channel 4 that a formal request for a name change hasn't been brought to the school board, but if it did, Vitti said organizers will have his support.

"It needs to go through the leadership council at the school level, work through that process, and then ultimately given to the school board for a recommended change," said Vitti.

Parents and students who were at Forrest High School Tuesday said they are torn on the issue.

"Maybe they shouldn't do anything, this is part of our history, maybe they should keep it," said Melissa Chouse.

The petition can be found on change.org.

http://www.news4jax.com/news/petition-grows-to-change-schools-name/-/475880/21767172/-/2kvbj8z/-/index.html

[copperfiend]

FCN posted a story about it on their Facebook page this morning. The comments are about as bad as you think they would be,

[NotNow]

Gee whiz, just change the name of the school to honor any of the recent hero veteran's from the area and be done with this mess.  Forrest will live on in the history books for gosh sake.

[sheclown]

Call it "forest for the trees"

as in...can't see.