Change Duval County to Jacksonville County? Why not, Jacksonville and Duval are

[Adam W]

Except for the Beaches, the city and county have been one since 1968, as well as the largest city in the lower 48.  If corruption hiding somewhere is a problem, changing the name of the county isn't going to fix that.  And conversely, if the problem exists, fixing it doesn't require a name change.

The City government and County government are merged, but there are communities that reside in Duval County and outside of the City of Jacksonville. The Beaches, yes, but don't forget Baldwin

I remember a few years back when there was a move to rename Jacksonville Beach as Pablo Beach (I believe it's a historic name). If I lived at the Beaches, I'd probably care.

But it's no biggie. I like the sound of "Duval County" though.

[Jax101]

The City government and County government are merged, but there are communities that reside in Duval County and outside of the City of Jacksonville. The Beaches, yes, but don't forget Baldwin

Baldwin isn't outside the city of Jacksonville, it is very much within, in fact, it is essentially a city within a city, not very common, there are only a few other examples of cities within cities, the Vatican in Rome being one.

[Adam W]

The City government and County government are merged, but there are communities that reside in Duval County and outside of the City of Jacksonville. The Beaches, yes, but don't forget Baldwin

Baldwin isn't outside the city of Jacksonville, it is very much within, in fact, it is essentially a city within a city, not very common, there are only a few other examples of cities within cities, the Vatican in Rome being one.

It very much exists outside the city of Jacksonville's boundaries. But my point was more that there are towns in Duval County that are not part of the City of Jacksonville. By definition, if a town is not covered by the jurisdiction of another town, it resides "outside" the other town, even if it's surrounded on all sides by the other town.

Cities (or towns) surrounded by other cities (or towns) are all that rare, are they?

[Anti redneck]

The beach communities once tried to secede and become Ocean County.

That actually has a nice ring to it. "We hail from Ocean County, Florida!"

I'm with SMoody....  DUUUUVALLLLL!!!!!

The tradition and history is more important.

Since when has Jacksonville cared about anything historic or meaningful?

[Jax101]

Cities (or towns) surrounded by other cities (or towns) are all that rare, are they?

Well, I did some research, apparently it is more common than I thought, still, it is by no means normal. Most major cities would have gobbled Baldwin up a long time ago, lol.

[Know Growth]

 Most major cities would have gobbled Baldwin up a long time ago, lol.
[/quote]

Baldwin,Beaches in fact resisted Consolidation move.
I don't recall the name right now,but there was a Beaches attorney,passed away recently,who was an ardent supporter of Beaches entity.

Come to think about it (or even if we dont),the areas that resisted consolidation morph represented a sizeable portion of the developed areas of the era.

There were failed attempts at Duval consolidation dating back to the 1920's or 30's.
The brilliance of the 1960's move attributed to certain brain storming meetings,though details are sparse.

[vicupstate]

Baldwin and all three Beaches are each Independent cities that exist in conjunction with the Consolidated City of Jacksonville.  That IS unique and is NOT the same thing as a city or town simply being 100% surrounded by a different city or town.  The latter situation exists in spades in South Florida for example.

Residents of AB, NB, JB or Baldwin pay taxes to the consolidated government AND to their town/city.  They also vote and can hold office in the consolidate government, as well as their respective town government.  For example, Jax Mayor John Delaney was a resident of Neptune Beach.  None of that occurs in a city that is simply surrounded geographically by another.

The respective independent cities supply certain services and the consolidated government provides others.  Taxes are paid based on the same.

The Beaches actually voted to APPROVE consolidation although Baldwin did not (but they could not prevent it from  occuring).  However, in the same election each of the four approved allowing their respective city to remain independent yet still a part of the consolidated city. 

[Ocklawaha]

City Jaguars.   

If we change Duval County to "Jacksonville County"... What on earth are we going to yell at the Jaguar games??

DUUUUUUUUVALLLLLLLL!!!!

How about GOOO JAGS!!!

And, if it's history you want to preserve, let's just deconsolidate and go back to being called Cowford, because change is always a bad thing, we don't want to look forward because it might mean we have to stop looking backward.

Seriously though, Jacksonville wouldn't be the only county with the same name as it's chief city, take Los Angeles county for example, or San Diego. Jacksonville is in a unique position where it extends to almost every square mile of it's particular county, and its city government administers for the entire county, there is no Duval County government outside of the consolidated city of Jacksonville.

Dumb idea, this would just further distance us from our history in a city that is already reckless with an iconic past. So reckless that our own scholars haven't a clue that the city was NEVER called Cowford! 

"The only thing new in the world is the history that you don't know." President, Harry S. Truman.

So here's the reason why we should NEVER - EVER consider such an idea.

Duval County, Florida. Established on August 12, 1822, Duval County was the fourth county named in the state. This document described how Duval County was named for William Pope Duval, the first territorial governor of Florida (1822-1834) who served twelve years.

Governor Duval, son of Revolutionary War hero Major William Duval, was born near Richmond, Virginia, on September 4, 1784. Governor Duval’s great-grandfather was Marin Duval, a Huguenot immigrant who settled in Maryland in 1643. Marin, built the first brick home in Richmond, Virgina. Marin’s young son, William Duval (Governor William Pope’s father), planted a oak tree on this site. It still stands today.

William had become known locally as a “unlucky boy” who was always getting into trouble. Since he was the youngest of the children, he was also considered the runt of the litter. The added pressure of being a hero’s son was too much to bare. Immediately following a childish prank gone wrong and a serious flogging he made up his mind to leave home. At age 14, William Pope Duval boldly told his father that he wanted to become a hunter and trapper in Kentucky. Since Kentucky was sparsely populated, hunting sounded attractive to many young men, including young William.

In order to appease his son’s nature, William’s father provided him with substantial funds for his travels but denied him the horse and servant, which William requested. In response to William’s request, he stated, “You will race the horse and break your neck and you will lose your servant!” Without horse or servant, he expected William to give up on his quest. However, William just packed and walked out. As his sister ran alongside him, she said, “Will I ever see you again.” His response is one for the history books, “I will return when I am a Congressman.”

The “unlucky boy” suddenly became lucky. By chance, William met one of Kentucky’s finest hunters out in the woods. He offered William room and board then trained him in the finer skill of hunting. Over the next year and a half, William honed his skills and became the type of hunter any Kentuckian would have been proud to hunt alongside.

Physically, he developed muscles and a tough demeaner. He was now a force to be reconned with around town.

Whether divine intervention or part of William’s larger plan, hunting was suddenly ignored, and studying law became his passion. It was written that when he put his mind to something, he focused harder than any human being and became so passionate about his mission that he would achieve his goal. At age 18, in 1804, he passed the Kentucky bar exam and began the practice of law. That same year, he married Nancy Hynes. They established a home and a law practice in Bardstown, Kentucky.

In 1812, when Indian attacks threatened local communities, William was given command of a mounted company of volunteers. His heroic actions along with his outstanding legal career endeared him to his new home state of Kentucky. In 1813, they elected him to represent their state in Congress. He had finally achieved the dream. After serving a full term and asking not be re-elected, he returned to Kentucky to his practice of law.

His next honored position came in 1821 when Florida became a U.S. Territory. He was asked to move to Florida and serve as its Northeast Florida Federal District Judge. In 1822, President James Monroe appointed him Governor of the newly-created state of Florida. He was so popular that he was reappointed by President John Quincy Adams and again by President Andrew Jackson, serving as Governor a total of twelve years. He established a record that no Florida Governor has surpassed.

His hunting skills in formidable years prepared him best for his negotiations with the Florida Seminole Indians. William became the “de facto” Indian negotiator in Florida. The Indians respected him for his peaceful dealings. William was not a push-over. Once when a senior Indian overstepped his bounds, William grabbed him by the throat in front of over 50 Indians, startling everyone in the room.

William was made bigger than life by authors. During his lifetime, those around him asked him to tell his tales of hunting in Kentucky and his stories of dealing with Indian Chiefs. Washington Irving took notes of his stories while riding in a stage coach with William from Virginia to Kentucky. Through the writings of author Washington Irving (regarding Ralph Ringwood aka William Pope Duval) and author James K. Paulding (regarding Nimrod Wildfire aka William Pope Duval) everyone in the nation read and knew something of Duval’s life experiences.

Washington Irving claimed that not one word about Duval was fictionalized by his writings. When visiting Tallahassee in 1827, Ralph Waldo Emerson described Duval in his notebook writing “Gov. Duval is the button on which all things are hung.”



Originally, state business was conducted half the year in St. Augustine and the other half in Pensacola. During his administration, William moved the state capital to Tallahassee, Florida. At first he ran the state from a log cabin, then finally built a two-story 40’ x 26’ masonry building in 1826. His plantation home sat overlooking the entire city of Tallahassee. Its 375 acres were later purchased and Florida A & M University moved to its property.

After leaving office in 1834, William practiced law in Tallahassee. In 1848, he closed his practice and moved to Texas to live near his son, Captain Burr Harrison Duval (i.e. Duval County, Texas).

Governor William Pope Duval died while on a trip to Washington, D.C., March 19, 1854. And that folks, is how we earned the name Duval County. We should all be proud.

History is the mirror that reflects who we are, and why.

WE ARE 'DUUUUUUVALLLLLLLL!

OCKLAWAHA

[BackinJax05]

They'd have to close the new courthouse for another six months to change the name.

Estimated cost to change the sign out front: $60 million.

That's too low of an estimate

[I-10east]

Hopefully this will be the last of the 'change' city/county threads (remember that other thread, the city's name is not 'sexy' enough). I hate it when cities rename streets, so why would I want to live in 'Jacksonville County' or the city of Duval? What's the next name change thread, the state? Country? *sigh*

[Ocklawaha]

Hopefully this will be the last of the 'change' city/county threads (remember that other thread, the city's name is not 'sexy' enough). I hate it when cities rename streets, so why would I want to live in 'Jacksonville County' or the city of Duval? What's the next name change thread, the state? Country? *sigh*

+100

These threads crop up from time to time, generally proving that there are some among us with absolutely no sense of PLACE. 'Duval,' is a strong historic reference about who we are and 'Jacksonville' says a lot about where we've been.

Imagine New Orleans wanting a fresher image and changing their name to 'New,' without the 'Orleans' the city would lose all sense of it's rich Creole history. How about St. Augustine? Hell let's just change the name to 'Augustines' so people around the the country will think it's a bikers bar. Of course with the recent proposal for Jaxiananmen Square, a sweltering 10 acres of bare concrete, changing our name to 'Nothingville' might be a better fit.

[Ocklawaha]

The City government and County government are merged, but there are communities that reside in Duval County and outside of the City of Jacksonville. The Beaches, yes, but don't forget Baldwin

Baldwin isn't outside the city of Jacksonville, it is very much within, in fact, it is essentially a city within a city, not very common, there are only a few other examples of cities within cities, the Vatican in Rome being one.

Actually this is quite common, one only has to go as far south as Orlando-Orange County, Florida to find land locked towns and cities. In the OKC area, Bethany, Woodlawn Park, Mustang, Edmond, Yukon, Del City, Choctaw, Moore, The Village, Nichols Hills and Newcastle are all in Baldwin's boat.

As a former city councilman of a small prairie town in OK, I can also tell you that contracting out police and fire are not at all uncommon. The smaller towns simply weight out the cost-benefit of investing in the buildings-personel and equipment of a police or fire department and make a decision. In our case we had our own Police, Fire, Rescue, Gas Utility and sometime in the fairly recent history had sold our own electric system (dumb mistake) before I came aboard. The Police department was small and mostly part-time, but our fire department was huge for the size of the town as we were contracted out to four county governments to aid in fighting prairie fires. So anything can be negotiated, mass transit, libraries, parks...etc. 


Bottom line? It's whatever you can do so the citizens get the most bang for their buck, and keeping Baldwin, Baldwin, means that sales tax revenues come back to BALDWIN to spend as they see fit.

OCKLAWAHA