Elements of Urbanism: Nashville

[Metro Jacksonville]

Elements of Urbanism: Nashville



Nashville has more things in common with Jacksonville than the average person may realize, but a struggling downtown isn't one of them.

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2009-jun-elements-of-urbanism-nashville

[ProjectMaximus]

nice pics. Did you ride on the Star, Ennis?

[Keith-N-Jax]

Yes very nice. Nice downtown pics. I wonder why cities similiar sizes or smaller seem to have together more than we do.

[BridgeTroll]

Looks like a great place to live.

[Wacca Pilatka]

Not to excuse Jacksonville's mistakes, but I'd say a big part of the reason Nashville has it more together than Jax does is the abundance of tourism.  In Charlotte's case I'd attribute it not only to a wise mayor in McCrory but to the strong influence of the banks headquartered there.  I often wonder if Jax wouldn't be closer to these peer cities from an urban planning perspective had Barnett managed to get on the ball more quickly re: acquiring out-of-state banks and had built a Wachovia or BB&T-level empire.  I have the book "Barnett: The Story of Florida's Bank" and in hindsight it's incredibly frustrating that opportunities were missed and Jax consequently lost the advantage of having a major bank headquartered there that was strongly committed to its community.

[Hurricane]

Wow, I never knew Nashville was so cool.  I love how even the TGI Fridays exterior looks like a local joint instead of the big box retail.  These photos should be a good guide to the construction and design community for examples, thanks!  One of the big problems with JAX is that we continue to grow out instead of up.  Hopefully, one day we grow up and then better things will follow?

[heights unknown]

What a beautiful City...clean, pristine, modern, bustling; Jacksonville could learn a lot from Nashville.  These two Cities appear to have a lot in common both now and in the past, but one of the Cities has overcome its obstacles while the other one (Jax) is still basically stuck.

Hope Gardens is what Springfield could be and the direction that it might be heading, and the Gulch is what our Port/Industrial District could become. 

It appears at one time Nashville was lacking, starving, and in despair just like Jacksonville basically is now, don't get me wrong, Jax is much better than a decade or more ago, but we have a long way to go.  Obviously City Leaders in Nashville have taken the initiative to think and focus much bigger than just within their city limits. 

Jax must learn to do this and make it come to fruition, if not, Jacksonville will remain stuck within its own City limits and will forever be known as the small town within a big City.

Heights Unknown

[Joe]

I agree, Nashville is a nice place, and it's way ahead of Jacksonville. I have nothing but positive things to say about the West End, the Gulch, the Music City Star, the farmers market, etc.

However, I'd be extremely careful about lauding Nashville's downtown entertainment district too much. It's a perfect example of a "retail facade" rather than a true functional core. While they have several amazing streets with vibrant activity - like Wacca Palatka just said - it's tourist oriented. It serves visitors and not residents. If you walk a couple blocks in any direction, you'll find a downtown with most of the same problems as Jacksonville.

For example, I recognize this corner very well. If you had turned around and taken another picture, we would have seen a surface parking lot with an ugly billboard, surrounded on the other three sides by ugly modernist government social services buildings with zero street interaction. Hard to imagine considering how pretty this looks - but true.

It would be dangerous to try and follow Nashville's example. Destination retail is great when it works, but not everywhere can make it succeed. (This was the type mistake that most cities made over the past couple of decades.) More often than not, you are left with empty entertainment districts without the population to sustain them.

Again, I really like Nashville a lot. In many other ways, it's a good example to follow. For example, the area around Vanderbilt is an awesome illustration of suburban chain stores that have been slowly retrofitted by an urban zoning overlay. It's really fantastic.

However, Jacksonville should not look to its entertainment district as a model. Nashville's retail is a tourist district supported by visitors that we simply don't have. As one of the most de-populated urban centers in the US, Jacksonville needs to focus revitilization on residents above all else. My two cents.  

[TPC]

A former co-worker of mine was from Nashville and he raved about it all the time. He used to play in some jam band their and said the music scene was amazing. So it got me thinking, since Jacksonville has a large population of jazz students, why don’t we have a stronger jazz presence in Jacksonville. Is it lack of venues, lack of desire to play? I know we just had the jazz fest and there are a few outdoor concerts, etc... I’m talking about walking downtown at night and hearing horns in the distance kind of vibe.

[Wacca Pilatka]

Didn't Nashville have a downtown shopping mall that failed in the 80s-90s, centered around a couple of the surviving downtown department stores (one was Castner-Knott and I forget the other(s))?  This was before tourists and residents started coming back downtown.  Nashville's downtown boom is a relatively recent phenomenon; even the tourist district looked pretty ragged and forgotten for a while, and at one point there was even talk of razing the Ryman Auditorium, which is mind-boggling to consider now.

[Deuce]

Looks like a great place to live. I can't believe you guys hadn't profiled Nashville yet.

[thelakelander]

For example, I recognize this corner very well. If you had turned around and taken another picture, we would have seen a surface parking lot with an ugly billboard, surrounded on the other three sides by ugly modernist government social services buildings with zero street interaction. Hard to imagine considering how pretty this looks - but true.

Under "Common Downtown Albatross," an abundance of surface parking is mentioned.  Here is a shot of the building in the image above from a different angle.



Nevertheless, I must admit that you can't find many lots in the downtown core that look like the image below.  Even the surface lots appear to be decently maintained.

It would be dangerous to try and follow Nashville's example. Destination retail is great when it works, but not everywhere can make it succeed. (This was the type mistake that most cities made over the past couple of decades.) More often than not, you are left with empty entertainment districts without the population to sustain them.

Nashville appears to be a city that built its tourism base by promoting its history and the music industry that sprouted up there.  From this angle, that is something Jacksonville should look into.  If you can promote and build on the things that make the region unique and special, other issues will be easier to address over time.

Again, I really like Nashville a lot. In many other ways, it's a good example to follow. For example, the area around Vanderbilt is an awesome illustration of suburban chain stores that have been slowly retrofitted by an urban zoning overlay. It's really fantastic.

My guess is that the Springfield Overlay will result in similar development.  3rd & Main is a good example of this.  A zoning overlay that reduces maximum building setback and off-street parking requirements should be developed for the entire urban core, imo.

However, Jacksonville should not look to its entertainment district as a model. Nashville's retail is a tourist district supported by visitors that we simply don't have. As one of the most de-populated urban centers in the US, Jacksonville needs to focus revitilization on residents above all else. My two cents.  

I agree.  However, what Jacksonville can take from Nashville's tourist district is "connectivity".  It works the way it does because a ton of complementing uses are lumped together in a compact setting.  Regardless of how we develop, complementing pedestrian friendly uses and structures should be clustered together to stimulate synergy in a compact setting.

[thelakelander]

A former co-worker of mine was from Nashville and he raved about it all the time. He used to play in some jam band their and said the music scene was amazing. So it got me thinking, since Jacksonville has a large population of jazz students, why don’t we have a stronger jazz presence in Jacksonville. Is it lack of venues, lack of desire to play? I know we just had the jazz fest and there are a few outdoor concerts, etc... I’m talking about walking downtown at night and hearing horns in the distance kind of vibe.

Good questions.  I've wondered for a while now why Jacksonville has been reluctant to promote its musical heritage on a much larger scale.  It seems like the ingredients are here, but they need to be better connected and clustered together.

[brainstormer]

I love Nashville!  Your pictures really capture a great deal of what I remember from the multiple times I have been there.  One of the things that Nashville has done well is clustering it's infill.  Along Broadway and around the Summit Center and the new Symphony Hall, there is hardly a vacant lot or large surface parking lot left.  Nashville also has had a great deal of residential infill within it's downtown area.  There are many buildings that have been built new, but instead of clearing the whole block, they restored the old buildings and then built the new to compliment the old.

Here are my urban core thoughts based on Nashville:
1.  Clustering is vital.  Let's take Bay Street and really focus on it.  Putting the Convention Center on the old courthouse site is a no-brainer!  Infusing hundreds of people a week into this part of downtown will bring the private developers.  We will have shops and restaurants in no time.
2.  Nashville's urban core is more square than Jacksonville's.  The river and FBC/State/Union make our downtown more lengthy and less walkable.  We have to find a way to make this less prohibitive, so we need streetcars or a skyway extension to connect the Times Union/Landing with the Memorial Arena.  Building the arena away from the core was really a huge mistake, so now we need to work on connecting it.  The Shipyards land is vital in this plan.  It has to become an extension of Bay Street with restaurants, shops, museums, a hotel, the docked ship and of course, more residential.
3.  Someday we can move the jail to Lavilla next to the courthouse and all of a sudden we have a government district!  Plus filling in the current jail site with perhaps office, residential, an urban Target and other retail would then create a happening Bay Street.  One long corridor of vibrant life that does not die at 6pm.
4.  What happens then once Bay street is all filled up?  The developers want in on the action, so they start building on Forsyth and then Adams and pretty soon wow!  Jacksonville has a happening urban core and is truly the New Bold City of the South.

Now I know you "Debbie Downers" will say, well the economy is bad and the city shouldn't be the one developing this land, the city is broke, I'm not paying any more fees, we have too much crime, blah, blah, blah.  The point of this is that all cities make public investments; a main library, a city hall, a courthouse, a convention center, a performance arena.  Brilliant cities will wisely plot and build these investments in certain parts of their cities, thus promoting and molding the city into what they want it to be.  Look at Jacksonville now.  

The Prime Osborn is 0.6 miles from the Omni and 1.0 miles from the Hyatt.
The Memorial Arena is 1.0 miles from the Hyatt and 1.1 miles from the Landing.
Metro Park is 0.9 miles from the bars on Bay Street with nothing in between.

This city has got to stop investing with small bubbles that can't be popped.  If I want to go to metro park, I drive, and when I leave, chances are since I'm already in my car I will go home or stop at a restaurant closer to my house.
If I am attending a function at the Prime Osborn and already paid for parking once, chances are I'm not going to drive downtown and eat.  If I'm going to a concert at Memorial Arena, I know it will cost me $5 to park and I don't want to have to pay to park at the Landing for dinner, so I will eat at my suburban chain.  We have to change our thinking and plan ahead for a better Jacksonville.  Funny how it was called a Better Jacksonville Plan, yet...well, I'll let that be for now.

[thelakelander]

Look at Jacksonville now. 

The Prime Osborn is 0.6 miles from the Omni and 1.0 miles from the Hyatt.
The Memorial Arena is 1.0 miles from the Hyatt and 1.1 miles from the Landing.
Metro Park is 0.9 miles from the bars on Bay Street with nothing in between.

This city has got to stop investing with small bubbles that can't be popped.  If I want to go to metro park, I drive, and when I leave, chances are since I'm already in my car I will go home or stop at a restaurant closer to my house.
If I am attending a function at the Prime Osborn and already paid for parking once, chances are I'm not going to drive downtown and eat.  If I'm going to a concert at Memorial Arena, I know it will cost me $5 to park and I don't want to have to pay to park at the Landing for dinner, so I will eat at my suburban chain.  We have to change our thinking and plan ahead for a better Jacksonville.  Funny how it was called a Better Jacksonville Plan, yet...well, I'll let that be for now.

Bravo! Great post, Brainstormer.