Artea at Southbank proposed

[Ken_FSU]

Apparently JTA prohibited any retail and restaurant use from this development?

Any idea why?

[thelakelander]

Who knows?! JTA does a lot of things in regards to transit that most of us will never understand. With that said, is retail required in developments in this area of the Southbank? I don't believe Broadstone has any either and if anything materializes at the District, it will be directly across the street.

[CityLife]

Prohibiting retail and dining there is a good move, imo. The market doesn't need to be oversaturated with those types of uses in scattered areas. Let them cluster together on the riverfront, in the District, Hendricks, and San Marco Square.

That's about the only positive thing I can say about JTA and DIA's involvement in the project.

[Ken_FSU]

Curious, with the apartment market as hot as it is right now, do you guys think we still need to be handing out millions in 15-20 year REV grants for new construction like this?

$6.3 million grant approved unanimously for this one.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/downtown-investment-authority-approves-dollar6-3-million-tax-incentive-for-artea-apartments

[MusicMan]

Can one of you ex-perts explain how this $6.3 milion grant actually impacts the developers bottom line/pocket book? I assume this is like a closing cost credit that pays out over several years. In other words, it's pure profit for the developer.....

[acme54321]

Big excavator sitting on the side of the road next to this parcel.  Looks like they had run it up into the cleared part of the site adjacent to the DCSB parking lot.  They had a drill rig out there a few months ago in the same area. I wonder if there are some environmental concerns on this site as it was used for heavy industry for a long time.

[acme54321]

Looks like this is happening, land clearing has begun.

[jaxlongtimer]

Big excavator sitting on the side of the road next to this parcel.  Looks like they had run it up into the cleared part of the site adjacent to the DCSB parking lot.  They had a drill rig out there a few months ago in the same area. I wonder if there are some environmental concerns on this site as it was used for heavy industry for a long time.

This site was a FEC rail yard supporting the riverfront shipyards, JEA power plant, etc. as I recall.  There were quite a few sidings fanning out over the property and running under I-95 (which is why so much of it is elevated today, I imagine).  Like most railroad properties, you can likely count on some level of contamination.

[acme54321]

Big excavator sitting on the side of the road next to this parcel.  Looks like they had run it up into the cleared part of the site adjacent to the DCSB parking lot.  They had a drill rig out there a few months ago in the same area. I wonder if there are some environmental concerns on this site as it was used for heavy industry for a long time.

This site was a FEC rail yard supporting the riverfront shipyards, JEA power plant, etc. as I recall.  There were quite a few sidings fanning out over the property and running under I-95 (which is why so much of it is elevated today, I imagine).  Like most railroad properties, you can likely count on some level of contamination.

Before construction of the St Johns River Bridge I believe the predecessor of the FEC had their main terminal and coaling dock where dcsb is today.

You should have smelled the dirt that they hauled off from the Broadstone site.  It has a nasty chemical/pesticide smell from 100' away.

[jaxlongtimer]

^ Lumber treated with now-banned creosote was used where pressure treated lumber is used today.  So, figure it would have been used on wharfs, pilings, decking, railroad ties, telephone poles and crossties, etc. extensively in this area when it was more industrial.  There is a good chance that is what you smelled as creosote has a distinctive odor.  It will also burn your skin if you handle it without protection.  There is at least one site in Jax that treated lumber with this stuff and it is now a Superfund site.  Nasty stuff, indeed.

[acme54321]

Nah, wasn't creosote, I'm familiar with that.  It smelled like the fertilized and pesticide section of a landscape store just much stronger.

[scbennett67@gmail.com]

https://youtu.be/oN-nuRd-lyg

[jaxjaguar]

It's crazy, to me, that Jax is still building these 3-4 floor suburban-footprint apartment complexes in the core.

Orlando has been on a seemingly unstoppable roll of constructing high-density buildings downtown since 2015. I feel like a broken record stating this, but Jax's Urban Development teams need to drive 2 hours south to see how to fill in surface lots with high-density buildings.

Some examples just from this year that are currently under construction / slated to start later this year:
1. Phase 1 of a 350', 462-unit residential building will be completed this fall. Phase 2 is starting soon and will boost the number to 707 units.
2. 444' Senior Living tower set to start construction in May.
3. 395' mixed-use building with 555 residential units set to start this fall.
4. 220' mixed-use building with 368 units expected to start construction q4 this year.
5. 230' residential tower with 182 units
4. 368-unit, 11-story apartment building just opened across from Lynx Station in December 2022

[marcuscnelson]

Seems to be something about the housing market or land values here. There have been, what, a handful of high rise residential projects even proposed downtown since the recession? And all of them have demanded extensive subsidies? Seems to be easy/cheap enough still to just assemble the land to spread apartments out instead of buying one parcel and building up.

[Steve]

It's because of what you can charge for rent.

Orlando Downtown: 1/1/746SqFt - $2528/month
Jacksonville Downtown (Southerly - build as 3 floors concrete with 5 floors of sticks): 1.1/704SqFt - $1891/month