Re-evaluating the Skyway

[thelakelander]

the key to an efficient urban transit system is as few transfers as possible. Expanding the skyway would be much better then adding "something else" (bus, streetcar, light rail).

I think the key is for transit to efficiently move people between high points of density and popular centralized destinations.  I can't think of one major city where transfers aren't required to get to various parts of the region.  As long as they are properly coordinated, transfers aren't a negative.  This is important, because the skyway is not set up to a regional wide transit system.   Its a downtown peoplemover.  The key element to its success is not extending it to Five Points, San Marco or the Stadium.  Its having a regional wide mass transit system that feeds riders into it. 

For example, Miami's Metromover attracts +30,000 riders a day because its connected to 94 miles of commuter and heavy rail, which directly connects downtown to the burbs and other inner city districts.

[alta]

Couldn't an extension be funded through a special tax district like Jackson Square?

[Ocklawaha]

Yes, Alta, it CAN. In fact DART in Dallas with their 1.something BILLION dollar expansion is using this as part of the package. A google search for the Carolton or North Carolton DART station renderings will feed the skyway about 100 pounds of great ideas.

As for TRANSFERS (the other question) I agree with Lake, as a transit guy, mix and matrix is what makes a true great transit system. choice + choices + express + local + quality + green + headways + connections + connectivity + speed etc... It's not about not making the transfer, rather it's more about choosing which one you want to use, where you want to stop and your trip purpose. Example if your going to do a real wipe out on Christmas shopping and don't want to fight the parking lots at the mall. Let's say you live in Springfield and want to shop the Avenues:

TODAY: you catch JTA to Rosa Parks then head to the Avenues. 4 bus fares - correct change only - driver collects - bus runs every 40 minutes.

FUTURE:

you catch JTA to Rosa Parks - transfer to free Skyway to San Marco/Atlantic - transfer to commuter rail - off at Avenues Station - ride the free shuttle around the mall district. (*most scenic route)

or

you catch the Commuter Train at Liberty Street or Shands Station, transfer to the St. Augustine Line at Union Terminal - off at Avenues Station - ride the free shuttle around the mall district. (*by far the most room for packages or bikes)

or

you catch the streetcar and decide to go direct to Gateway and check it out first! Then ride it all the way to Union Terminal - from Gateway Mall - transfer at Union Terminal for the St. Augustine Commuter Rail - off at Avenues station - ride the free shuttle around the mall district. (* perhaps the more nostalgic and 2nd most room for packages - most fun)

or

JTA to Rosa Parks - Skyway to San Marco/Atlantic - Transfer to one of the San Jose/JTB/Avenues BRT TROLLEY BUS routes - off at Avenues  - ride the free shuttle around the mall district. (* not much room but fast and frequent - clean and silent.)

This is how it should work, oh and I left off the regular city bus and water-ferrys.

OCKLAWAHA

[alta]

We need to get rid of our city leadership.  They are so backwards on urban issues.

[jeh1980]

We need to get rid of our city leadership.  They are so backwards on urban issues.

If we do that, what will it matter? I think that our city leadership need to have better ideas on how to improve the city's urban core.

[michelle]

This has probably already been asked, but is there a mall area that is bikeable from Springfield?  And when I say mall area, really any kind of large scale shopping that has lots of different things to offer such as clothing, shoes, etc.  Then, maybe those outlying area malls aren't necessary to those living downtown.  I think better  public transportation is really important though, it just usually takes awhile to implement.  

Can you take a bike on the skyway?

Is there bus service from downtown to the beach?

michelle

[thelakelander]

The closet mall to Springfield is Gateway (www.gatewaytownctr.com).  Its not the Avenues, but you'll find stores that carry the basics.  You can get there by taking Main or Pearl, north to 44th Street.  Then head west on 44th until it dead ends at Gateway.  Its probably somewhere around a two mile trip.

Can you take a bike on the skyway?

I don't think so.

Is there bus service from downtown to the beach?

Yes.

[Ocklawaha]

Can you take a bike on the skyway?

Is there bus service from downtown to the beach?

michelle

Q-1 - I don't see why not. You CAN take a power chair, wheel chair, shopping cart or baby buggy onboard, they have special entry gates for these items that would work just fine for bikes too. Use the elevators to the boarding level and off you go. Since there are seats only on the ends of the cars, it shouldn't be a problem - though I think staying off at rush hour might be more user friendly.

Q-2 - Yes, 3 types really. You can ride the regular beach routes, or the newer beach flyers that use freeways (BH-50) and have limited stops. Lastly there is a regular MOTOR COACH service (not a bus) that JTA runs mornings and evenings that is really top shelf - Tour Bus Style - Beaches Express.

OCKLAWAHA

[Coolyfett]

We need to get rid of our city leadership.  They are so backwards on urban issues.

If we do that, what will it matter? I think that our city leadership need to have better ideas on how to improve the city's urban core.

That's interesting. I think if enough of the LEADERS in office really wanted transit, transit would be in place already. Why would any of the leaders "naturally" want transit?

The LEADERS are the ones who wanted the Jaguars, of course any sports fan would approve but it took the Leaders wanting it for it to happen. Its been stated many times that Godbold was the "pusher" of the Skyway system. Whenever there is criticism for the Skyway we all look at Godbold and he "shrungs his shoulders" lol. The LEADERS have to want the Skyway to work for it to work. Pressure & promotion of the topic is going to help. Just swinging at JTA won't help I think city hall needs to take a few jabs as well. 

[Ocklawaha]

You are SO RIGHT, this time JTA is the hero of the hour and NOBODY IS WATCHING! The fact that it's never been finished, goes from no where to no where and they STILL manage to squeak out 2,000+ riders is mind numbing.

OCKLAWAHA

[Coolyfett]

Talk it up!! Maybe Ock & Lake can drop MORE knowledge!! Just doing my part lol.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/jacksonville/255575-why-not-skyway.html

[Bike Jax]

Can you take a bike on the skyway?
michelle

No Michelle you can not currently take bikes on the Skyway. There are meetings to change this however. JTA is using the tried and true "Safety and Liability concerns" as the reason why they are not allowed. And as already pointed out by Ocklawaha you can take everything but bikes on.

[Ocklawaha]

No Michelle you can not currently take bikes on the Skyway. There are meetings to change this however. JTA is using the tried and true "Safety and Liability concerns" as the reason why they are not allowed. And as already pointed out by Ocklawaha you can take everything but bikes on.

They really don't think people are going to peddle down the track do they? These type of rules are long ago outdated and need to be trashed - they are anti green and anti-transit.

OCKLAWAHA

[alta]

I thought they were allowed.  That is stupid.  Bikes are allowed on most transit systems.  There are restrictions which are mainly during peak operating hours.  This would only increase ridership on the Skyway. 

[Ocklawaha]

alta, this is something as a group we CAN take to JTA. I'll keep you posted.

OCKLAWAHA