Brooklyn 'Gentrification'

[FlaBoy]

I think a lot of anti-gentrificationers are typically the same individuals complaining about how terribly neglected a neighborhood is pre-gentrification.  Then someone does something about it other than just handing residents checks and it is like the world is imploding. 

Another point . . . I have lived in neighborhoods in other cities that were "transitioning neighborhoods."  People can be displaced in many different ways, it is not just the lower income residents being displaced in all cases.  Look at Harlem in New York, it was a largely Jewish neighborhood before it was largely wealthy African Americans, then it became more lower income African Americans, now more non-African Americans are moving in.  There are cycles.  Before the Jews it was the Dutch, etc.  Humboldt Park in Chicago used to be largely low income Irish, then it became largely Puerto Rican, when I lived there there were more whites moving back to the neighborhood and there were huge complaints about gentrification, but I'm willing to bet there were also huge complaints by the largely Irish population when the Puerto Ricans started moving in.  My grandma grew up on the west side of Detroit when it was considered nice.  They were displaced because of crime and the declining schools and decline in quality of life.  It's important to understand that neighborhoods often go through cycles and neighborhoods evolve.

It's difficult. But usually the difficulties are more for renters. For owners of homes in many places like Florida, it is mostly all good since property taxes are capped if in Homestead. If property taxes are too expensive, you will at least be compensated at a level much higher than you paid. I understand sentimental and cultural value is possibly lost at times, but as you mentioned, this is the evolution of time more than anything else. Likewise, in places like NYC, Boston, Washington DC, Chicago, etc, or any successful urban area is where we find the highest rents in the country.

[Tacachale]

Usually gentrification just means wealthier people moving into an area. Rising property values and displacement are often the results of that trend. In Jax, we haven't seen as much of the negative effects of gentrification yet, as it's only gotten to that level in a few areas.

More money is moving into Murray Hill, but I doubt that property values and rents are rising enough right now that people are being displaced, as there's still cheaper property. It could happen eventually. Similarly, in Riverside, I doubt there was much real displacement for many years, even though more and more middle and upper income folks were moving in. But it's definitely been happening the last few years, especially on what were previously poorer streets, as the properties start to fill up and values. And so a lot of people who can't find a home in (or afford) Riverside are going to Murray Hill and elsewhere.

[thelakelander]

http://www.governing.com/gov-data/jacksonville-gentrification-maps-demographic-data.html

According to this source, Jax has a gentrification rate of 16.2%. Cities above 45% include Atlanta, Seattle, Minneapolis, Washington and Portland. Cities with rates of 10% or below include Detroit, Cleveland, Memphis and El Paso.

http://www.governing.com/gov-data/census/gentrification-in-cities-governing-report.html#citieslist

Looking at their Jax map, urban core census tracts gentrifying since the 2000 census are located in Downtown, Murray Hill and Springfield.

[finehoe]

Looking at their Jax map, urban core census tracts gentrifying since the 2000 census are located in Downtown, Murray Hill and Springfield.

Interesting.  Downtown?  If newer, more affluent residents replace nobody, is that really gentrification? 

[thelakelander]

Downtown's primary census track goes west to Myrtle, includes public housing between State and Hogans Creek (between I-95 and Boulevard), LaVilla and a portion of the Cathedral District (much of which is senior housing). All of this low income residential would have been there in 2000.

In the last 15 years, new projects added include the Parks, 11 East, the Carling, Metropolitan Lofts, Berkman, Churchwell Lofts, Cityplace, etc. On the other hand, much of the low income residential that was still standing in LaVilla and west of I-95 has been demolished. Combined, that would probably have a significant impact on rise of housing value and displacement of the poor.

[finehoe]

^ As recently discussed in another thread, I suppose it all depends on what one thinks of as "downtown".

[thelakelander]

The census doesn't specify today's neighborhood boundaries, which have been altered for marketing purposes and artificial barriers added to the historic landscape. It only shows these areas by census tract. Thus, the DT census tract didn't split when I-95 was artificially carved through the middle of LaVilla.

[mtraininjax]

If newer, more affluent residents replace nobody, is that really gentrification?

Ghosts gotta go somewhere!

[ProjectMaximus]

As the home purchases grow, along with the densification of businesses along Edgewood and the buy-in difference from just being on the other side of US-17 from Riverside/Avondale, I'd say that we're right on the cusp of another gentrification upswing.

Currently stronger than Springfield because we don't have as much of the stigma that comes with that neighborhood, but I'd say that the Springfield potential is much greater due to the abundance of commercial availability and the potential to be denser with more multi-family entwined with the SFH.

Good take.

[ProjectMaximus]

I believe there's a difference between revitalization and gentrification. Is anyone being displaced in Murray Hill?

From personal experience, in the past 3 years our company has purchased over a dozen SFH in Murray Hill. All but three were vacant and unlivable. Those three had tenants in place, and those tenants remain today. So from our experience, nobody was displaced. (Obviously with the REOs somebody did move out at some point in time...)

[FlaBoy]

It is interesting but Riverside may have had more lower middle class white folks that have seen the area become too expensive as well in some ways or decided to flip in order to make money.

[mtraininjax]

lower middle class white folks

Median sales price of a home is $196,338 as of June 2016, and the average in Riverside is $246,250 YTD. I'd say lower middle class white folks were doing A-OK in Riverside so far this year. I'd hate to see the upper middle class...

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

lower middle class white folks

Median sales price of a home is $196,338 as of June 2016, and the average in Riverside is $246,250 YTD. I'd say lower middle class white folks were doing A-OK in Riverside so far this year. I'd hate to see the upper middle class...

Median sale price doesn't mean much without context.  What's the median ppsf?

[JaxAvondale]

I feel as there has been a lot of young people who rented in Riverside for years but couldn't afford Riverside. So, they are moving to MH. I'm very bullish on the direction of MH.

[Kerry]

Well just think, for every person moving into Brooklyn that raises property values, there is a suburban subdivision/apartment complex that is trending the other way.  I can rent a 4 bedroom house by River City Marketplace for $500/mo less than what I pay at 220 Riverside for a 2 bedroom, and Julington Creek isn't far behind.  No way I can afford a 4 bedroom in house in Riverside.