The Impossible Fight Against America's Stadiums

[finehoe]

Over the past 15 years, more than $12 billion in public money has been spent on privately owned stadiums. Between 1991 and 2010, 101 new stadiums were opened across the country; nearly all those projects were funded by taxpayers. The loans most often used to pay for stadium construction—a variety of tax-exempt municipal bonds—will cost the federal government at least $4 billion in taxpayer subsidies to bondholders. Stadiums are built with money borrowed today, against public money spent tomorrow, at the expense of taxes that will never be collected. Economists almost universally agree that publicly financed stadiums are bad investments, yet cities and states still race to the chance to unload the cash. What gives?

http://www.psmag.com/business-economics/the-shady-money-behind-americas-sports-stadiums

[JFman00]

Every time I raise this issue, the response is generally "but it'll work for us". Same thing for convention centers.

[fsquid]

Over the past 15 years, more than $12 billion in public money has been spent on privately owned stadiums. Between 1991 and 2010, 101 new stadiums were opened across the country; nearly all those projects were funded by taxpayers. The loans most often used to pay for stadium construction—a variety of tax-exempt municipal bonds—will cost the federal government at least $4 billion in taxpayer subsidies to bondholders. Stadiums are built with money borrowed today, against public money spent tomorrow, at the expense of taxes that will never be collected. Economists almost universally agree that publicly financed stadiums are bad investments, yet cities and states still race to the chance to unload the cash. What gives?

http://www.psmag.com/business-economics/the-shady-money-behind-americas-sports-stadiums

simple, no mayor in this country wants to be the one known for losing a NFL team.

[spuwho]

Over the past 15 years, more than $12 billion in public money has been spent on privately owned stadiums. Between 1991 and 2010, 101 new stadiums were opened across the country; nearly all those projects were funded by taxpayers. The loans most often used to pay for stadium construction—a variety of tax-exempt municipal bonds—will cost the federal government at least $4 billion in taxpayer subsidies to bondholders. Stadiums are built with money borrowed today, against public money spent tomorrow, at the expense of taxes that will never be collected. Economists almost universally agree that publicly financed stadiums are bad investments, yet cities and states still race to the chance to unload the cash. What gives?

http://www.psmag.com/business-economics/the-shady-money-behind-americas-sports-stadiums

simple, no mayor in this country wants to be the one known for losing a NFL team.

While NFL gets the largest benefit due to only hosting 10 games at the most annually, the issue on public funds in sports ventures transcends into other sports as well.

I have seen many minor league baseball teams wooed to a town by a new publically financed stadium. The scale is miniscule compared to most but the issue is the same.

The city of Schaumburg Illinois built a top shelf minor league stadium that sat empty for years until finally an Independent League team made a commitment.

The lure of bringing in new business is huge. Tax revenue from concessions and maintenance contracts and other spin offs is appealing.  TV revenue from advertising is a major component in some markets.

In some cases it might work. Some cases it doesnt.

The New York Yankees have owned their own stadium since 1929. But there are only 2 MLB Teams in the entire metropolis. The market scales well for them at 83 home games a year.

The NFL however does not scale at all in any metro area.

Jets and Giants have to share and it took New Jersey tax dollars to make it work. That was with 18 events a year.

So if 2 NFL teams in a market of the size of NYC has to get public dollars to make it happen, then you know the system is getting lopsided.

[spuwho]

I might add that St Louis County passed a referendum that any sports facility funding that requires tax dollars has to be put to a public vote.

If all large cities had the same level of accountability in funding models you would see the growth of building stafiums curbed.

[finehoe]

In some cases it might work. Some Most cases it doesnt.

FIFY 

[PeeJayEss]

WTF ever.  Do you KNOW how many major companies move here, solely because of the Jaguars and how much money the Jaguars are responsible for bringing to this city?!?  Without the video boards and the team, we'd be a step away from being a second world country.  This city would not exist if it weren't for the Jags.

This is why we NEED a sarcasm font!

[Adam White]

I believe Ed Austin was adamant that landing an NFL team would make Jacksonville a "first tier city". He'd have no reason to lie about that, either.

[CCMjax]

I believe Ed Austin was adamant that landing an NFL team would make Jacksonville a "first tier city". He'd have no reason to lie about that, either.

I certainly dont disagree that having an NFL franchise brings us some prestige.  However, it is empirically nowhere near what the sycophants would have us believe (just the other day Joe C on 1010XL (who is awful) was saying, "You just can't measure how much money this team has brought to this city.").  Also, great, let's have a franchise, just dont do it on my dime and at the expense of actual needed infrastructure, which should be a pretty unobjectionable idea.  But, try telling that to the "DURRRRRR! FOOTBAWL!!"  crowd.

Are you suggesting that an NFL team called the JACKSONVILLE Jaguars should be paid for entirely by private investors and no city tax money from which they are located?  Would they be the Everbank Jaguars or Florida Blue Jaguars, or perhaps the Shad Khan/Iguana Investment Jaguars?

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

WTF ever.  Do you KNOW how many major companies move here, solely because of the Jaguars and how much money the Jaguars are responsible for bringing to this city?!?  Without the video boards and the team, we'd be a step away from being a second world country.  This city would not exist if it weren't for the Jags.

This is why we NEED a sarcasm font!

Um.....  they installed the sarcasm font to the forum about 3 years ago.  This is it.  Nobody seems to use the regular font anymore.

[Adam White]

I believe Ed Austin was adamant that landing an NFL team would make Jacksonville a "first tier city". He'd have no reason to lie about that, either.

I certainly dont disagree that having an NFL franchise brings us some prestige.  However, it is empirically nowhere near what the sycophants would have us believe (just the other day Joe C on 1010XL (who is awful) was saying, "You just can't measure how much money this team has brought to this city.").  Also, great, let's have a franchise, just dont do it on my dime and at the expense of actual needed infrastructure, which should be a pretty unobjectionable idea.  But, try telling that to the "DURRRRRR! FOOTBAWL!!"  crowd.

Are you suggesting that an NFL team called the JACKSONVILLE Jaguars should be paid for entirely by private investors and no city tax money from which they are located?  Would they be the Everbank Jaguars or Florida Blue Jaguars, or perhaps the Shad Khan/Iguana Investment Jaguars?

Yes. They can call the team whatever the fuck they want - like the New England Patriots. Or to use soccer as an example - Celtic, Internazionale, etc.

[jaxjags]

It should be remembered that the stadium is owned by the city. If the team were to leave the physical assets of the stadium remain the ownership of the City of Jax. Stadium, scoreboards, pools, training facility, etc.

[jph]

Maybe if I change my nickname to "Jacksonville jph" on here I could score a few hundred thousand from the city. It's a bargain compared to some of these other guys running around using Jacksonville in their name.

[Adam White]

Maybe if I change my nickname to "Jacksonville jph" on here I could score a few hundred thousand from the city. It's a bargain compared to some of these other guys running around using Jacksonville in their name.

+1000

[Ocklawaha]

We may not have... or EVER reach that First Tier status, however, we are certainly among the top dogs in second or third tier cities in this country. Ask anyone from Orlando, Birmingham or Memphis what the one thing Jacksonville has that they'd sell a theme park for?  J A G U A R S !
It's a name, a history and a brand that is international. For all of our other weaknesses, this one certainly isn't the one to worry about.