Instead of Corporations, Why Not Invest in People?

[fsquid]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

Because 75k isnt that much money.  You can barely live as a single person on that much without going into debt constantly, much less raise a family.

You're delusional. 

That is all. 

[fsquid]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

Because 75k isnt that much money.  You can barely live as a single person on that much without going into debt constantly, much less raise a family.

really?  75k would be around $4800 a month take home (assuming some sort of health insurance being taken out).

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

yeah. really.

student loans - $400
car payments - $450
land taxes, mortgage - $1,500
utilities - $400
car insurance - $300
maintenance (varies, so we'll just stick to a tank of gas a week) - $260
tithing - yeah right
security alarm system leases - $30
cable, internet services and other telecom - $200

We're at $3,540/month to cover all of your 'necessary' (loosely) expenditures.  Still leaves about $400/wk as discretionary....   

So I'll restate:

You're delusional. 

That is all. 

[thelakelander]

Those little gremlins can eat up into your budget ... However, at $75k many can manage pretty well.  I guess it really depends on where you're coming from and what type of lifestyle are you willing to maintain.

[fsquid]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

Because 75k isnt that much money.  You can barely live as a single person on that much without going into debt constantly, much less raise a family.

really?  75k would be around $4800 a month take home (assuming some sort of health insurance being taken out).

yeah. really.

student loans, car payments, land taxes, mortgage, utilities, car payments, car insurance, maintenance, tithing, security alarm system leases and service, cable, internet services and other telecom,  travel expenses etc.  You can do it, but still people end up having to use credit cards from time to time.

travel expenses, alarm system, and cable are not "needs"

[thelakelander]

Neither are car payments and land taxes.  However, some people may have needs that aren't listed, such as medical or financial requirements like child support or alimony. Nevertheless, you can have someone living off $40k just fine and another about to file for bankruptcy despite making six figures.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

True, each situation is different.  But to even suggest that one can 'barely' live off of $75k/yr is a huge stretch.

[GoldenEst82]

How did the minimum wage discussion become about 75k a year?
I have never made more than 11.5k a year- working full time.
75k a year sounds down right lux.

Though, if my business were to flourish tomorrow and I made ^ that kind of money, I would still drive my 20 year old car, maybe upgrade to full coverage insurance.
I could afford health ins. (something I have not had since I was 21)
I could afford to save- for retirement, college for my boys, to go on a vaycay.
(Oh, lord- I needz a vaycay.)

There are very big differences between people who come from solidly middle/upper-middle class families, and those who grew up at or below the poverty line; when it comes to what is considered "living well" or being comfortable.
Which is really the goal, isn't it?

[thelakelander]

There are very big differences between people who come from solidly middle/upper-middle class families, and those who grew up at or below the poverty line; when it comes to what is considered "living well" or being comfortable.

Yes. I believe this shapes all of our perspectives in the discussion like this. I know I thought I was living large when I landed my first salaried job for $31,800. That was a far cry from the $4.50/hr I was making at Winn-Dixie at the age of 17. Lived just fine off of it too.  I rented a 2bd/1ba duplex a mile away from the job for $500/month and went to mom's house for every Sunday dinner.  With no college debt or credit card bills heading into that job, I was able to stack enough cash to buy a house a year later.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

yeah. really.

student loans - $400
car payments - $450
land taxes, mortgage - $1,500
utilities - $400
car insurance - $300
maintenance (varies, so we'll just stick to a tank of gas a week) - $260
tithing - yeah right
security alarm system leases - $30
cable, internet services and other telecom - $200

We're at $3,540/month to cover all of your 'necessary' (loosely) expenditures.  Still leaves about $400/wk as discretionary....   

So I'll restate:

You're delusional. 

That is all. 

So, do you eat?  Do you wash yourself?  Do you get to buy a book, go to a movie, go on a date?

Wear clothes?

and notice that if you pay tithes, that 400 a week disappears completely.

So the real problem here is that most people are delusional about how much money they actually need to 'survive' vs 'prosper'.

Now where in the above is there any room for saving for retirement?  Or do you just work for your entire life?

Sorry, but you are delusional and planning on your creditors and family absorbing your debts at your death if you think that 35k a year cuts it anymore.

So why don't I put this into more personal terms....

student loans - $0
car payments - $0
land taxes, mortgage - $789
utilities - $220
car insurance - $158
maintenance (varies, so we'll just stick to a tank of gas a week) - $350ish
tithing - yeah right (still)
security alarm system leases - $0
cable, internet services and other telecom - $140

Credit Card - Paid off monthly - $250ish

hell, just for arguments' sake:
Bold Bean - $100 (conservative estimate , but it's not all for me)


I'm at $2k/month in typical expenditures before eating, and I have ZERO issue living within my means and enjoying myself.  Does it mean that I can hop on a plane and fly out to Italy for a week?  Sure, but definitely not on a whim.

But that's OK.  I enjoy life, and really, isn't that all anyone's looking for?

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

anyone can be uneducated and bored out of their tits, nrw.  They can also live off their family when they are old and broke, and die gracelessly without a tooth in their heads because they lack dental or health care.

Its our natural state after all.

Minimum wage?  who needs minimum wage when you can die of old age at forty foraging for your food in the forest?

That is, if influenza doesnt take you out early.

But if you are living the modern life, you are either spending money or you are borrowing it.

I suppose.

Anyone can also enjoy life without the requirement of someone else to entertain them. 

Again, in discussions such as these, there's definitely no 'one-size-fits-all' approach.  Your needs are completely different than mine as are everyone else reading this. 

But to say that you can't enjoy yourself at $75k is, I feel, absolutely absurd. 

[carpnter]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

Because 75k isnt that much money.  You can barely live as a single person on that much without going into debt constantly, much less raise a family.

I know plenty of people with kids that get by on less than that and they do not use credit cards.  They have learned to live within their means. 

[JayBird]

I have employees who earn nearly double minimum wage, and still struggle sometimes. The actual minimum wage is so far below the reality of what's required to subsist its not even funny.

I know people that make 75k that are struggling, why, you'd have to ask them.

Because 75k isnt that much money.  You can barely live as a single person on that much without going into debt constantly, much less raise a family.

I know plenty of people with kids that get by on less than that and they do not use credit cards.  They have learned to live within their means.

And you know this because you are their accountant?

I can vouch for that, my current caseload is 117 families that have at least two kids, make no more than 30k combined total, and you know what ... They're happy for the most part. They can put food on their table, they may not go to a movie but they love going to parks or the beach, and they are happier than most of my coworkers are. I'm shocked at the disconnect here. Very eye opening. I guess if you don't have to live on tight budgets or work directly with those that do that you don't think it is possible. Thank you all for making me realize just how blessed I am to have the experience that they have taught me.

[JayBird]

happy is one thing. and that has nothing to do with money.

So very true, and then you go on to say why ppl confuse the two ...

Its not really that much money when you are trying to live without debt and still have the kind of lifestyle required by today's world.

Keeping up with Joneses' never makes you happy. I find people more apt to waste their money on useless junk when they make six figures. So I think there is a big deficit in financial education that should've been taught at home, by your parents, with your allowance or birthday money or paper run money (just my opinion). Of course, wars and recessions and hard times kind of force reality on all, so maybe the frivolousness of those during the late 90's early 2000's (myself included) may actually be dead and a new approach to thinking about fiscal responsibility is setting in.



And unfortunately the reality of the situation is that if you are making less than poverty line+50%, your chances of seeing 65 are very slim. If you do though, the government on both state and national level do have programs that would support you. Not much, but the life they've been accustomed to.

As for education, I actually like some of Florida's scholarship programs as long as you stay in state. Though many have been cut dramatically over the last few years it is more than many other states offer.

Can it be better? Of course, but the paradox is that it can always be better. The object is not to allow it to get any worse.