Millenials and money

[Captain Zissou]

At 26, I've got a pretty wide cross section of this generation in my life. About half of my close friends in town (age 26-32) have purchased a house. The bulk of the people that have bought (5) are single guys, but some married couples (3) are starting to buy as well. The ones who rent  cite not wanting the responsability and uncertainty in the future for why they still rent. Traveling is a big part of our lives, but nice cars are not. Two friends have recently bought new cars, but because their old cars were literally falling apart. The rest of us drive whatever we had when we got out of college. I don't know the full financial situations of my friends, but I'd say saving is not a priority.  To clarify, most of my friends aren't from here and the ones that are don't come from money.

[Tacachale]

For whatever reason, the media loves making the assumption that the experiences and interests of educated, well-to-do white collar professionals are representative of all people in the "millennial" age group. I call this the "Simms fallacy".

Obviously the guy from the article who went to Stanford and now makes $100k a year plus stock working for Google or Yelp or whatever is going to have a particular life experience. It will be different from the guy who heads to South Dakota to join a fracking outfit, the woman who joins the service to pay for college, the young immigrant couple who work multiple service industry jobs to support their family, or the thousands and thousands of people who get stuck a bunch of college debt who don't get a high paying job at Google. I don't think the Google guy really speaks for the whole generation.

Things that affect the whole generation will be major cultural trends and historical events like the wars or the Great Recession. For instance, it's clear that education is more valued now and more people are attending college than ever before. The recession has affected our generation in various ways, as it's harder to find work, forced many people to live with their families for longer periods, and made big purchases like homes and cars much less of a priority.

[CityLife]

http://upstart.bizjournals.com/money/loot/2013/08/06/what-losing-a-millennial-staffer-costs.html?ana=RSS

Here's another interesting article about millennials and our propensity to job hop.

Current data shows that more than 60 percent of Millennials leave their company in less than three years, faster than other employees by a 2 to 1 ratio.

This employee drain is destined to become a bigger problem since projections show that by 2014, Millennials will account for 36 percent of the American workforce and by 2025, that number balloons to 75 percent of the global workplace. Of those surveyed, 30 percent of companies have lost 15 percent or more of their Millennial employees in the past year, with at least 10 percent of the lost Millennial employees adding insult to injury by going to work for competitors.

The study also revealed that pay was a big issue for Millennials: Half of companies surveyed reported that the average salary for a millennial is between $30,000 and $50,000, while 15 percent of the companies revealed that the average salary for a millennial is $50,000 or greater.

[peestandingup]

For whatever reason, the media loves making the assumption that the experiences and interests of educated, well-to-do white collar professionals are representative of all people in the "millennial" age group. I call this the "Simms fallacy".

You mean to tell me not all millennials/Yers were born with a silver spoon in their mouths & were able to parlay that into getting their education paid for at the best schools, thus using those benefits/connections to ride their elitist rocketship towards a successful career? Is that what you're telling me?? GTF outta here!

Yeah, seriously. I think a lot of posters here aren't what I would call typical. And articles written from that perspective aren't based in any kind of reality. It's a small inner circle of these millennials/Yers writing these ra ra pieces from their sandboxed sense of being. It reeks of corporate-funded media propaganda really. All you have to do is look around & hang out outside those small circles to know its BS. Or, I dunno, read.

The New American Economy: 90% of new jobs since 2009 are part-time
http://p.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2013/aug/5/obama-economy-part-time-jobs-swamp-full-time-jobs/

Half of new graduates are jobless or underemployed
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-04-22/college-grads-jobless/54473426/1

Income Inequality Is At An All-Time High
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/14/income-inequality-is-at-a_n_259516.html

Wealth Inequality In America
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTj9AcwkaKM

So, the middle class is dying off (with the younger "middles" feeling a lot of the pinch since they're just starting out). The country is reverting back to the haves & the have-nots. With more & more people dropping into the latter group every single day. There is no answer for this in the traditional sense that led us to this point, besides creating some kind of new economy (which I think the millennials are doing).

And also, the younger gens aren't buying homes simply because the job market is so sucky that they have to remain loose & willing to move at the drop of a hat. Can't do that if you're tied down in a house somewhere in Bumblefuck Nowhere. Especially considering that that house is likely to go down further in value in the near future. Its a crapshoot that they aren't willing to play since it offers little benefits. Same as car ownership. Most I know are driving whatever they have until the wheels fall off. Or moving to cities where they have the option to forgo the car altogether & walk/use public transit/bike. This is the new future of America.

[ProjectMaximus]

I agree completely with everything you guys have said. I'm 29 and most of my friends are exactly as you guys describe, with the one exception being home purchases. I know lots of people who have purchased their own home, many who have purchased multiple properties. Most have lived in each home at the beginning, while view it as a longterm investment that they would probably hold onto even if they moved.

Are your friends buying homes comparable to their income/wealth? In my experiences, my friends are buying homes substantially lower than theirs or are choosing to rent in lieu of buying...though most live out of state in places they didn't grow up. I think this is due to the mobility thing and fear that the housing market still hasn't bottomed out. In the past you could buy a home and at at worst sell it at breakeven after a year or two. Nowadays if you have to move for a job, you may have to rent yours, take a loss, or just give it up.

In general I'd say that's correct. My friends are mostly not buying the most expensive places they can afford because these aren't intended as "dream homes." They are usually buying what they think is the best investment, which occasionally ends up being extravagant/pricey but usually is just a practical home in a strong location. 

I tend to find most of us put much greater emphasis on experiences, happiness and (as much as possible) savings/investments over materialism, so the purchase of materialistic items is often limited to things that will directly bring happiness, positive experiences and/or savings (which often includes owning a modest home)

[thelakelander]

http://upstart.bizjournals.com/money/loot/2013/08/06/what-losing-a-millennial-staffer-costs.html?ana=RSS

Here's another interesting article about millennials and our propensity to job hop.

Current data shows that more than 60 percent of Millennials leave their company in less than three years, faster than other employees by a 2 to 1 ratio.

This employee drain is destined to become a bigger problem since projections show that by 2014, Millennials will account for 36 percent of the American workforce and by 2025, that number balloons to 75 percent of the global workplace. Of those surveyed, 30 percent of companies have lost 15 percent or more of their Millennial employees in the past year, with at least 10 percent of the lost Millennial employees adding insult to injury by going to work for competitors.

The study also revealed that pay was a big issue for Millennials: Half of companies surveyed reported that the average salary for a millennial is between $30,000 and $50,000, while 15 percent of the companies revealed that the average salary for a millennial is $50,000 or greater.

I remember during the interview for my first job out of college, they were telling me how I would have the opportunity to work my way up through the system and one day become a partner in the firm.  However, in my head I was thinking,

"dude, all I could afford was ramen noodles to eat for the last six years. All I'm looking for is a decent paycheck, benefits and work experience. A couple of years tops in this place and I'm out!"

Looking back, I lasted two years before I quit to job hob. Great firm but it wasn't my dream to work for a single company for 30 years.

[JayBird]

For whatever reason, the media loves making the assumption that the experiences and interests of educated, well-to-do white collar professionals are representative of all people in the "millennial" age group. I call this the "Simms fallacy".

You mean to tell me not all millennials/Yers were born with a silver spoon in their mouths & were able to parlay that into getting their education paid for at the best schools, thus using those benefits/connections to ride their elitist rocketship towards a successful career? Is that what you're telling me?? GTF outta here!

Yeah, seriously. I think a lot of posters here aren't what I would call typical. And articles written from that perspective aren't based in any kind of reality. It's a small inner circle of these millennials/Yers writing these ra ra pieces from their sandboxed sense of being. It reeks of corporate-funded media propaganda really. All you have to do is look around & hang out outside those small circles to know its BS. Or, I dunno, read.

A little pent up frustration huh? Well that is normal I guess. I wonder what classifies a silver spoon in your mouth? Is there a certain demographic that fits, like upper middle class or a certain income level you must meet? Or is it the attitude that one possesses?

[FSBA]

I was at a mini-high school reunion the other weekend and had some interesting observations. Most of us graduated college sometime between fall 2007 and fall 2009, when shit just started to hit the fan.

Most decided to go to grad/law school or join the military rather than try to get a job. Of those who did look for work  alot of, "Worked with different temp companies/tried to teach myself programming/worked for the Census/etc" before landing a steady job within the last year.

I would say it was a 60/40 split between those who still rent(60) vs those who have bought something. If they did buy something it was usually a condo for under $50,000.

Most figure we'll never see a dime of social security. I agree.

When discussing TV shows, the most common comment was "Is it on Netflix?".

[peestandingup]

For whatever reason, the media loves making the assumption that the experiences and interests of educated, well-to-do white collar professionals are representative of all people in the "millennial" age group. I call this the "Simms fallacy".

You mean to tell me not all millennials/Yers were born with a silver spoon in their mouths & were able to parlay that into getting their education paid for at the best schools, thus using those benefits/connections to ride their elitist rocketship towards a successful career? Is that what you're telling me?? GTF outta here!

Yeah, seriously. I think a lot of posters here aren't what I would call typical. And articles written from that perspective aren't based in any kind of reality. It's a small inner circle of these millennials/Yers writing these ra ra pieces from their sandboxed sense of being. It reeks of corporate-funded media propaganda really. All you have to do is look around & hang out outside those small circles to know its BS. Or, I dunno, read.

A little pent up frustration huh? Well that is normal I guess. I wonder what classifies a silver spoon in your mouth? Is there a certain demographic that fits, like upper middle class or a certain income level you must meet? Or is it the attitude that one possesses?

Not really. We're doing quite well actually & have job security out the wazoo. One thing you'll learn about me if you ever get to know me is I'm a very "call it what it is" kind of guy & know bullshit when I see it. Doesn't necessarily mean I'm personally for or against something.

As far as the silver spoon comment, it basically boils down to those who not only came from money, but have a complete disconnect towards those who didn't & the world around them in general. Not their concern, sure. I get that. It just goes along with the territory. But they shouldn't be looking down their noses at people with that elitist attitude & wondering why they're not "trying harder" or some nonsense like that. They're obviously not part of the same club & didn't have the privilege of being born into it. Could they one day get there? Maybe. But that goal is becoming harder & harder to reach every day it would seem, esp for younger generations. But then, maybe the "goal" will end up becoming something different some day, or it means different things to different people. And that those who think the goal is to accumulate as much paper money as possible really are morally bankrupt.

But now we're getting into philosophical stuff.

[JayBird]

^thank your, I actually agree with that definition. Very spot on and true. However I will add that the bigger disconnect in reality is the little guy thinking he's being looked down on when he really isn't. At Catholic Charities I see it all the time, but that doesn't mean there aren't those whom think they are better than the rest of world. But I figure we all put our pants on one leg at a time, all will eventually perish and return to dust, and that Bill Gates is no different than the beggar on the corner. One just survives differently.

I will say that I don't think the article was pumping sunshine, remember who their target audience is. They aren't writing the column for the guy who is out there at 7am digging up a sewer line to fix a bad pipe. The audience they're writing to, and the audience that reads them the most, is the guy who reads it over coffee while waiting for a conference call to start or while getting his shoes shined in between meetings.

[CityLife]

Notice the guy in the original article had $40k of student debt? That's not exactly silver spoon type stuff....Like it or not, there are a lot of people in the Y generation that grew up very middle class or lower and are doing well for themselves. I mentioned in the first post that a lot of my friends are probably making closer to $200k, than $100k, but that is joint income for married couples. Maybe 1 or 2 of them come from upper middle class families, with the rest being middle class, and none of them got where they are due to family connections. Most of them went to FSU, which isn't an "elite" national school, but still decent (Top 100 nationally). Generally, one of the two has a good job making $80k+ and the other is doing decently. A few are doing very well, but none are pushing the 1% or anything. My single friends definitely live more interesting lives, but probably aren't doing as well without a dual income and stability, though one or two are doing surprisngly well given their lifestyle.

I'm an older Gen Y'er, so a lot of my friends had the benefit of starting their careers before the crash, but even my younger brothers friends in their mid 20's are doing well, and again they are mostly middle class kids. Myself and several friends finished grad school or law school post crash and are doing well, minus one. My brother in law just graduated from UNF and is killing it at 24. Point being, you don't have to be from a well off family to be successful... Does it help? Absolutely. Do you have to be to from a well off family to be successful? Absolutely not.

[JayBird]

Point being, you don't have to be from a well off family to be successful... Does it help? Absolutely. Do you have to be to from a well of family to be successful? Absolutely not.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[peestandingup]

Point being, you don't have to be from a well off family to be successful... Does it help? Absolutely. Do you have to be to from a well of family to be successful? Absolutely not.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Agree. I wasn't really talking about typical UofF /FSU state school students. Although there are elements of it there just like everywhere else. My wife used to teach at American University, adjuncted at GW. I have a lot of friends that went to both, including Georgetown as well. Good people, but they def have the disconnect I was referring to & it really is a different world. Many of them think they're the most important people in the universe, and being in the DC area just compounds that I believe. Like I said, I like them a lot & they're dear friends, its just kinda funny to me personally.

But really you could say that about all aspects of life, social statuses, classes, etc. It pretty much defines the world we live in.

[Traveller]

The spoons at GWU aren't made of silver.  They're platinum.  Some of them diamond encrusted.

[JayBird]

I will agree with the notion of Ivy League acting that way because all that I know from Yale and a few from Brown have that attitude. Surprisingly enough though they aren't the super successful, I guess because they never had to work too had for it they just maintain comfort, but could truly excel if they had the drive. Of course, I guess I cannot blame the individual, I believe those schools may teach them they're destined for greatness regardless of what they do. After all wasn't it a Harvard sociologist that started the movement of all participants get trophies? Too bad all adults don't get paychecks.