Hemming Plaza to be Destroyed?

[urbaknight]

I'm here in the main library right now. I personally haven't had many problems in Hemming plaza. I do have some in the rest of downtown though. It seems to either happen every time I turn a corner in a given day, or it doesn't happen at all. But if the homeless are the true issue, let's just find a way to get rid of them. I don't think they're any more of a problem than anywhere else. It's just perception combined with the lack of people and activity dt. I just think we should do whatever we can to change the situation.

[urbaknight]

And that's a real shame, we paid for those amenities with our taxes. Just because a a few "undesirables" are using them they cut them off! I have noticed the drinking fountains and the bathrooms on the riverwalk are nothing more than ornaments, to the untrained eye they look inviting enough, but they're just a farce and we paid to have them for public use. I think the city leaders owe the taxpayers a great deal more than they care allow. Maybe I'm lashing out unjustly at the homeless. But I think both parties are to blame, the city and the homeless.

[simms3]

simms where you at?

101 California

[simms3]

simms where you at?

101 California

I know you just got there and all, but you do realize that there are different districts in the city,

Are you working in the Financial District, Market Street, or the Tenderloin?

Side convo, 101 Cal is the curved glass building (johnson/burgee designed) near Embarcadero in the middle of the fin. district (5th highest in the city, my view is from 31st floor).  I have walked through the Tenderloin (during day and at night) and prefer to avoid it if humanly possible (the countless homeless there ARE sometimes *very* violent).  I stayed 1 block off of Market last night on 4th, where we own some property (3 buildings, including the Hotel Palomar at the corner of 4th and Market).  The rest of the week I will be staying at our corporate apt on the top floor of a high rise on Russian Hill.

[JayBird]

So I read the Downtown Jacksonville blog to find that they blame the revitalization of Hemming Plaza on the fact that the hardest part is attracting people to downtown.  Why not instead of trying to attract, they serve the people there already?  The Main Library has a steady stream of people coming and going, Chamblins Bookstore (my fave, even better than Strand Bookstore in NYC) attracts plenty, not to mention all those who work in the St James Building, First Baptist Church (only a block away), and the US Courthouse as well the new shiny courthouse for Duval County. 

So I say that to ask this, is it possible to have too many people in the kitchen?  You have Downtown Vision, the new DIA, City of Jacksonville Parks & Recreation Department, and a group of local business trying to keep away blight.  They are all going towards the same goal, but I wonder if they are on the same road ...

http://downtownjacksonville.org/blog/2012/11/06/small-ways-to-make-a-difference-in-hemming-plaza-picnic-in-the-plaza

[thelakelander]

So I read the Downtown Jacksonville blog to find that they blame the revitalization of Hemming Plaza on the fact that the hardest part is attracting people to downtown.

I'd disagree with this notion.  For example, does the Landing's courtyard struggle to find people to visit it?  Does the Northbank Riverwalk?  How about Memorial Park?  These places work because they either have uses in them that draw a diverse population or they have uses surrounding them that seamlessly integrate with them.  Dealing with Hemming really has nothing to do with getting a suburbanite to come downtown or increasing the Northbank's population to 5,000 people.

Hemming's problem is strictly an urban design and programming issue.  For example, the transition from retail/hotel use to government offices on the west/north sides of the park have created permanent dead zones that don't contribute to consistent foot traffic the space once enjoyed.  Furthermore, despite MOCA Jax and the library being across the street, there's really no connection in activity that extends or takes advantage of the park.  Something as simple as a small playground area catering to children and school groups visiting the library and museum would have a significant impact on the park's use.  The same goes for something as simple as rolling in a group of food trucks along the dead zones on a daily basis.  These things can happen literally overnight without increasing downtown's population first or bribing a suburbanite to come down for a few minutes.

[Mathew1056]

So I read the Downtown Jacksonville blog to find that they blame the revitalization of Hemming Plaza on the fact that the hardest part is attracting people to downtown.

I'd disagree with this notion.  For example, does the Landing's courtyard struggle to find people to visit it?  Does the Northbank Riverwalk?  How about Memorial Park?  These places work because they either have uses in them that draw a diverse population or they have uses surrounding them that seamlessly integrate with them.  Dealing with Hemming really has nothing to do with getting a suburbanite to come downtown or increasing the Northbank's population to 5,000 people.

Hemming's problem is strictly an urban design and programming issue.  For example, the transition from retail/hotel use to government offices on the west/north sides of the park have created permanent dead zones that don't contribute to consistent foot traffic the space once enjoyed.  Furthermore, despite MOCA Jax and the library being across the street, there's really no connection in activity that extends or takes advantage of the park.  Something as simple as a small playground area catering to children and school groups visiting the library and museum would have a significant impact on the park's use.  The same goes for something as simple as rolling in a group of food trucks along the dead zones on a daily basis.  These things can happen literally overnight without increasing downtown's population first or bribing a suburbanite to come down for a few minutes.

I agree 100% with the idea that Hemming Plaza struggles because the former retail properties have transitioned to government use. A person can easily imagine the differing intent and demographic of someone traveling to either of these two types of destinations. Someone making a trip to city hall is not necessarily planning on spending money in the Hemming Plaza area. If enough retail space existed around the park, and a critical mass of desirable stores anchor the location, a whole different kind of person makes the trip specifically to spend money locally.

I was recently questioned on the value of City Halls location in such a prominent spot with great retail potential. The questions made me think about the need to have city hall in such a structure. I guess it being located in a beautiful building, such as the St. James, portrays some kind of power. I can't help but think utilitarian and imagine the offices in the now empty Duval County Courthouse. Reestablishing the St. James building as a retail location would restore the plaza closer to its original character and function.

[kreger]

City Hall might as well move to the First Baptist Church.

[JayBird]

Good to hear that I wasn't the only one who thought this completely erroneous.  Bringing more retail into the immediate area would help, and yes Lake, I agree that more should more done to welcome those already there.  Put out some tables with umbrellas and chairs, set up a coffee stand/snack kiosk and people will get books from the library and enjoy them in the park.

[thelakelander]

people will get books from the library and enjoy them in the park.

Unfortunately, the only problem with the reading books in Hemming is that we built a similar environment within the library itself on the second floor.



We've basically cannibalized ourselves on that one.

[Noone]

Councilwoman Lee is the chair of the subcommittee that is looking at this issue. When is the next meeting? Has anyone contacted her?

[Lunican]

Inhospitable Park Bench of the Day: The Pay and Sit



http://vimeo.com/1665301

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/technology/2012/11/inhospitable-park-bench-day-pay-and-sit/3930/

[Ocklawaha]

Lunican, PLEASE don't give these  bubblehead, cretinous, imbecilic, ratbag, schnooks, any more great ideas! I have to admit though, that sharing this concept might allow us to screen the first candidates for a renewed American eugenics movement.

[Spence]

City Hall might as well move to the First Baptist Church.

LOLFOMCROTFLMFAO

[Cheshire Cat]

Here is Nevada's answer to a growing population of homeless mentally ill.  This has also been done to some degree here in Jacksonville in the past.  Our problem with this issue goes way beyond Hemming Park and engulfs the entire community.  Right now in Jacksonville our biggest mental health provider is the jail.  How very sad is that fact and the reality that people just don't seem to want to rally behind the needs of those with mental illness.  Believe you me I have been among those trying several times in the past.  Even tried to set up a program where groups could adopt a person in a sort of guardianship to at least make sure that they get into homeless shelters and get proper medication on time.  The result?   A lot of agreeing and not much action.  I wonder when will it be time to address this serious issue?  We have done nothing to address the situation since folks were release from closing institutions in the sixties. 

http://www.sacbee.com/2013/04/14/5340078/nevada-buses-hundreds-of-mentally.html?fish

Nevada buses hundreds of mentally ill patients to cities around country
By Cynthia Hubert, Phillip Reese and Jim Sanders
chubert@sacbee.com

Last Modified: Sunday, Apr. 14, 2013 - 7:58 am

Over the past five years, Nevada's primary state psychiatric hospital has put hundreds of mentally ill patients on Greyhound buses and sent them to cities and towns across America.

Since July 2008, Rawson-Neal Psychiatric Hospital in Las Vegas has transported more than 1,500 patients to other cities via Greyhound bus, sending at least one person to every state in the continental United States, according to a Bee review of bus receipts kept by Nevada's mental health division.

About a third of those patients were dispatched to California, including more than 200 to Los Angeles County, about 70 to San Diego County and 19 to the city of Sacramento.

In recent years, as Nevada has slashed funding for mental health services, the number of mentally ill patients being bused out of southern Nevada has steadily risen, growing 66 percent from 2009 to 2012. During that same period, the hospital has dispersed those patients to an ever-increasing number of states.

By last year, Rawson-Neal bused out patients at a pace of well over one per day, shipping nearly 400 patients to a total of 176 cities and 45 states across the nation.

Nevada's approach to dispatching mentally ill patients has come under scrutiny since one of its clients turned up suicidal and confused at a Sacramento homeless services complex. James Flavy Coy Brown, who is 48 and suffers from a variety of mood disorders including schizophrenia, was discharged in February from Rawson-Neal to a Greyhound bus for Sacramento, a place he had never visited and where he knew no one.

The hospital sent him on the 15-hour bus ride without making arrangements for his treatment or housing in California; he arrived in Sacramento out of medication and without identification or access to his Social Security payments. He wound up in the UC Davis Medical Center's emergency room, where he lingered for three days until social workers were able to find him temporary housing.