Elements of Urbanism: Denver

[Captain Zissou]

I don't know of any pedestrian bridge of that scale in Jax.

The Northbank Riverwalk has a fabulous pedestrian bridge, at least it did this weekend when I was walking on it.

You're right, but structural elements aside, I don't consider the bridge over the train tracks to be a very good example of a pedestrian bridge.  I know this isn't fair, but I was think something more along the lines of the bridge in London over the Thames.

[Adam W]

I don't know of any pedestrian bridge of that scale in Jax.

The Northbank Riverwalk has a fabulous pedestrian bridge, at least it did this weekend when I was walking on it.

You're right, but structural elements aside, I don't consider the bridge over the train tracks to be a very good example of a pedestrian bridge.  I know this isn't fair, but I was think something more along the lines of the bridge in London over the Thames.

This one?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Bridge_%28London%29

[Captain Zissou]

That's the one.  Again, not the most fair bridge to compare to Jax, but I'm sure Lake knows some from smaller markets.

[Adam W]

The bridge pictured in the Denver story reminds me of the artist's rendering of a pedestrian bridge in the story about Arlington that ran recently on the site. I think maybe that was a bridge over a busy road.

[JFman00]

Sundial Bridge

Redding, CA



Pedestrian and bike bridge.

[Adam W]

^Nice!

[CityLife]

Great article. I spend a week or so a year snowboarding in Colorado and stay with a friend in Denver for a few days when I'm there. Great city and only getting better. I know quite a few people who have moved out there and even more who want to. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that barring something crazy happening, Denver will be a major US city by about 2030 and by major I mean one of the great American cities (NYC, LA, Chicago, San Fran, Boston). Its quite simply one of the most livable places in the US due to the natural beauty and countless outdoor recreational opportunities. Not to mention great beer, good food, an educated/progressive population, and geographic advantages. Its about 800 miles to the nearest major city (Dallas) and there are very few mid level cities nearby either. This makes Denver the defacto regional office for a lot of companies, airlines, banks, etc. Its also the gateway to the millions of tourists who visit the mountains year round. DIA is the 11th busiest airport in the US. Point being Denver has a lot of advantages over Jax.

That said...like the article shows, we can learn a lot from Denver. FOR ONE, we can learn that breweries can create a great deal of vibrancy downtown. Wynkoop brewery was a major catalyst in the revitalization of LoDo back in 1988. It makes me sick to my stomach that the powers that be in this city are so blind that they can't see that Intuition would be a major spark downtown.

Unfortunately, I've gotta run, but I'll try to share more thoughts on Denver later.

[thelakelander]

It's also nice to see people actually riding buses. I know they get a bit of a bad rap on this forum sometimes and it's great to show how they can form part of a complete transit solution.

It doesn't have to be a buses OR rail conversation. It can (and should be) both.

Luckily this site has never promoted the elimination of bus service in favor of a rail only based mass transit system.  Any rail spine will only be as successful as the network of local bus lines that feed it.  However, when it comes to stimulating transit oriented development along transit corridors, you're not going to get that economic benefit with buses only.  That's a major point we try to stress here that most Jaxsons tend to overlook when discussing mass transit.

[JFman00]

It's also nice to see people actually riding buses. I know they get a bit of a bad rap on this forum sometimes and it's great to show how they can form part of a complete transit solution.

It doesn't have to be a buses OR rail conversation. It can (and should be) both.

Luckily this site has never promoted the elimination of bus service in favor of a rail only based mass transit system.  Any rail spine will only be as successful as the network of local bus lines that feed it.  However, when it comes to stimulating transit oriented development along transit corridors, you're not going to get that economic benefit with buses only.  That's a major point we try to stress here that most Jaxsons tend to overlook when discussing mass transit.

Pretty much the only time I ever use the bus is to get to/from fixed-rail stations. If there weren't buses, I wouldn't walk more than a half mile or so to get to/from a station (probably just drive direct to destination) and if there wasn't fixed-rail, I'd never get on a bus (cheaper to walk if it's close, easier to drive if it's not).

[thelakelander]

That's the one.  Again, not the most fair bridge to compare to Jax, but I'm sure Lake knows some from smaller markets.

Northbank Riverwalk (this is probably the best pedestrian bridge we have in town)


Some examples in other communities:

Greenville, SC


Milwaukee


Kansas City





Akron


Nashville


Providence


Hartford


Fort Wayne


Chattanooga


Jacksonville - would have made for a nice a pretty cool pedestrian/transit bridge or sculpture.

[Ocklawaha]

I don't know of any pedestrian bridge of that scale in Jax.

The Northbank Riverwalk has a fabulous pedestrian bridge, at least it did this weekend when I was walking on it.

You're right, but structural elements aside, I don't consider the bridge over the train tracks to be a very good example of a pedestrian bridge.  I know this isn't fair, but I was think something more along the lines of the bridge in London over the Thames.

Had to smile at this one Captain, the bridge in Denver IS over the railroad and light rail, in fact the photos of the multi-modal station area were taken from this same bridge. So if we are comparing apples to apples, our pedestrian bridge could be just a cool if we'd lose the chain link and go for a vinyl coated decorative material.  Jacksonville's failure in many of these areas is the exact attention to detail seen in the Denver piece.

Anyone recall the hanging baskets that DVI or some such agency placed around downtown? You can buy them at Wal-Mart and the flowers, unmaintained didn't fare too well in our summer heat. A quality nursery supplier could have helped not only with a better looking basket, but plants that could take the abuse of being over a steaming sidewalk. Denver has flowers hanging, in pots, balconies and anywhere else they could find a place to put them, but they are of a much grander scale, they scream beauty and attention.

[thelakelander]

^Somebody is definitely maintaining those, which is another huge problem we have locally.  I went to an Urban Core CPAC meeting today and someone referred to several Northside parks like J.P. Small Park as "Disney World-like" places, in terms of maintenance and upkeep.  While I agree that J.P. Small Park is one of Jax's better maintained parks, even it pales in comparison in terms of what most cities are doing with their parks these days. 

Quite frankly, what's shown in these Denver images looks pretty pristine to me.  Not only is there money and real design being thought into them, maintenance looks to be routine and up to snuff.

[simms3]

I can vouch that quite a few cities do plantings very well and maintain them.  There are examples in the South I dare not mention that at minimum rival Denver in this one regard.  Jacksonville actually has a great environment for potted plants and really should take advantage.  Some of the most beautiful gardens in the city belong to homeowners in the Ortega neighborhood, and these homeowners are able to grow beautiful tropical AND northern plants, along with roses, which simply can't be done in most of FL without incredible care/maintenance/skill.

The city should take advantage of its rather unique climate, but it doesn't. :\

Really with every one of these photo tours we are all able to pick out so many great ideas and things being implemented elsewhere with not one being implemented in Jacksonville.  Not one.  The city is literally not doing one thing right.  I sent that FBC YouTube video around to some folks this morning and inquired about the parking garage to one.  It's incredible how pervertedly backwards Jax is.  Why am I still hung up on it??

[Adam W]

It's also nice to see people actually riding buses. I know they get a bit of a bad rap on this forum sometimes and it's great to show how they can form part of a complete transit solution.

It doesn't have to be a buses OR rail conversation. It can (and should be) both.

Luckily this site has never promoted the elimination of bus service in favor of a rail only based mass transit system.  Any rail spine will only be as successful as the network of local bus lines that feed it.  However, when it comes to stimulating transit oriented development along transit corridors, you're not going to get that economic benefit with buses only.  That's a major point we try to stress here that most Jaxsons tend to overlook when discussing mass transit.

I know that and didn't mean to imply it was Metro Jacksonville's editorial stance. I was referring to people posting on the forum. And I was mainly referring to people like that guy in Tampa who seemed to think it had to be buses OR rail, but not both - as if you had to decide which one you wanted to use and then you were locked into that form of transit exclusively.

[Keith-N-Jax]

Some really nice photos!!