Live Blogging from the Rules Committee Meeting

[AshleyLauren]

We're here!!! Live from City Hall at the Rules Committee Meeting. Specifically, we are here to keep up with and bring you any new information about the bill 2012-296, the Anti-Discrimination Bill.

As you know, we were here for the City Council meeting, Tuesday, May 22, when what appeared to be the entire city of Jacksonville showed up to voice their opinion and hopefully sway the council in their favor. That night there was standing room only, a line out the door, and red stickers screaming "Yes!" for 296 everywhere; this morning, only about 60% of the chamber is full.

While waiting for the conversation we are here for, the council appears nice and comfortable on this beautiful Monday morning. Bill Bishop is the head of the Rules Committee, President Joost is in attendance, as well as:
Bill Bishop - Chair
John Crescimbeni - Vice Chair
Lori Boyer
Johnny Gaffney
Ray Holt
Matt Schellenberg
Clay Yarborough

As described on the COJ website, The Rules Committee focuses on Matters relating to confirmation of nominations by the Council, Mayor and Sheriff; rules; laws; executive communications; resolutions; memorials; calendar; agenda; charter revision; governmental reorganization; City Council and School Board redistricting; elections; courts; consumer affairs; "J-Bills" and legislation before the Florida Legislature; and all unclassified subjects.
The Rules Committee along with the RCD/PHS committee are the two committees the bill has been assigned to. It's part of the normal council process for bills to be "heard" in the committees they're assigned to. The RCD/PHS committee will meet tomorrow @2pm.
Bill Bishop just informed the chamber, "I understand a lot of people are here to talk about 296, but since we have to be done with all of our business by 1pm we will be discussing that at the end."

[jim minion]

Still with us?

[Jimmy]

Much discussion about the Hallmark Properties development in Brooklyn.

296 should be next...

[AshleyLauren]

Ha, Thanks Jimmy. I was about to type, "a lot of talk about permits, phase 1B, phase this, phase that, money, maintenance, construction...."

Jimmy's answer is a lot better.

Room appears to be getting restless, lots of people walking in and out, small chatter, lots of people on their cell phones, I see one woman reading her kindle and another taking a nap. Other stickers are making appearances, one says, "Protect First Liberties' and their are 7 or 8 people in the back with shirts imprinted with "NO prayer in School?" on the front and on the back there is another "NO" but I cannot see the bottom line, I think it says "NO sex in the city". So far, only men in suits at the podium.

[Jimmy]

Yeah, on the back it says "NO sex in the city." The people with those shirts are being organized, as it were, by CW Daniels.

[CharleyNovember]

I'm pretty sure there is a lot of prayer or the screaming of a deities name during sex...not sure about the "in school" part though..

[AshleyLauren]

Warren Jones, CCM, takes the stage claiming this bill has been demonized. He claims he understands how dehumanizing discrimination can be, reminisces about Jacksonville when segregation was at its highest and claims many still have the perception that Jacksonville is a racist town, and our goal is to give assistance towards this particular aggrievance.  It does not allow same sex marriage and it does not clarify or justify any questions about morality. He asks for the rest of the council join him.

This bill does not give individuals the right to go to court over such a grievance, but it does allow individuals to take any case or grievance to the Human Rights Commission. 

Yarborough would like to know why the bill will apply to businesses with 15 employees or more only. Joost replies 15 is the number of employees set forth in the federal standard. Yarborough, "I appreciate that" but about 90% of our businesses have 15 or less. Can we not change that to cover most of our businesses? Do we have that ability? Yarborough asks Jones to change the number to apply to more of our businesses. Jones replies he would rather comply with federal standards. Yarborough claims he cannot support it the way it is written right now.

[AshleyLauren]

Crescimbeni states, he might be receptive to the change but it should be changed overall. He asks, what will the religious exemption add language that religious organizations including churches, mosques, hospitals owned by a religious organization, will be exempt from this bill. A little unclear if that was the actual answer. They moved on quickly.

Schellenberg: Would St. Vincents be exempted from this bill?? Margaret Sidman cannot speak specifically to the structure of St. Vincents but it will be tied under the FL statutes protection. Schellenberg: "You're right it's not very clear."

Jones says, the General Council office drafted this particular bill and have been working on it for months.  Jones defers to Delaney: Equality Florida working with other cities in the state. Delaney lists Jimmy, Audre Moran, himself, his chief of staff all were a part of writing the bill. Delaney says it was the equality group for the state that brought it to Delaney's attention that sexual orientation was not protected. Schellenberg: "You knew but didn't feel it was necessary to do something about this until this particular group came to you, even though you knew about it?"
Delaney, claims that is untrue and he personally took strides to see this bill added to UNF's regulations, and it was unanimously agreed upon and implemented.

[AshleyLauren]

Kim Daniels: From my understanding, anyone can sue anyone so how can you say people will not be able to sue based on this bill? "Im a little uncomfortable with the HR commission, are you comfortable having someone else make decisions other than the HR commision?" Jones: HR Commission is the only department set up to take care of these particular situations and the only ones with experience. Daniels: Responds bashing HR commission stating they do not have experience or simply put, she thinks they do not know what they are doing.

Daniels wants to know why the bill does not cover religious orientation. She is worried about the wording and feels it is not ready.

Yarborough: Brings Stemberger up, the lawyer from Orlando that spoke against the bill on May 22nd. Stated it will undermined marriage laws. "these ordinance will be used to undermine marriage amendments both state and federal around the country."  ***JIMMY you want to elaborate on the points he makes?? A little to much legal jargon so I fear I will get it wrong.

[Timkin]

 

Daniels wants to know why the bill does not cover religious orientation. She is worried about the wording and feels it is not ready.

She does not want this bill passed. Period.  She will put up every roadblock she possibly can.

[AshleyLauren]

Stremberger defers to another man I did not catch his name Ganner?, The most difficult part of this bill is to answer how does an employer defend themselves against people claiming protection under this ordinance. Yarborough questions a memorandum discussing the illegal problems with an ordinance like this one. Addresses, these ordinance will discriminate against more people than they protect, because of the subjective standards used. He claims land owners, business owners should not have to live in fear. These laws, this ordinance will in fact create bias and discrimination not help weaken it. The memorandum states this ordinance is unconstitutional and a direct attack on first amendment rights.

Bennett Brown: Banker focused on small business: His bank has 47 employees. Most small businesses in Jax will be against this. Constraints should not be increased but decreased.

Crescimbeni is cracking me up. He clearly did not  have his morning coffee, but at least he isn't taking anyone's crap. Do you think at any point in Jacksonville people were not able to rent property based on nationality, i.e. African, Italian?? Yes, that definitely happened. So, you think we should go rip all of those amendments out?? No, I don't, umm, eh, uh.............that's a good point. The problem with this particular classification is not to refute their individual experiences. But in attempting to address those issues it goes too far in restricting free speech of the effected business owners which directly affects their first amendment rights.

[AshleyLauren]

How much does this religious exemption really exempt people of religion? (Daniels)

Gander? Ganner? Churches are fully exempt. However, it gets tricky when referring to the religious organizations such as a food bank, homeless shelter, not for profit hospitals.

Speaks of a counselor in Georgia, that respectfully deterred a member of the LGTB community to another counselor because of her own personal religious/moral beliefs. In return the member turned around and sued the counselor under the protection of the Human Rights Ordinance and that counselor was fired and her license withdrawn.

Reveals privately owned religious schools which receive any money from, ANY MONEY AT ALL, the state would lose their private rights, that could even be in the form of a scholarship.


Kim Daniels is appalled and upset that this group of people is even being compared to what she and all African Americans have been throughout history.
Sorry, was trying to complete thoughts. Daniels asked will 296 directly affect businesses in Jacksonville. His answer, unequivocally, YES!

[Purplebike]

Was / is this open to the public?

Does anyone know if there is some resource out there that lists when and where each city government event is occurring? I looked on the City of Jacksonville site and cannot find anything. Perhaps I have overlooked something.

Thanks!

[AshleyLauren]

The next speaker, points out based on Federal law, this changes nothing for employers, because it states under federal law that discrimination based on gender, non-conformity with gender stereotypes is illegal. Studies show, in cities that have adopted this ordinance have not seen an increase in legal action taken against employers based on sexual orientation discrimination.

Jones: The affects this will have on religion?

Three arguments against segregation: If you give blacks equal rights you will promote racial mixing.


Bishop...Time is up!! We will pick up where we left off!!

Crescimbeni: Proposes we set up a time with zero time limits to discuss this bill as it is unfair to the individuals that keep coming down here to discuss or stand in support of their side.

[TheCat]

Was Yarborough saying the number of employees for a business to have this bill applied to them should be decreased to something less than 15? Meaning, the bill should broaden it's reach?