Occupy Wall Street Movement: An American Spring

[FayeforCure]

I agree with Mr Johnson...

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/10/02/bets_robert_johnson_to_obama_stop_attacking_the_wealthy.html

BET founder Robert Johnson on the "FOX News Sunday" program: "Well, I think the president has to recalibrate his message. You don't get people to like you by attacking them or demeaning their success. You know, I grew up in a family of 10 kids, first one to go to college, and I've earned my success. I've earned my right to fly private if I choose to do so.

"And by attacking me it is not going to convince me that I should take a bigger hit because I happen to be wealthy. You know, it is the old -- I think Ted and Fred and I we both sort of take the old Ethel Merman approach to life. I've tried poor and I tried rich and I like rich better. It doesn't mean that I am a bad guy.

"I didn't go in to business to create a public policy success for either party, Republican or Democrat. I went in business to create jobs and opportunity, create opportunity, create value for myself and my investors. And that's what the president should be praising, not demagoguing us simply because Warren Buffet says he pays more than his secretary. He should pay the secretary more and she will pay more."

LOL how sexist........when did "the secretary" become a female?

And in true "anecdotal fashion" of Republicans, they will find one exception to the rule and hold it out for the rest of us.

In this anecdotal case the success ratio was one in 10 children, when the nation's success ratio is more like one in 100 million people to have the great fortune of becoming part of the uber-rich.

Besides like you said there are different versions of the rich, but increasingly CEOs have become targets as a growing source of income inequality:



How is this justified in this supposed land of equal opportunity?

lol... probably a racist too huh Faye...  Onward with your class warfare.  It is too bad you cannot see that this anecdotal example should serve as an example of what people in this country CAN DO...

Yup, we can also buy a lottery ticket LOL

As an economist I'm looking at the efficient use of time in order to maximize my chances for success 

Remember I already tried it the pre-scribed way, and the young folks are smart enough to see the non-success of their parents...........so they don't need to even bother to try to get on:

 

[BridgeTroll]

Very good find Stephen.  Couldn't agree more.  But lets put it into context shall we?  Reagan wanted to lower rates across the board and simplify the tax code eliminating loopholes. (created BTW by the leadership and approval of both parties)  The elimination of loopholes and decreased tax rates were designed to spur growth. (Which they did)  Mr Obama wants to close loopholes AND increase rates. (spurring growth??)

On a side... the zombie makeup and costumes of the protesters were awesome...

So why are you defending the tax loopholes, Bridge Troll?

The wealthy are using a tax loophole that taxes 15% of capital gains vs 32 % for income.  They are paying half their fair share by simply calling their personal profits a capital gain instead of an income.  And yet here you are defending their ridiculously transparent loophole.

You are well aware that I have been in favor of tax code simplification for a looong time.  This includes closing loopholes.  Get rid of all the special favors and loopholes.  Lets get a list of allllllll of em and find out who voted for em... throw the bums out... and simplify the tax code.

[FayeforCure]

Lets get a list of allllllll of em and find out who voted for em... throw the bums out... and simplify the tax code.

You can't vote them out. They are entrenched by BIG Money interests. You don't know the stats?

95% of incumbents get re-elected!!

[Lunican]

I'm enjoying Simms Stephen Colbert-esque satire.

[peestandingup]

Bottom line is these kids are hypocritical idiots in almost every way, and yes - they ARE lazy bums.  They should be ashamed of themselves.  Get a job and keep a job, anything, for a little while, pay your dues and earn your way through society first, and then if you happen to be wronged en masse, and you know exactly who wronged you and how, THEN complain.  Wall St did nothing that was not first regulated or signed off by your favorite politicians.  Most Americans can see at this point that our politicians are the biggest crooks and liers, but these kids have no experience and no gut feel and don't even see the obvious at this point.  They are SHEEP, even with their $200K college degrees!

No, these young folks are well aware of the corporate socialism that the governmental crooks and liers are maintaining.

Why should they do as I did...........believe in the "hard work will get you there" ethos, only to find out it was a crock.

I'm glad they are no longer fooled by the carrot that is more the exception than the rule.

They have watched their parents struggle and get nowhere..........THAT is NOT the future they want for themselves.

You too haven't made it there either yet, and may never get there.............it still remains to be seen.

Certainly working for peanuts many, many hours a week, while laudable isn't exactly "making it"

Besides we can't all be engineers, doctors and lawyers!

That land of opportunity isn't real, if only .0000001 % of people feel they have any chance of "making it," despite their inhumane efforts.

Exactly. No offense to him, he's done a lot & tried very hard, but Simms is still VERY young & has a VERY long way to go. I love that he's fresh outta college (which is still basically a kid. again, no offense) & trying to tell adults (who been through a lot more than he has) how it is. Not everyone has the time (or money) to wine & dine with big wigs making connections all over town all day long to simply get an interview. Some have bigger life responsibilities.

Simms, you seem like a good guy, but come back in 10 years after you've been married, had a kid or two, and had some REAL responsibility. Then you'll have a better understanding of what everyone is talking about. Wait until you get sick, or your kid does, or you have to send them to expensive private school (because the public ones are so shitty nowadays), or you try to start a life with your significant other, buy a modest house & with no warning the markets collapses on top of you. Oh, then your company downsizes & you either get less pay or get laid off altogether.

I know it seems like the world is your oyster right now (we all felt that way at your age more or less), but slow your roll & learn to look at things objectively & through a wider lens. But you've already made up your mind that you know what's up, so I'm not sure we can tell you anything more.

Anyways, can we get back on topic? This isn't a left or right issue. And its not a lazy hippie issue either. CLEARLY there's a problem with our country (we've had ZERO job creation in the last decade compared to the last six decades. not to mention housing, our debt & everything else falling apart). I personally don't give 2 shits who started some kind of movement, as long as it started.

[Doctor_K]

Lets get a list of allllllll of em and find out who voted for em... throw the bums out... and simplify the tax code.

You can't vote them out. They are entrenched by BIG Money interests. You don't know the stats?

95% of incumbents get re-elected!!

Isn't that the responsibility of the electorate?  Is it "Big Money's" fault that the majority of the people either a) don't vote, or b) aren't educating themselves on the candidates/issues?

[peestandingup]

Lets get a list of allllllll of em and find out who voted for em... throw the bums out... and simplify the tax code.

You can't vote them out. They are entrenched by BIG Money interests. You don't know the stats?

95% of incumbents get re-elected!!

Isn't that the responsibility of the electorate?  Is it "Big Money's" fault that the majority of the people either a) don't vote, or b) aren't educating themselves on the candidates/issues?

Not when those candidates are backed by huge mega corporate interests & their campaign dollars flows through them like diarrhea through a buffalo. And don't forget the mainstream media pumping out their favorites over the airwaves 24/7.

The system has it set up to where it LOOKS like we have choices. In reality, we don't. We only have what we're given.

[Doctor_K]

Lets get a list of allllllll of em and find out who voted for em... throw the bums out... and simplify the tax code.

You can't vote them out. They are entrenched by BIG Money interests. You don't know the stats?

95% of incumbents get re-elected!!

Isn't that the responsibility of the electorate?  Is it "Big Money's" fault that the majority of the people either a) don't vote, or b) aren't educating themselves on the candidates/issues?

Not when those candidates are backed by huge mega corporate interests & their campaign dollars flows through them like diarrhea through a buffalo. And don't forget the mainstream media pumping out their favorites over the airwaves 24/7.

The system has it set up to where it LOOKS like we have choices. In reality, we don't. We only have what we're given.

Horse hockey.  In fact, the more I hear/see a candidate's ad, the less likely I am to vote for him/her due to overkill.  It works both ways, and I still have a choice.

[RiversideLoki]

So, apparently the Occupy Jacksonville thing is supposed to happen saturday. I'm all for it and I know I've been negative about the whole thing. But isn't there a better time to protest? I mean, Zombie Walk is Saturday. And really the only other people downtown are people going to Chamblin's and MOCA. Not exactly their target democraphic, eh?

[peestandingup]

So, apparently the Occupy Jacksonville thing is supposed to happen saturday. I'm all for it and I know I've been negative about the whole thing. But isn't there a better time to protest? I mean, Zombie Walk is Saturday. And really the only other people downtown are people going to Chamblin's and MOCA. Not exactly their target democraphic, eh?

If its anything like the others, that's just the launch of it & it'll be everyday after that. "Occupy".

[RiversideLoki]

You overestimate the will and drive of the citizens of Jacksonville. Or maybe I'm underestimating. I hope I'm underestimating.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

http://occupyjax.forumotion.com/t28-formal-press-release#59

Formal Press Release
by Evey Today at 10:59 am

.Here is what I propose be our formal press release:

Hundreds from across Florida will assemble in downtown Jacksonville to hold the first Jacksonville General Assembly in response to the Occupy Wall Street movement in New York City. As a leaderless organization, Occupy Jacksonville seeks to establish a permanent presence in the First Coast area.

At Hemming Plaza, 135 Monroe Street West, crowds will gather at noon to discuss issues, peacefully protest corporate greed and political corruption, and march Saturday, October 8th at 2:00 p.m. The People of Occupy Jacksonville are not governed by any one individual or group, but instead use the General Assembly forumâ€"established by Spaniards earlier in the year and imitated by the Occupy Wall Street protestorsâ€"to create a symposium through which general consensus can develop. The first Jacksonville General Assembly will act as a “Town Hall” forum for debate, dialogue and dissent amongst Floridians who identify the modern economic climate as a key component to national and global unrest.

With 1% of the population overseeing nearly 40% of the nation’s assets, and with economic decisions in Washington D.C. and on Wall Street hindering progress in every sector across the nation, many are in agreement that something needs to change. However, politicians in both major parties continue to side with financially prosperous individuals and corporations at the expense of the other 99% of the population. Those include people of all political, religious, socioeconomic, racial and educational backgrounds. The Jacksonville General Assembly, in solidarity with the New York General Assembly and others across the nation, seeks to address these issues by hearing from all perspectives indiscriminately and forming a united response agreed upon by the entire collective.

Occupy Jacksonville wants to stress its nonviolent approach to societal conversation. Though many individuals will come together from their diverse traditions to protest and march in solidarity, the Jacksonville General Assembly will act as the cornerstone upon which the needs of the 99% will be cautiously built. The collective as a whole is its own spokesperson; no individual opinion represents the consensus of the Jacksonville General Assembly.

All are welcome. None will be turned away. Nonviolence is paramount

[peestandingup]

You overestimate the will and drive of the citizens of Jacksonville. Or maybe I'm underestimating. I hope I'm underestimating.

You could be right. It would be sad if it wasn't a true occupation & they just met for one day & that was it.

I'd like to think a city of this size wouldn't do that, but you never know. Hell, in my home state of Kentucky they've been at it since last week in Lexington every single day (Louisville's started today & has a pretty big crowd). Lex has got probably a quarter of the population that we have here. But like you said, this is Jax.

[FayeforCure]

You overestimate the will and drive of the citizens of Jacksonville. Or maybe I'm underestimating. I hope I'm underestimating.

You could be right. It would be sad if it wasn't a true occupation & they just met for one day & that was it.

I'd like to think a city of this size wouldn't do that, but you never know. Hell, in my home state of Kentucky they've been at it since last week in Lexington every single day (Louisville's started today & has a pretty big crowd). Lex has got probably a quarter of the population that we have here. But like you said, this is Jax.

Well, I think I couldn't have said it better than this quote (even though it was said in 2010). It sums things up exactly the way I feel it, and the reality is that it's quite simple and applies to most (99%) of us:

Robert L. BorosageCampaign for America's Future :


Alan Simpson is entertaining but clueless. Most Americans have already “sacrificed,” working longer hours for less, with declining wages and growing insecurity. Meanwhile 40% of all income gains over the last generation went to the wealthiest 1% of Americans. We suffer the most people in poverty since the Census Bureau began keeping records.

So Simpson, comfortably cushioned by his Senate pension and personal fortune, begins by cutting Social Security benefits, raising retirement age, and forcing retirees to pick up more costs of health care. Why not a surcharge on the wealthy, a financial transaction tax, at least start by sending the bill for the mess to those who caused it and who benefited from a multi-billion taxpayer bailout.

Most Americans haven’t shared the benefits of growth and didn’t pocket the benefits of the hyper-speculation that blew up the deficits and debt, or get rescued by taxpayers for their folly. Why in the devil should they share in the sacrifice?

http://www.politico.com/arena/archive/dadt-not-dead-yet.html

I think that awareness is spreading...............I used to lament that I sounded just like any other older generation person saying that things were better in the past..............and that the young folks had gradually become accustomed to being ripped off by their banks and just disd't know any better............and that that's why there was such apathy among the young.

I am pleasantly surprised to see the smartness with which OccupyWallStreet is approaching the insideous problem that has grown over the past 3 decades!

As has been said before:

So far, the Occupy Wall Street movement has found success with what it has self-consciously learned from the Arab Spring. OWS leaders have put technology to work in the cause of direct action, leaderless organisation and the creative expression of persistent critiques.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/ana-marie-cox-blog/2011/oct/04/occupy-wall-street-protesters

[FayeforCure]

from the bondage of the corporatists that rule America and have sucked the life blood out of the middle class, destroying what used to be the cornerstone of America:


Lawrence Lessig.

Roy L. Furman Professor of Law, Harvard Law School.



GET UPDATES FROM Lawrence Lessig

#OccupyWallSt, Then #OccupyKSt, Then #OccupyMainSt

Posted: 10/5/11 05:48 AM ET

It is way too early, and perhaps even a bit crazy, to see an American Spring in the growing protests on Wall Street. Yet. But there is no doubt that if there is one place in America that these protests should begin, it is there, and it is now.

Writers by the dozen have lamented the influence that Wall Street exercised over Washington throughout the 1990s, leading up to the great collapse of 2008. A multi-billion dollar lobbying campaign, tied to hundreds of millions in campaign contributions, got Washington to erase its regulations and withdraw its regulators. One statistic summarizes it all: in 1980, close to 100 percent of the financial instruments traded in the market were subject to New Deal exchange-based regulations; by 2008, 90 percent were exempted from those regulations, effectively free of any regulatory oversight.

But there is nothing at all surprising in that story. The spirit of the times was deregulation. The ideology of Democrats and Republicans alike was regulatory retreat. No one should be surprised, however much we should lament, that politicians did what the zeitgeist said: go home -- especially when they were given first class tickets for the ride.

What is surprising -- indeed, terrifying, given what it says about this democracy -- is what happened after the collapse. That even after the worst financial crises in 80 years, and even after the lions share of responsibility for that crisis had been linked to finance laissez faire, and even after the dean of finance laissez faire, the great Alan Greenspan, expressly confessed that it was wrong, and that he "made a mistake," nothing changed. A president elected with the spirit of Louis Brandeis ("[We have to stop] Wall Street from taking enormous risks with 'other people's money'"), who promised to "take up that fight" "to change the way Washington works," ("for far too long, through both Democratic and Republican administrations, Washington has allowed Wall Street to use lobbyists and campaign contributions to rig the system and get its way, no matter what it costs ordinary Americans"), and who was handed a crisis (read: opportunity) and a supermajority in Congress to make real change, did nothing about this root to our financial collapse. The "financial reform bill" is the reason the English language invented the scare quote: As every financial analyst not dependent upon the corruption that is Wall Street has screamed since the bill was passed, financial reform changed nothing. We are more at risk of a major financial collapse today than we were a decade ago. And the absolutely obscene bonuses of an industry that pays twice its pretax profits in salaries are even more secure today.

How could this possibly be? Never in the history of this nation have the agents of financial collapse so effectively avoided a regulatory response to that collapse. How is it that now they have not only avoided reform, but have effectively cemented their Ponzi scheme into the core of American law?

The protesters #occupy(ing)WallSt are looking for answers to that question. They should look no further than the dollar bills that they are taping to their mouths. The root to this pathology is not hard to see. The cure is not hard to imagine. The difficult task -- and at times, it seems, impossibly difficult task -- is to imagine how that cure might be brought about.

The arrest of hundreds of tired and unwashed kids, denied the freedom of a bullhorn, and the right to protest on public streets, may well be the first real green-shoots of this, the American spring. And if nurtured right, it could well begin real change.

In my book, Republic, Lost: How Money Corrupts Congress--and a Plan to Stop It-- published today by Twelve, I spend hundreds of pages trying to make clear what should be obvious to every single protester shivering in a Wall Street doorway. But the whole point of the book could be captured in the single quote that I stole from Thoreau right at a start: "there are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil, to one who is striking at the root."

These protesters should see that they are that one striking at the root. They should understand that our system has been corrupted by money -- even if the Supreme Court refuses to call it "corruption," and even if political scientists are unsure about whether their regressions can show it. And they should recognize that until this root is hacked, the weeds of this corruption will continue to destroy this democracy, and this nation.

Now conservatives are eager to insist that our framers didn't give us a "democracy." They gave us, they say, "a Republic." And so they did. A Republic -- by which the framers meant, as Federalist 10 makes clear, a "representative democracy." By which the framers expected, as Federalist 52 makes clear, a Congress "dependent upon the People alone."

But ours is not a Congress "dependent upon the People alone" -- or even mainly. It has instead allowed a different dependency to grow within its midst: a dependency upon the Funders of its campaigns. And so great is that different and conflicting dependency that even the worst financial crisis in three generations can't break their obsession with the fix. Neither party dares to cross Wall Street, since both parties know they could not win control of Congress or the White House without Wall Street's money. So they feed the addiction, and ignore the real work that they should be doing.

#OccupyWallSt needs to teach America this lesson. It needs to speak to the wide range of citizens who believe it. You don't have to be a Marxist to rally against the corruption that is our Congress. You don't have to be Dr. Pangloss to believe that people who don't share common ends might nonetheless have a common enemy.

This corruption is our common enemy. So let this protest first #OccupyWallSt, and then #OccupyKSt. And then let the anger and outrage that it has made clear lead many more Americans to #OccupyMainSt, and reclaim this republic.

For if done right, this movement just may have that potential. What the protesters are saying is true: Wall Street's money has corrupted this democracy. What they are demanding is right: An end to that corruption. And as Flickr feeds and tweets awaken a slumbering giant, the People, the justice in this, yet another American revolution, could well become overwhelming, and finally have an effect.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lawrence-lessig/occupywallst-then-occupyk_b_995547.html