Occupy Wall Street Movement: An American Spring

[mtraininjax]

Its pretty easy to talk Simms if you've got a fairly safe job that can actually pay the bills & you've been lucky enough to avoid the system chewing you up & spitting you out in some way over Wall Street shenanigans & other factors that are out of your control. And how long exactly have you & your super-friends (who are all apparently bulletproof) been out of college? Because its a totally different game now my friend. Imagine going through the last 4-6 years, getting out in this climate & there not being a thing available anywhere for you in your field, or even Mickey D's for that matter

I don't know if you or the people you are generalizing as not having work for 4-6 years are even looking for work. There are jobs out there, all you need to do is go speak with a recruiter, there are lots of jobs out there. Sadly many people give up, live on the government and use the emergency room as their version of free healthcare. Not saying you are, but if we are discussing generalization, many people abuse the system and poo poo the fact that they cannot find "their perfect job", well keep looking, this is the land of opportunity and yours, mine, everyone's is out there and available, you just have to look and ask others to help you look. If I can help you find a job, just ask.

[FayeforCure]

Its pretty easy to talk Simms if you've got a fairly safe job that can actually pay the bills & you've been lucky enough to avoid the system chewing you up & spitting you out in some way over Wall Street shenanigans & other factors that are out of your control. And how long exactly have you & your super-friends (who are all apparently bulletproof) been out of college? Because its a totally different game now my friend. Imagine going through the last 4-6 years, getting out in this climate & there not being a thing available anywhere for you in your field, or even Mickey D's for that matter

I don't know if you or the people you are generalizing as not having work for 4-6 years are even looking for work. There are jobs out there, all you need to do is go speak with a recruiter, there are lots of jobs out there. Sadly many people give up, live on the government and use the emergency room as their version of free healthcare. Not saying you are, but if we are discussing generalization, many people abuse the system and poo poo the fact that they cannot find "their perfect job", well keep looking, this is the land of opportunity and yours, mine, everyone's is out there and available, you just have to look and ask others to help you look. If I can help you find a job, just ask.

mtraininjax, have you tried the ER recently for cancer treatment? Has anyone you know been successful at receiving cancer teatment in the ER?

The law requires ERs to stabilize you and then send you on your way.

So no immediate threat of death and you are out of the ER tout suite. So where is that Free Healthcare Republicans so like to speak of?

Live on the government? Do you know anyone "living on the government"?

The US safety net is laughable in comparison to the European safety net. If anyone wants to live on the government I'd advise them to move to Europe as there is nothing to be had in the US. In the US they'd rather have you die than receive any social security at all! Plain and simple. Just applying for foodstamps because your minimum wage income isn't a "liveable wage," will make you be treated like a criminal in the US.

It is a very sick society.

But hey we have mtraininjax on our side. Yay!!!!

Let me know how many of the folks on this website you've been able to help...........remember to steer away from those with chronic illnesses as employers will not want them!

http://wearethe99percent.tumblr.com/

I'm eagerly awaiting your magnificent results.........

[simms3]

Its pretty easy to talk Simms if you've got a fairly safe job that can actually pay the bills & you've been lucky enough to avoid the system chewing you up & spitting you out in some way over Wall Street shenanigans & other factors that are out of your control. And how long exactly have you & your super-friends (who are all apparently bulletproof) been out of college? Because its a totally different game now my friend. Imagine going through the last 4-6 years, getting out in this climate & there not being a thing available anywhere for you in your field, or even Mickey D's for that matter.

I just hope your position doesn't dissolve away, or get shipped overseas, or that you don't get seriously ill & be socked with insane medical bills that no human being could ever pay off. I'd sure hate the thought of you having to go down there with all of those smelly hippies.

I graduated in December.  I spent the majority of my last 12 months in college taking out various people for coffee or lunch, joining professional organizations to network and learn, getting licensed and tested, going to recruitment events, etc etc and making friends with my professors.  I worked my butt off, and it paid off and I got a job.  It is not the highest paying for me, but I learn more each day than I could ever learn anywhere else from the team of 4 that I work with.  There is nobody else in the south doing what we do.  I am merely an intern filling the role of a much more experienced analyst (and believe me when I say I was nil experienced just a few months ago).  In my intern title, I still work upwards of 70 hours a week, and I am still at my desk as I type now.  Now I am getting potential offers from other companies (you can't get a job until you have a job).

How did I land the job that I did with the company that I did with the individual team that I did in a city where the real estate industry is about as blue blooded and tight knitted as it is?  I networked for years like a mother flipper and I still do.  I spent $100 to go to a party this past weekend, thereby nearly bankrupting me, but I met up with some folks who work for this German fund based here, and by the end I was told to email my resume.  If it pans out, I spent $100 and overcame some nerves in order to make a decent salary with benefits and work for one of the most reputable developers in the world.  I don't expect it to pan out (though I always go in with that attitude that it will).

The reason why I don't know anyone who hasn't found a job yet, at least from my college, is because nobody at my college is a political science major or sociology major or studying to be a journalist.  No offense to these majors, but I doubt they are half as difficult to complete and earn as an engineering degree, a pre-med/biology track, or a finance degree, especially at an already notoriously difficult school like Tech.  If you worked that hard to get through Tech in one of those fields, you were either automatically picked up because recruiters and companies know what you had been through, or you continued working out of habit to get that first job (i.e. what I did).  I did not go to school to learn political crap or about human behavior or fairness, etc.  I went first as an engineer, and later as a finance major, and so all I cared about was using my brain and working hard.  In fact I was literally taught how grueling the real world is.  I felt prepared.  I was taught nothing is fair.  I was taught to network.  I was made to speak and join in lively dialogue at b-school events.  The atmosphere attempted to replicate a corporate environment with an option to strike out on one's own should that desire burn at some point, and I think the school did a decent job at both (preparing for corporate world, which is all about stepping on someone's throat or having your own stepped on all the while working on diverse teams, and learning about entrepreneurship).

In my sidelife I still find myself working.  I am working on a couple of side projects with some folks.  I am working to keep my apartment clean and pay the bills and maintain my life.  I get paid very little, yet somehow manage to pay my taxes and fees and utilities (2nd highest water bills in the country up here and very high taxes and fees, and not to mention state income tax).  I still manage to pay my $1600/mo rent (that's relatively cheap for Midtown, where I live, considering one bedrooms in a newer building are starting at $2900).  I still manage to make my appointments and pay my medical bills.  On that note, I have an incurable disease.  I have labs done every couple months and I pay thousands a year for medicine, with insurance.  I don't party often.  I don't go out to eat in all the fancy restaurants I can walk to.  I don't stock my fridge with beer or expensive liquors.  I really have nothing left to save, but I still manage to do that.  I have no debt.  Oh, and on top of that I participate in my company's community service outings, and before work I was already volunteering at a men's home.  That I picked up from my high school, which I am grateful for.

Because of all of this, I am not humble.  I am very prideful.  I am boastful and not ashamed to be (my confidence has worked for me so far).  I have absolutely no chip on my shoulder and I despise more than anything in the world those who do.  My attitude is tough, but it has to be.  I hope that some people reading this realize that anyone can make anything work.  In this economy, as long as you aren't expecting entitlements and as long as you aren't expecting a $70K starting salary (divide that in half and then subtract some and that's where I am), you should be able to maintain a decent, hard-working, prideful existence.  That is why I have little if any respect for these granola munchers camping out doing nothing to get a job.  That is why it is tough for me to see so many people going out to expensive clubs on the weekends when I know they aren't working for what they have.

Not to mention these granola crunchers no nothing of what they speak.  They are all repeating talking points.  My work is tied with Wall St as much as anything can be.  I can go on about that, but bottom line is I am more pissed at this administration and perhaps even the Fed than I am with Wall St (my company is a Wall St type company actually, so there ya go...Morgan Stanley and UBS are also in my building and Merrill Lynch is a block down).

[simms3]

Faye,

I have an incurable chronic illness.  It has not stopped me from anything, nor does my employer even know about it.

The ER is far from free, but if you want to see how nicely the government safety net works in this country, just come up to Atlanta.  You'll see thousands of government employees with no qualifications whatsoever everywhere, driving nice cars (many with rims!), going to clubs, sippin on the bubbly, shopping at Lenox, etc.  This has to be one of the most entitled cities in the country (we are the city with the first projects after all!), and it shows!  I can tell you even with South Atlanta, Fulton County's median household income is $93K!!!  Archer Western gets $300M highway repaving contracts whenever it wants.  The various levels of government occupy 11 million SF downtown alone!  Sometimes I get a parking ticket from not one, not two, but 3 city parking employees who just walk around arrogantly giving tickets (you think parking in DT Jax is bad???).  They all manage to have nice hair weaves and extensions, nice nails, smart phones, etc.  They only got the job because of patronage!

How is all of that funded?  45 mil property tax (down from 74...it is what 16,17 in Jax?), fees like you would not believe, 8% sales tax, 6% state income tax, the list goes on.  It's hard to believe that compared to IL, CA, and NY we aren't even considered a high tax state, but we aren't.

Believe me, come to Atlanta.  Go to NYC.  Go to Chicago.  Go to Albany.  In all of these places you will see TONS of people who rely on the government, either through entitlements and "safety nets" or flat out on the payroll, and you will be JEALOUS of how well they do and what they are able to buy with all of their cash!

[FayeforCure]

Its pretty easy to talk Simms if you've got a fairly safe job that can actually pay the bills & you've been lucky enough to avoid the system chewing you up & spitting you out in some way over Wall Street shenanigans & other factors that are out of your control. And how long exactly have you & your super-friends (who are all apparently bulletproof) been out of college? Because its a totally different game now my friend. Imagine going through the last 4-6 years, getting out in this climate & there not being a thing available anywhere for you in your field, or even Mickey D's for that matter.

I just hope your position doesn't dissolve away, or get shipped overseas, or that you don't get seriously ill & be socked with insane medical bills that no human being could ever pay off. I'd sure hate the thought of you having to go down there with all of those smelly hippies.

I graduated in December.  I spent the majority of my last 12 months in college taking out various people for coffee or lunch, joining professional organizations to network and learn, getting licensed and tested, going to recruitment events, etc etc and making friends with my professors.  I worked my butt off, and it paid off and I got a job.  It is not the highest paying for me, but I learn more each day than I could ever learn anywhere else from the team of 4 that I work with.  There is nobody else in the south doing what we do.  I am merely an intern filling the role of a much more experienced analyst (and believe me when I say I was nil experienced just a few months ago).  In my intern title, I still work upwards of 70 hours a week, and I am still at my desk as I type now.  Now I am getting potential offers from other companies (you can't get a job until you have a job).

How did I land the job that I did with the company that I did with the individual team that I did in a city where the real estate industry is about as blue blooded and tight knitted as it is?  I networked for years like a mother flipper and I still do.  I spent $100 to go to a party this past weekend, thereby nearly bankrupting me, but I met up with some folks who work for this German fund based here, and by the end I was told to email my resume.  If it pans out, I spent $100 and overcame some nerves in order to make a decent salary with benefits and work for one of the most reputable developers in the world.  I don't expect it to pan out (though I always go in with that attitude that it will).

The reason why I don't know anyone who hasn't found a job yet, at least from my college, is because nobody at my college is a political science major or sociology major or studying to be a journalist.  No offense to these majors, but I doubt they are half as difficult to complete and earn as an engineering degree, a pre-med/biology track, or a finance degree, especially at an already notoriously difficult school like Tech.  If you worked that hard to get through Tech in one of those fields, you were either automatically picked up because recruiters and companies know what you had been through, or you continued working out of habit to get that first job (i.e. what I did).  I did not go to school to learn political crap or about human behavior or fairness, etc.  I went first as an engineer, and later as a finance major, and so all I cared about was using my brain and working hard.  In fact I was literally taught how grueling the real world is.  I felt prepared.  I was taught nothing is fair.  I was taught to network.  I was made to speak and join in lively dialogue at b-school events.  The atmosphere attempted to replicate a corporate environment with an option to strike out on one's own should that desire burn at some point, and I think the school did a decent job at both (preparing for corporate world, which is all about stepping on someone's throat or having your own stepped on all the while working on diverse teams, and learning about entrepreneurship).

In my sidelife I still find myself working.  I am working on a couple of side projects with some folks.  I am working to keep my apartment clean and pay the bills and maintain my life.  I get paid very little, yet somehow manage to pay my taxes and fees and utilities (2nd highest water bills in the country up here and very high taxes and fees, and not to mention state income tax).  I still manage to pay my $1600/mo rent (that's relatively cheap for Midtown, where I live, considering one bedrooms in a newer building are starting at $2900).  I still manage to make my appointments and pay my medical bills.  On that note, I have an incurable disease.  I have labs done every couple months and I pay thousands a year for medicine, with insurance.  I don't party often.  I don't go out to eat in all the fancy restaurants I can walk to.  I don't stock my fridge with beer or expensive liquors.  I really have nothing left to save, but I still manage to do that.  I have no debt.  Oh, and on top of that I participate in my company's community service outings, and before work I was already volunteering at a men's home.  That I picked up from my high school, which I am grateful for.

Because of all of this, I am not humble.  I am very prideful.  I am boastful and not ashamed to be (my confidence has worked for me so far).  I have absolutely no chip on my shoulder and I despise more than anything in the world those who do.  My attitude is tough, but it has to be.  I hope that some people reading this realize that anyone can make anything work.  In this economy, as long as you aren't expecting entitlements and as long as you aren't expecting a $70K starting salary (divide that in half and then subtract some and that's where I am), you should be able to maintain a decent, hard-working, prideful existence.  That is why I have little if any respect for these granola munchers camping out doing nothing to get a job.  That is why it is tough for me to see so many people going out to expensive clubs on the weekends when I know they aren't working for what they have.

Not to mention these granola crunchers no nothing of what they speak.  They are all repeating talking points.  My work is tied with Wall St as much as anything can be.  I can go on about that, but bottom line is I am more pissed at this administration and perhaps even the Fed than I am with Wall St (my company is a Wall St type company actually, so there ya go...Morgan Stanley and UBS are also in my building and Merrill Lynch is a block down).

Bravo, bravo........clapping hands.

You worked really hard for it, and made it.

I did the same during the early 80's recesssion going to one job fair after another with a masters degree in tow looking for a financial analyst job. And sure enough after about 9 months I was hired at a whopping $18,000, which I came to find out was 5,000 less than the secretary made.

Years later when I was working at Blue Cross Blue Shield of California I finally quit the corporate world altogether. I just do not believe in a world where we work our ass off as corporate slaves working unpaid overtime.......70+ hours for a stingy salary.

Hey in retrospect I should have become an MD or JD, and as a matter of fact did start medical school at the ripe old age of 32.........just couln't swing being a working single parent of 3 while attending med school.

So true grit is all well and good. I hope you haven't fathered any kids because they would be paying the price for your true grit right now. But the kids are disposible as are people in general in such a cut throat society.

[FayeforCure]

Simms, being an MD or JD could have saved me from the cut throat corporatism out there...........but I noticed another way that the smart immigrants were using.

Ever notice how airports are staffed by immigrants?

I worked in a corporate office at the twin towers in Century City in California, and a co-worker from Ethiopia was also working there. She already had a Bachelors degee but her husband was still going to school and working as a taxi driver. Their goal? Secure government jobs. Sure they paid a little less than the corporate jobs, but they were secure and had upward potential.

Smart, very smart folks.

I ended up teaching Economics at various Florida and Georgia colleges for peanuts.

BTW, I really enjoyed the evening classes I taught at Georgia Perimeter College in Atlanta Georgia

There is something special about being an adjunct professor to working adults with their variety of life experiences.

[FayeforCure]

Faye,

I have an incurable chronic illness.  It has not stopped me from anything, nor does my employer even know about it.

Good for you!

Ever tried to hide that you are a wheelchair user because you became paralyzed from a soccer injury?

Hmmmmm, thought so. Many chronic conditions cannot be hidden,...............even temporary ones like pregnancy prevent you from being hired in cut throat corporatism.

[hillary supporter]

Is it they?  Was it the huge black turnout?  Was it the independent voter?  Was it the moderate white Republican who wanted to assuage any white guilt and vote for a half black man?  Do we know if it was the 18-24 year range who got him elected?  If my memory serves me correctly, 2008 did not show any large statistical increase in the college age voter turnout, nor did it show a drastic move to the left (because the few 18-24 year olds who do vote typically do vote left already).

Yes it was they. This pewresearch group states such
http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1039/post-election-perspectives
Note the support of President Obama was 2-1 among 18- 28 (millennial generation). Unprecedented in recent history. The 2008 turnout followed up the large turnout in 2006 that turned congress over to the (left) democrats. Their return to the center also determined the results of the 2008 elections.
Not that it matters as I'm responding to your implication that this group is not pivotal in national elections. Historically, you have a point  but they set a precedent with Obamas election.

[simms3]

Your link actually repeats nearly everything I said.  It talks about moderates going to Obama.  It talks about the super high black turnout.  It talks about independents going to Obama.  And it does point out that young people voted more Democrat than normal, but it also said that young turnout under the age of 30 was not higher than in years past.

It also pointed out that young voters were swept by Obama, who appealed to them, and that voters in general were disillusioned about Bush over such things like the economy, Katrina, and the two wars, whether all were Bush's doing or not.  Well, it's been 3 years and the economy is no better, even though it would be if we did absolutely nothing to tinker with it.  At this point in time young people are facing a disproportionate level of unemployment, and everyone is facing higher unemployment and a multitude of problems.  The "leader" they elected has done absolutely nothing, has not played the part of a leader, has not provided any positive messages, has not even given any hints of stability in policy, has interrupted countless prime time programs only to waste our time to say something idiotic.  I think young people will fall back on their left leaning ideologies, seeing as half a decade of Democrat Congress/Senate and 3 years of a Democrat administration have not put out any positive results.  Some rich-kid hyper-educated, jobless liberal granola crunching students camping out and tweeting on their macs in city parks does not represent MY generation.  It represents merely a pitiful, small portion of it.

There are plenty of us either working, or working to get a job.  The overall disapproval of the campouts has at least flooded the message boards of my Twitter and my Facebook.

No party is perfect, and I can't stand all the closet Republicans who strike down gay rights as much as I can't stand all the corrupt Democrats who funnel taxpayer money between supporters and liberal groups.  I can say at this point that most people disapprove of Obama, Congress, and the Senate.  Ratings are at all time lows for all groups.  I do think while we have yet to see a truly strong Republican presidential candidate, people are generally more favorable towards conservatives now.  You have the FDA going bonkers over regulation.  You have the Justice Department fining the crap out of 6 oil companies because one non-endangered migratory bird died in ND, yet the Justice Department turns a complete blind eye to all utility companies running wind turbines, which kill hundreds if not thousands of birds, migratory, endangered, and all each year.  At the same time, oil and energy companies are possibly facing some of the highest taxes to ever come down the corporate pike, yet green companies, several of which recent ones have been the subject of scandals, receive tens of billions in subsidies.  You have scandals like the Solyndra incident occurring on a routine basis, all on the Democrat side.  You have the public unions issues in many states and within our federal government.  You have Obama holding up 3 trade pacts with South Korea, Panama, and Colombia, and now finally relenting because he got major concessions for the United Auto Workers.  This administration is picking winners like never before.  People talk about cronyism on Wall St (which until Bush was purely in bed with the Democrats and still largely is).  There has been nothing on the level of cronyism that has been going on between Obama and his unions and other political supporters.

I am now reading about minority parents being arrested for Grand Theft for sending their kids to schools outside of their district.  Is this what we are coming to?  Education declined again this year, and yet even after we have tripled spending per pupil (adjusted for inflation) over the last 30 years, results continue to decline significantly.  All of this and Obama's big plan is to spend more on education to "upgrade" schools?  I'm for spending on education, but it makes me queasy knowing that much of what we spend on education does nothing to help the children and does a lot to pay and empower the teachers' unions, which have held our system hostage for decades now.

I was so excited about being a part of the Democrat party just a year ago.  Now I could not be more upset, thinking 'what have I done?'  I was so disillusioned with the Tea Party a year ago, which is why I switched, but now they really don't piss me off so much.  I am slightly elitist, so I could never call myself a member of the Tea Party, but I can say that I am a capitalist through and through and I don't like the role our government is playing right now.  I believe our government is supposed to facilitate a good environment in which to conduct business, and it is doing the freakin opposite!

Those dumb kids in Zucotti Park can't see that no matter what Wall St does, ultimately the situation in which we find ourselves stems from bad policies in our federal government.  Many of these bad policies are just since the Obama admin.  They are also soooo hypocritical.  Wall St is only one beneficiary of the many failed stimuli that we have paid out.  Also Wall St keeps Main St running, and how that happens is largely regulated by various policies and regulators.  I see no anger directed towards regulators or those in government tasked with overseeing banks.  I basically see no anger from these STUPID idiots towards anyone in government.  They are so disconnected as to be laughably naive.  The $50K a year their parents spent on their college education was one hell of a huge waste.

I could go on and on.  These people bother me.  I'm just so happy that out of the millions of young people, they only number in the low thousands.  They are like a fly that you just have to flick off.

[FayeforCure]

Oh, poor Oil Companies, poor Pharma........they kill hundreds of thousands of people and now they are getting regulated boohoo, poor Wall Street.........don't the folks on Main Street understand that they depend on Wall Street boohoo.

simms says:

I do think while we have yet to see a truly strong Republican presidential candidate, people are generally more favorable towards conservatives now.

Yeah those Republicans are definitely favored because they protect the Oil industry, big Pharma and Wall Street from the whiners on Main Street.

Yet recent polls show that 59% of Americans hate Republicans in power, vs 50% of Americans hating Democrats in Power!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/30/americans-are-the-angries_n_989719.html

Which brings us back to all of us agreeing that our governmental system doesn't work, with Republicans scoring much lower in approval on Main Street than Democrats.

[hillary supporter]

RE Simms Statistics can be read in any way you want. I, myself, was stunned with Obamas victory of the democratic nomination (hence my moniker). But his presidential victory was, IMO, no fluke. The performance of two historically non significant groups were attributed to his victory, that being African Americans and 18-28yr age group. By numerous pollsters and statisticians. I presented those facts to back my point (and 2008 experience).
Your disillusionment of these times in America are shared by many, including the millennial generation that you are dismissing. The problem is you are convinced that the solution is opposite of what that generation is stating. But the difference is they are taking action straight to the streets. The numbers are getting larger, and the appeal is getting stronger.
If you think otherwise, you will be further dis sappointed next year when the democrats sweep control of both congress and the white house.
There is no truly strong republican candidate as the party is decisively divided. Watch the rest of this year as savvy republicans move to support the presidents legislation. Todays condemnation by Ron Paul of the presidents assassination of the American terrorist effectively destroys his campaign.
Speaking sympathy for the oil companies, condemning green American employed companies, impling democratic party control of Wall street.... your views are far outside the majority of Americans. And that majority is getting larger.
And in true democratic style, greatest good for greatest number, essential for all capitalism, the cards aren't in your favor.

[FayeforCure]

  I am slightly elitist, so I could never call myself a member of the Tea Party, but I can say that I am a capitalist through and through and I don't like the role our government is playing right now.  I believe our government is supposed to facilitate a good environment in which to conduct business, and it is doing the freakin opposite!

Those dumb kids in Zucotti Park can't see that no matter what Wall St does, ultimately the situation in which we find ourselves stems from bad policies in our federal government.  Many of these bad policies are just since the Obama admin. 

Wow........lets examine the true free enterprise ideas of Adam Smith, who wrote the Bible for Capitalism:

What we call capitalism is, in fact, the American version of mercantilism. Ludwig von Mises, a libertarian economist, summed up its benefits rather nicely: "Capitalism gave the world what it needed, a higher standard of living for a growing population." Measured thusly, the results have been breathtakingly successful, but if the goal is the long-term viability of our economic and political democracy, we are in serious trouble.

Just as Jeffersonian democracy operates best on a small scale, Adam Smith believed his self-correcting free markets were ideal for small businesses in a domestic economy. Integrated in their communities, these businesses would be influenced directly by the needs and demands of consumers, and any dangerous or abusive conduct would rarely affect the broader economy. But Smith treated large, powerful companies very differently. He said big business was led by "an order of men...that generally have an interest to deceive and even to oppress the public", and he referred to powerful corporations (then known as joint stock companies) as "unaccountable sovereigns" that were as dangerous to free markets as tyrannical governments. Unrestrained, they had the power to shape society and governments for their own purposes, and consumers would pay for "all the extraordinary profits" while suffering from "all the extraordinary waste", the inherent fraud and abuse, that accompanies such immense economic power.

Smith stated emphatically that a strong government, acting through democratic and legal institutions, was the only entity capable of challenging such corporate power.

Smith supported necessary government regulations, labor and human rights, public education, and progressive taxation to ease the economic and social inequities he knew would occur in a capitalist system. Without these "liberal" measures, social and political unrest would threaten a nation's stability and his free market economy could not survive.

While Thomas Jefferson applauded Smith's theories, the 'father of American conservatism', Alexander Hamilton, denounced this philosophy as nonsense. Hamilton intended to establish America as a global powerhouse in short order. He was thinking big and didn't have time for Smith's small-scale, go-slow approach. Britain's mercantile system was elitist and abusive, but Hamilton knew it was the engine that drove England's powerful economy. As Secretary of the Treasury, he planned to use that very system to propel America onto the world stage.

Both his plan and its execution were brilliant. Hamilton set out to consolidate power in the new federal government by controlling the money supply, tariffs and trade and by managing the nation's industrial development. Farmers and shopkeepers couldn't provide the revenue he needed, nor could they finance the commercial development and infrastructure necessary for America to play in the big leagues. Hamilton needed big money and powerful partners in the private sector.

To accomplish this, he used the courts and Federalist Congress to institutionalize a powerful federal government and corporatist economy, a practice continued by his successors. The myth that corporations are somehow "persons" and equivalent to the human beings Adam Smith was liberating in his free market utopia is possibly the most successful coup in the history of the world, achieved with the stroke of a judicial pen in 1886.

Despite warnings by prescient Republican presidents like Abraham Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt and Dwight Eisenhower, the American system has morphed quite predictably into a dog-eat-dog economic Darwinism, and the big canines have rigged the game in their favor.

Flying the capitalist flag, the really big guys have completely corrupted Smith's free market philosophy. They use their concentrated wealth and power to buy off politicians, skate around regulations, abuse their privileges and sometimes, break the laws to win. When their politicians and corporate-sponsored "citizen" groups insist that small government and the market itself are sufficient checks, that further controls are a socialist plot to destroy capitalism, they are counting on our collective naiveté to win the game. They are destroying free enterprise by abusing the very freedoms intrinsic to a market economy.

That so many conservatives, adamant that they are defending true capitalism, would fail to make this distinction, gives credence to the power of the "big lie." They have so internalized this nonsense, that again and again, they are willing to defend transnational behemoths over the well-being of the American economy.

As one (somewhat mysterious) financial trader said in a BBC TV interview last week, a crashing economy is a brilliant opportunity for savvy insiders to make a killing. The economic well-being of a nation or its citizens is not a major factor in the world of transnational commerce. Predicting that the economic crisis will deepen, he summed up his message with a smile -- governments don't rule the world, Goldman Sachs rules the world.

For true American patriots who believe in a vibrant free market economy, it is time to recognize we've been sold a bill of goods. The real enemy in the battle for American capitalism is not socialism; it is global corporatism. For true patriots, conservatives and liberals alike, the stakes could not be higher.

My new book, Patriot Acts -- What Americans Must Do to Save the Republic, examines the true nature of our constitutional system, how it has been interpreted and manipulated by conservatives and liberals since 1789, the effect of partisan ideology on this democratic system, including the economy, national security, health care, education and immigration, and how modern politicians betray the founding principles, constitutional system and economic capitalism that all Americans, left and right, profess to defend. Patriot Acts can be preordered on-line and will be released on November 1, 2011.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/catherine-crier/capitalists-of-america--u_b_992786.html

[FayeforCure]

I could go on and on.  These people bother me.  I'm just so happy that out of the millions of young people, they only number in the low thousands.  They are like a fly that you just have to flick off.

I really have to humor you on this since the pundits are taking them very serious........far more serious than the tea-party idiots!! Ignore them at your own peril. This is really hilarious   

David Weidner's Writing on the Wall Archives | Email alerts

Oct. 4, 2011, 12:00 a.m. EDT

Occupy Wall Street is a tea party with brains
Commentary: Protesters seek a political process that doesn’t exclude themNEW YORK (MarketWatch) â€"

The revolution just might be televised after all.

More than two weeks after a band of young people began camping out under the shadow of the New York Stock Exchange, the movement to remake America’s inequitable financial system is growing

It’s been called the Woodstock of Wall Street, but that’s hardly an apt comparison. The gathering at Max Yasgur’s farm 42 years ago was built on a generation looking for peace, love, some drugs and acid rock. The kids today are looking for real, tangible change of the capitalist sort. They’re organized, lucid and motivated.


Reuters
Demonstrators from the Occupy Wall Street campaign hold signs aloft as a protest march enters the courtyard near the New York Police Department

Actually, they have more in common with the tea party movement than the hippie dream, with one key difference. They’re smart enough to recognize the nation’s problems aren’t simply about taxes and the deficit.

They want jobs. They want the generation in power to acknowledge them. They want political change. They want responsibility in a culture that abdicates it. They want a decent future of opportunity.

If that isn’t American, then what is?

Another key difference between today’s kids and their hippie forefathers: they’re willing to gut it out.

Not only is Occupy Wall Street showing no signs of dying out, it’s getting stronger. On Sunday, a night of rain dampened the crowd at Zuccotti Park, but then the sun broke through and they were back at it: challenging police, marching and drawing attention to their cause.

They’re wired and ready. They’re using YouTube and blogs. A newspaper, the Occupied Wall Street Journal, began publishing last week. They meet in the evenings in a “general assembly” to discuss tactics.

Moreover there are signs the Left Coast wants to get into the action. On Sunday a group called Refund California announced a series of protests throughout Los Angeles. On Monday, a teach-in took place aimed at bringing awareness to how Wall Street has worsened California’s budget problems.

On Tuesday, Refund California is going to Orange County for a protest. On Wednesday, the group will target the home of a bank executive. And on Thursday a big bank in L.A. will be the next target. Protests in Chicago this weekend showed the message isn’t lost in fly-over country.

Click to Play  Wall Street protest spreads to Chicago Inspired by the "Occupy Wall Street" demonstrations in New York, some 100 people gathered Sunday outside the Federal Reserve Bank in Chicago to protest inequities in the nation's financial system. WSJ's Jack Nicas reports.

This isn’t just some anarchist or lefty agitating. Many of the protesters are furious with the Obama administration’s kow-towing to big finance. They’re critical of Federal Reserve policies. Refund California is aligned with 1,000 faith-based groups.

Protesters are admonished for displaying the U.S. flag incorrectly. These protests have been overwhelmingly peaceful. And despite what you hear, there’s been a lot of goodwill between the police and protesters. They’re sharing coffee and donuts in the morning.

Meanwhile, another group, Occupy Los Angeles, is organizing its own protests. This movement, though small compared to the New York effort, is slowly gathering steam. Back East, Occupy Boston is gaining momentum. Protests in the financial center of Dewey Square took place Monday.

The persistence is paying off. The media is beginning to pay attention. Local papers in New York have been running more Occupy Wall Street stories. All of the major networks are covering the protests now.

Click to Play  House is gone but debt lives on Forty-one states and the District of Columbia permit lenders to sue borrowers for mortgage debt still left after a foreclosure sale. Jessica Silver-Greenberg has details on Lunch Break.

There are many more reporters on the scene and the coverage has moved from the police confrontations to what these thousands of protesters want.

The media seems confused. There were signs about Afghanistan, taxes, Wall Street greed, corporate responsibility and just about every pet cause out there.

But what some decry as a lack of focus is really about them not getting it: it’s about money. It’s about wasting money. It’s about greed for money guiding those in power. It’s about the inequitable distribution of money.

Most of all its about process. In a “general assembly” meeting Saturday, Occupy Wall Street came up with its first official document. It is a powerful summation of grievances, not just of the young, but of many Americans: home foreclosures, workers rights, internet privacy, health care and bailouts. Read the declaration of Occupy Wall Street .

“No true democracy is attainable when the process is determined by economic power,” the declaration states. “We come to you at a time when corporations, which place profit over people, self-interest over justice, and oppression over equality, run our governments. We have peaceably assembled here, as is our right, to let these facts be known.”

The protesters urge others to join them in public spaces everywhere.

Occupy Wall Street is a bigger and more important movement than it was two weeks ago. As the nation begins a year in which many of its major political offices could potentially shift hands, there finally seems to be a movement that reflects frustration with system beholden to big financial interests.

Still, there’s much work to do. The movement needs to sharpen its message. It needs visible and well-spoken leadership and people to become active politically. Some have argued that the protesters need more concrete ideas such as financial transaction taxes or Wall Street reforms. Using blanket anti-corporate statements aren’t an actionable method.

But for a generation accused of being lazy, unwilling to work and living with their parents too long, these kids have shown a hell of a lot of mettle so far. The odds are still long, but they’ve succeeded in the first step.

They’ve gotten our attention.
David Weidner covers Wall Street for MarketWatch.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/occupy-wall-street-is-a-tea-party-with-brains-2011-10-04?pagenumber=2

[BridgeTroll]

I graduated in December.  I spent the majority of my last 12 months in college taking out various people for coffee or lunch, joining professional organizations to network and learn, getting licensed and tested, going to recruitment events, etc etc and making friends with my professors.  I worked my butt off, and it paid off and I got a job.  It is not the highest paying for me, but I learn more each day than I could ever learn anywhere else from the team of 4 that I work with.  There is nobody else in the south doing what we do.  I am merely an intern filling the role of a much more experienced analyst (and believe me when I say I was nil experienced just a few months ago).  In my intern title, I still work upwards of 70 hours a week, and I am still at my desk as I type now.  Now I am getting potential offers from other companies (you can't get a job until you have a job).

How did I land the job that I did with the company that I did with the individual team that I did in a city where the real estate industry is about as blue blooded and tight knitted as it is?  I networked for years like a mother flipper and I still do.  I spent $100 to go to a party this past weekend, thereby nearly bankrupting me, but I met up with some folks who work for this German fund based here, and by the end I was told to email my resume.  If it pans out, I spent $100 and overcame some nerves in order to make a decent salary with benefits and work for one of the most reputable developers in the world.  I don't expect it to pan out (though I always go in with that attitude that it will).

The reason why I don't know anyone who hasn't found a job yet, at least from my college, is because nobody at my college is a political science major or sociology major or studying to be a journalist.  No offense to these majors, but I doubt they are half as difficult to complete and earn as an engineering degree, a pre-med/biology track, or a finance degree, especially at an already notoriously difficult school like Tech.  If you worked that hard to get through Tech in one of those fields, you were either automatically picked up because recruiters and companies know what you had been through, or you continued working out of habit to get that first job (i.e. what I did).  I did not go to school to learn political crap or about human behavior or fairness, etc.  I went first as an engineer, and later as a finance major, and so all I cared about was using my brain and working hard.  In fact I was literally taught how grueling the real world is.  I felt prepared.  I was taught nothing is fair.  I was taught to network.  I was made to speak and join in lively dialogue at b-school events.  The atmosphere attempted to replicate a corporate environment with an option to strike out on one's own should that desire burn at some point, and I think the school did a decent job at both (preparing for corporate world, which is all about stepping on someone's throat or having your own stepped on all the while working on diverse teams, and learning about entrepreneurship).

In my sidelife I still find myself working.  I am working on a couple of side projects with some folks.  I am working to keep my apartment clean and pay the bills and maintain my life.  I get paid very little, yet somehow manage to pay my taxes and fees and utilities (2nd highest water bills in the country up here and very high taxes and fees, and not to mention state income tax).  I still manage to pay my $1600/mo rent (that's relatively cheap for Midtown, where I live, considering one bedrooms in a newer building are starting at $2900).  I still manage to make my appointments and pay my medical bills.  On that note, I have an incurable disease.  I have labs done every couple months and I pay thousands a year for medicine, with insurance.  I don't party often.  I don't go out to eat in all the fancy restaurants I can walk to.  I don't stock my fridge with beer or expensive liquors.  I really have nothing left to save, but I still manage to do that.  I have no debt.  Oh, and on top of that I participate in my company's community service outings, and before work I was already volunteering at a men's home.  That I picked up from my high school, which I am grateful for.

Because of all of this, I am not humble.  I am very prideful.  I am boastful and not ashamed to be (my confidence has worked for me so far).  I have absolutely no chip on my shoulder and I despise more than anything in the world those who do.  My attitude is tough, but it has to be.  I hope that some people reading this realize that anyone can make anything work.  In this economy, as long as you aren't expecting entitlements and as long as you aren't expecting a $70K starting salary (divide that in half and then subtract some and that's where I am), you should be able to maintain a decent, hard-working, prideful existence.  That is why I have little if any respect for these granola munchers camping out doing nothing to get a job.  That is why it is tough for me to see so many people going out to expensive clubs on the weekends when I know they aren't working for what they have.

Not to mention these granola crunchers no nothing of what they speak.  They are all repeating talking points.  My work is tied with Wall St as much as anything can be.  I can go on about that, but bottom line is I am more pissed at this administration and perhaps even the Fed than I am with Wall St (my company is a Wall St type company actually, so there ya go...Morgan Stanley and UBS are also in my building and Merrill Lynch is a block down).

What a great story Simms!  I am very impressed... I congratulate you.(probably the kiss of death here... )  I especially congratulate you for NOT accepting the myriad of ready made excuses to not find and have a job.  You have found a position and understand that you must work your way up in title and pay.  It has always been that way and always will.  An advanced degree guarantees nothing.  There are many like you and the norm is NOT the folks camping out on Wall St.

I do not begrudge the protesters... I just hope they are cleaning up after themselves...

[FayeforCure]

What a great story Simms!  I am very impressed... I congratulate you.(probably the kiss of death here... )  I especially congratulate you for NOT accepting the myriad of ready made excuses to not find and have a job.  You have found a position and understand that you must work your way up in title and pay.  It has always been that way and always will.  An advanced degree guarantees nothing.  There are many like you and the norm is NOT the folks camping out on Wall St.

I do not begrudge the protesters... I just hope they are cleaning up after themselves...

BT, thanks for your kind words for somone who really DID succeed against all odds.

But it's almost like holding up Stephen Hawkin's story of success against all odds for other wheelchair users to emulate.

I'm all for motivational stories............but not everyone can be a Conan. 

It reminds me of the reason poor Republicans want to protect the Uber-Rich.........because maybe...........if they just work hard enough..............they will be uber-rich themselves.

Same thing with the ultra-religious.................suffering is a virtue because of the promised rewards in the afterlife.