Republicans, Abortion, Women's Rights, and the challenges facing them.

[Shwaz]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late-term_abortion

Intact D&X surgeryUnder the Intact D&X method, the largest part of the fetus (the head) is reduced in diameter to allow vaginal passage. According to the American Medical Association, this procedure has four main elements.[3] First, the cervix is dilated. Second, the fetus is positioned for a footling breech. Third, the fetus is partially pulled out, starting with the feet, as far as the neck. Fourth, the brain and material inside the skull is evacuated, so that a dead but otherwise intact fetus can be delivered via the vagina.

Usually, preliminary procedures are performed over a period of two to three days, to gradually dilate the cervix using laminaria tents (sticks of seaweed which absorb fluid and swell). Sometimes drugs such as pitocin, a synthetic form of oxytocin, are used to induce labor. Once the cervix is sufficiently dilated, the doctor uses an ultrasound and forceps to grasp the fetus's leg. The fetus is turned to a breech position, if necessary, and the doctor pulls one or both legs out of the cervix, which some refer to as 'partial birth' of the fetus. The doctor subsequently extracts the rest of the fetus, leaving only the head still inside the uterus. An incision is made at the base of the skull, a blunt dissector (such as a Kelly clamp) is inserted into the incision and opened to widen the opening,[4] and then a suction catheter is inserted into the opening. The brain is suctioned out, which causes the skull to collapse and allows the fetus to pass more easily through the cervix. The placenta is removed and the uterine wall is vacuum aspirated using a cannula.[5]

If you are trying to make us feel bad with your description it's not working....i've read the process of aboritons for years....you've changed nothing.

So you're cool with partial birth abortions? What if the child (no longer a fetus) has developed sexual organs? What if those organs are of the female variety... shouldn't these women have the right not to have their necks snapped and brains evacuated?

[wsansewjs]

I have a beautiful 6 month old daughter that was nearly aborted.  Her mother was a single 15 year old girl who was living with her boyfriends family.  We met the birth mother by an amazing act of God and were able to convince her that adoption was best option.  There are thousands of couples out there like us that are unable to have children that are an alternative to MURDERING and innocent child.

She has been a blessing in our lives and have been a blessing to many people.  I tear up when I think what might have happend if we hadn't crossed each others paths and stopped what would have been what she was going through with.

She is sitting on my lap as I type this.  She destined for greatness.

And thousand more of the amazing gay couples who want to raise beautiful families. The current legislation makes it HARDER for the gay couples to adopt and raise a family than getting an abortion.

-Josh

[wsansewjs]

Here an idea:

I would give the pro-life TWO choices: Accept the abortion laws to protect the women's rights or ALLOW the gay couples to adopt.

-Josh

[danno]

Here an idea:

I would give the pro-life TWO choices: Accept the abortion laws to protect the women's rights or ALLOW the gay couples to adopt.

-Josh

Thats like saying if I can't play I am taking my ball and going home.

Gay adoptions are allowed in many states.

[Shwaz]

Here an idea:

I would give the pro-life TWO choices: Accept the abortion laws to protect the women's rights or ALLOW the gay couples to adopt.

-Josh

Thats like saying if I can't play I am taking my ball and going home.

Gay adoptions are allowed in many states.

Wasn't legislation passed recently here in FL allowing gay couples to adopt?



It seems the adoption process is extremely strict for everyone. Why do you think Madonna shops for babies in Malawi?

[Jimmy]

Gays and lesbians are now permitted to adopt in Florida thanks to a Court decision.

[wsansewjs]

Here an idea:

I would give the pro-life TWO choices: Accept the abortion laws to protect the women's rights or ALLOW the gay couples to adopt.

-Josh

Thats like saying if I can't play I am taking my ball and going home.

Gay adoptions are allowed in many states.

The real issue here is that the majority of the states doesn't allow gay couples to joint-adopt a child. Majority of the states do allow a single-gay parent adoption, but that is not new. I can adopt a child if I want to right now.

I thought the idea was fair to everyone since there are so much things interwined into each other, gay couples and parenting and the issue of adoptions itself from all sides. I was trying to suggest that the idea of gay couples can joint-adopt would alone can solve the abortion issue by allowing more people to adopt while at same time saving "lives" so called by the pro-lifers.

Source: http://gaylife.about.com/od/gayparentingadoption/a/gaycoupleadopt_2.htm
Source #2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_adoption
Source #3: http://www.hrc.org/issues/parenting/2397.htm

-Josh

[Garden guy]

Our governor is playing this abortion attack to pander to the rightwing republicans who have infested this state and have brought us to the brink of rediculousness...but...we must keep up our voices against the conservative attack on america... i'll bet he'd even put in a clause that the state would pay for an abortion only if they get one at his new abortion clinics..lol..

[BridgeTroll]

   Now they are a rediculous... infestation?

[Shwaz]

Here an idea:

I would give the pro-life TWO choices: Accept the abortion laws to protect the women's rights or ALLOW the gay couples to adopt.

-Josh

Thats like saying if I can't play I am taking my ball and going home.

Gay adoptions are allowed in many states.

The real issue here is that the majority of the states doesn't allow gay couples to joint-adopt a child. Majority of the states do allow a single-gay parent adoption, but that is not new. I can adopt a child if I want to right now.

I thought the idea was fair to everyone since there are so much things interwined into each other, gay couples and parenting and the issue of adoptions itself from all sides. I was trying to suggest that the idea of gay couples can joint-adopt would alone can solve the abortion issue by allowing more people to adopt while at same time saving "lives" so called by the pro-lifers.

Source: http://gaylife.about.com/od/gayparentingadoption/a/gaycoupleadopt_2.htm
Source #2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_adoption
Source #3: http://www.hrc.org/issues/parenting/2397.htm

-Josh

Can you? Have you actually started the process; find an agency - filed an application -home study performed - court appearances - background checks - had your friends, family, co-workers & neighbors interviewed extensively - another home study performed -paid thousands of dollars in fees - yet another home study performed?

Very few have the money or qualifications for the process in place... it is especially difficult for singles regardless of sexual orientation.

[Jimmy]

So now we're getting into the cost.  Maybe it should be financially cheaper for couples (or singles in states that don't yet allow gay couples) to adopt than for a women to choose an abortion.  Perhaps to the extent that the state refuses to subsidize abortion, the state should strive to subsidize adoption.  Either through outright payment or through tax credits or other avenues.

To do otherwise seems to favor abortion as an outcome.  We do all sorts of things to incentivize behavior we as a society want to see.

[uptowngirl]

This is the issue with our political system, far left and far right. for us moderates in between there are little options and not a lot of representation.

For instance, I have no issue with gay adoption or gay marriage, I am a proponent of both. I also do not have an issue with a woman's choice to give life or take it away (it is a personal choice with personal repercussions no matter the decision) until that life because a woman cannot or will not make a decision, goes on for too long. I also believe that although a man is not actually carrying the child, and in many cases is not taking care of it, they also have some say in the decision. I also believe there should be a safety net for healthcare, but I do not believe the government should manage healthcare as is done in Europe. My moderate beliefs do not fit within either party, and are attacked by both. I know there are many out there that feel the same and are just sick and tired of having to "choose" the lesser evil on topics that are important too us.  Common sense would seem to dictate that unless your life and/or the child's life is at risk the incision and sucking out of a baby's brain is inappropriate. Yet you have extremist screaming it is none of your business. I believe most states have a good Samaritan law that states I have to provide minimal safe assistance if I see a person being attacked?  Underage children that want plastic surge have to get parental permission, and normally in most state have a waiting period prior to having surgery but can get an abortion at will, with no recovery support. After all we are speaking about elective procedures here. On the right you have extremist that think gays are third class citizens, and cannot marry or adopt and yet most of us are related to, friends with, and depend on gays to protect their rights and safety or preach to them from the pulpit every Sunday, hell these people even vote for gays.  

WTH is wrong with people? Where has common sense gone? what are moderates to do when the only choices today are extremist?

[danno]

WTH is wrong with people? Where has common sense gone? what are moderates to do when the only choices today are extremist?

+++1000

[Shwaz]

So now we're getting into the cost.  Maybe it should be financially cheaper for couples (or singles in states that don't yet allow gay couples) to adopt than for a women to choose an abortion.  Perhaps to the extent that the state refuses to subsidize abortion, the state should strive to subsidize adoption.  Either through outright payment or through tax credits or other avenues.

To do otherwise seems to favor abortion as an outcome.  We do all sorts of things to incentivize behavior we as a society want to see.

You're missing the point... and for the record I'm all in favor allowing anyone single, married, gay or straight to adopt as long as they are approved through this extensive strenuous process.

What I'm trying to explain to wsanews is that the process is difficult for everyone. You can't put children out on the street like a sidewalk shoe sale in South Beach and have run on babies.

[DeadGirlsDontDance]

GG, some people should be given an award for having the foresight to throw that sperm away!

And I am surprised you do not understand the process to actually create a human life, but it takes a little more than a tissue full of sperm.

But back to your original topic, why is it so horrendous (other than the waste of money) to have a sonogram prior to an abortion?

Because forcing somebody to have any unnecessary medical procedure as a condition of getting treatment they DO need or want is just wrong. By your logic, we should also force people to have an enema and examine the contents of their colon before allowing them to have hemorrhoid surgery.