Courthouse Asphalt or Green Space: The Choice Is Yours?

[futurejax]

If accessibility is such an issue, why don't they just convert Adams back to a 2 way street? Then you can just use it instead of Monroe. Or is that an insane proposition?

My prediction: Monroe St will be reopened and the entire plaza will be paved over. The city will perhaps allow someone to sell hot dogs or newspapers (but not both). That person will not be allowed to advertise.

At least if Monroe St is rebuilt, it'll make it easier for everyone who works at the Courthouse to drive to a strip mall on the Southside for lunch, am I right?

Why is the city so anti-entrepreneur?  What do these people fear exactly besides potential commerce?

[thelakelander]

Let's meet up at the courthouse garage one of these days and let me walk you through my viewpoint.

Ennis:  Why not make this offer to council members including Corrigan?

I just got off the phone with someone who wants to set up something similar for the TU editorial board.  That offer is available to anyone.  In addition, I do plan to put something together for council members this weekend that highlights the major issues.  My intention is to send it via email to all of them, as well as post on MJ.

[fieldafm]

Let's meet up at the courthouse garage one of these days and let me walk you through my viewpoint.

Ennis:  Why not make this offer to council members including Corrigan?

I just got off the phone with someone who wants to set up something similar for the TU editorial board.  That offer is available to anyone.  In addition, I do plan to put something together for council members this weekend that highlights the major issues.  My intention is to send it via email to all of them, as well as post on MJ.

I sent a council-wide email out yesterday, essentially echoing your same points.

Please let me know what day/time to meet up and I will be there!

[JaxByDefault]

2. Forsyth Street connects you to everything Monroe does, if traveling from northbound I-95, including the Hart Bridge Expressway.  Whoever stated that Monroe Street was the only street doing this, flat out lied.  Because of Forsyth Street, I-95 access is a non-issue.

You have to wonder if Corrigan, Pappas and the others arguing to keep Monroe open because it connects I-95 to the Hart Bridge ever venture downtown (or have access to a map.) Forsyth accomplishes the same thing and is faster than Monroe. (Especially when you factor in an awkward jog around the courthouse.)

Close the road; save money; and make downtown friendlier for pedestrians!

[fieldafm]

You have to wonder if Corrigan, Pappas and the others arguing to keep Monroe open because it connects I-95 to the Hart Bridge ever venture downtown (or have access to a map.) Forsyth accomplishes the same thing and is faster than Monroe. (Especially when you factor in an awkward jog around the courthouse.)

I use Forsyth and Union when I drive downtown almost excusively.  The only time I wind up on Monroe is if I made a wrong turn, lol.

[urbanlibertarian]

Where will prospective jurors be parking at the new courthouse?  I ask because their safety and convenience as pedestrians is probably more important to the council and the chief judge than anyone else's.

[fieldafm]

Good question. 
Currently jurrors park free next to the Arena and use the Bay Street PCT trolley to access the courthouse.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Monroe (and all the streets for that matter) should have remained open in the original design. Now that there is a big fat building over the right of way, twisting Monroe around it is just adding to our downtown Frankenstein.

What was the plan for Monroe in the "Original Design?"  And how did the project get this far without someone noticing the problem?  This is a serious black-eye for all involved, but I expect it all to be conveniently forgotton when the next project is up for bid.

Maybe they should have looked to the west for answers,

[CS Foltz]

I agree! Voter approved for $190 Million and what do we get........a $350 Dollar white elephant with very poor  periphals! No parking, no green spaces and no sense! Good job Johnny once again. One more glaring example of the current administrations expertise and the public gets to pay for it again!

[ChriswUfGator]

Lol, no, $400mm at this point and still not finished yet...

[thelakelander]

Looking east, along Adams, towards the intersection with Clay.  All of the buildings on the left side of this photo (taken in 1946) were on the courthouse parcel under debate.

[thelakelander]

I've been involved in an email chain with suburbanites that want a road constructed in front of the courthouse, no matter the cost involved or the safety issues a move will cause for downtown pedestrians.  If you support the concept of a walkable downtown and spending $2 million more taxpayer dollars on another highway downtown, then you may want to show up and speak at next Tuesday's council meeting.

Attention All,

This item is scheduled for a continued Public Hearing at City Council Meeting, February 22, 2011, starting at 5:00 PM.

Please come in and speak out to the insult of this bill and show to them and the viewers at home how wrong this is. 

No matter what reason you offer this is a defiance of years of the people speaking against this very plan and it's cost and even if it is "budgeted" to spend the money on this project is in violation of Ordinance (Law) and certainly the voice of the people.

Please come out in mass and embarrass the authors of this crime.

[dougskiles]

I haven't seen the email chain.  Is there any discussion of the cost of building the road versus the cost of green space?

And what exactly are the costs proposed for each?

My fear is that the green space cost is shown as an add-on to the courthouse cost.  And then the cost for the road comes out of another city budget so it appears as if we are keeping the courthouse cost low - when we are likely spending even more money somewhere else.

[thelakelander]

$630k has been set aside for public art/green space in the courthouse budget.  This money will be spent on these items regardless of whether a road is constructed or not.

The road is not within the courthouse budget.  According to FDOT's 2009 Roadway Cost Per Centerline Mile estimates, a new construction 2-lane roadway with 5' sidewalks, and curb & gutter averages around $11,984,683 million/mile.  The weird Monroe Street alignment appears to be 0.18 miles in length on Google Earth.  $11,984,683 million x 0.18 miles = $2.16 million.  

Nobody has talked numbers but according to the documents that were used to estimate Mobility Plan project costs, the Monroe Street alignment will require in the range of $2 million additional dollars from taxpayers to construct.  Of course, when detailed out that number could rise or drop.  However, given that environment, I'm sure it would be designed to have special pedestrian signals, expensive pavers and special lighting in a poor attempt to fit it in.  The addition of these items, along with any unknown issues underground (it will travel over the path of demolished buildings that had basements) could cause that $2 million figure to rise.

[Bativac]

I wish you guys would quit posting these old photos of downtown Jacksonville. It seriously breaks my heart.