The Park View Pavilion Coming Soon

[Jaxson]

But I personally think its getting more & more of the "faux hipster" vibe than anything else lately (the young well-off using mommy & daddy's $$ to move to the area & play cool urban kid dress up time). Real hipsters don't have a lot of money, don't consider themselves hip or trendy & don't try so hard. And they certainly wouldn't be caught dead in a Starbucks drinking coffee that tastes like week old piss, all the while the independently owned ones close down a month after they open. Just saying.

Meh.  Ive lived in most of the hipster scenes of the US, and Ive never seen a hipster scene that wasnt half trustafarian.  It takes money coming from somewhere to afford leisure time.

Even back in the beginning of five points, there were extremely poor hipsters hanging around barely surviving.  But it was also kids from some of the wealthiest families of the city.  Especially the ones who had travelled.

The key is always street traffic, how many people are walking around and what is the perception of safety. 

And the indie kids provided and built that in five points for 10 years of slow progress upwards before the Publix deigned to open there.

Back in the '90s, I remember when the 'grunge' trend went mainstream.  Instead of trolling the thrift stores, folks could get their designer distressed flannel shirts from some of the most high end stores.  This is when I noticed that the same jocks and cheerleaders from high school were beginning to adopt the same styles that they ridiculed a mere year or two earlier.  That said, the Five Points crowd was diverse and afforded the same acceptance that others in North Florida would hardly begrudge. 

[acme54321]

Has there been any progress with this?

[Timkin]

?

[Springfielder]

I agree with Lake, in that whomever comes in with the financial capabilities, etc., will be the one. I also agree that it would be a smaller chain to do this. When you consider Target and the other larger stores, there's the room for the actual store, but where would the huge parking lot be? Look at all of those large chain stores, they include large parking lots/garages and I don't see where this will fit into the current location.

Myself, I'd love to see a chain store such as Target there, given that I prefer to shop locally instead of traveling across town. I'd also love to see some unique shops...which is generally how the smaller malls go, and this is basically what this would be, a small mall.

[Captain Zissou]

Myself, I'd love to see a chain store such as Target there, given that I prefer to shop locally instead of traveling across town.

I don't think that's how most people define 'shopping locally', but to each his own.

[Springfielder]

I generally only spend my money at the local places...in my neighborhood. However, I see what you're saying, but think about it...there will be money that stays here, people employed, people who will dine in the area, and of course, taxes paid...so, although it's a chain, it's still local

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

I generally only spend my money at the local places...in my neighborhood. However, I see what you're saying, but think about it...there will be money that stays here, people employed, people who will dine in the area, and of course, taxes paid...so, although it's a chain, it's still local

And cue Chris.....

Right, but that's a flawed analysis Tufsu. What really matters is how much money makes it back into the local economy. The reality is very little. All we're really doing is subsidizing a money-losing business so that SMG in Chicago, Omni Hotels in Dallas, and whatever corporate chain restaurants they all operate, can make money. It's us as a local community handing over money to giant corporations thousands of miles away.

If you look at this alleged trickle-down effect, it doesn't exist. The extent of any of these players' local involvement is almost nil, they are remotely-run and hire as few employees as possible at as close to minimum wage as possible to do the physical running of the facility, and then the income is shipped out to support a corporate infrastructure located elsewhere. You or I, nor the rest of this community, will ever see the lion's share of the income generated off this business, despite being forced to fund it as taxpayers. Your normal hotel has a banquet/functions manager and a general manager that make a 6-figure salary, a couple mid-level management types pulling $50k, and then the other 98% making $7/hr with no benefits.

If you just do the math on that, it's already parasitic because that's not a living wage, which means we're all supporting some portion of their healthcare when they visit an ER, and likely some portion of their rent and food and transportation as well depending on what assistance programs they're on. These type of businesses (corporate chain restaurants, hotels, etc.) are exactly what DO NOT give back to a community, because the profits are shipped back to wherever the corporation is located and their involvement with the community is deliberately focused on paying as little to anyone as possible. There is a larger debate here, on the fairness involved in paying someone what you know they can't live on, but I digress.

This is not a substitute, in any way shape or form, for an actual industry (manufacturing, shipping, etc.) that pays a living wage and has roots in the community. We should get out of this taxpayer-subsidized money-losing business, that does nothing but hand out our local tax dollars to foreign corporations.

The corporation has to be headquartered in Jacksonville for the money to stay in Jacksonville....   

[fieldafm]

However, I see what you're saying, but think about it...there will be money that stays here, people employed, people who will dine in the area, and of course, taxes paid...so, although it's a chain, it's still local

About 30% of the money stays local at a chain... a true local mom and pop has about 70% circulation locally for comparison.

In Springfield however, ANY business needs to be supported. 

[Springfielder]

I know what a true mom & pop store is....as for the other figure of 30%, it's still 30% if tax revenue that isn't there now. Like I said before, I feel it would be beneficial to have a chain as the anchor and the rest with the little shops.

[Bativac]

However, I see what you're saying, but think about it...there will be money that stays here, people employed, people who will dine in the area, and of course, taxes paid...so, although it's a chain, it's still local

About 30% of the money stays local at a chain... a true local mom and pop has about 70% circulation locally for comparison.

In Springfield however, ANY business needs to be supported. 

Yeah, at this point, anything opening up in this space (well, short of a strip joint or something) would need neighborhood support. Wouldn't it be great to argue over which national chain was going to open up a new store at the site of the old Park View?

[fieldafm]

Oh believe me, I've been sounding the Park View site as a multi-use commercial building with self-contained parking for some time.  Go back, as I compared this parcel with a similar concept in Jax Beach.

Due to the high volume of traffic at the corner, the needs of the surrounding community(DT working population and residential population in Springfield) and the limited footprint... a drug store chain is the MOST viable option.  I can say for sure that you can forget about Target and WalMart... none of those have current plans anywhere near that area.

[cgaskins]

Any updates on this project?

[Bativac]

Any updates on this project?

This and the Laura Street Trio project are in the same corner of the Magic Kingdom. They are separated there by a long stretch of greenspace in front of the Courthouse. And that courthouse only cost $140 million!

[copperfiend]

This and the Laura Street Trio project are in the same corner of the Magic Kingdom. They are separated there by a long stretch of greenspace in front of the Courthouse. And that courthouse only cost $140 million!

Is that between Fuddrucker's and Ikea?

[Bativac]

This and the Laura Street Trio project are in the same corner of the Magic Kingdom. They are separated there by a long stretch of greenspace in front of the Courthouse. And that courthouse only cost $140 million!

Is that between Fuddrucker's and Ikea?

Exactly, right across from the Macy's!