Skyway Merits Debated

[thelakelander]

Economic development alone makes systems like streetcars worth investing in.  Tampa's TECO streetcar line gets less riders a day than the skyway but it has stimulated over $1 billion in private development along its route since 2002.  Assuming I had the money, I'd invest $100 million for a return of $1 billion in less than a decade any day.

[CS Foltz]

lake I do agree! It has been proven over and over and still the powers that be, continue to push the likes of "BRT" which is just as good as rail ....right? Until the lights go on or the next Mayor starts pushing for this, we are doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past! BRT is nothing but a continuation of JTA policy and I don't see anyone pushing BRT.........any where!

[ChriswUfGator]

Instead of "BRT" I think a more approiate name would have been "FART";

F:@#$'ed up beyond
A: All
R: Repair
T: ransit

[buckethead]

Forget
About
Real
Transit?

[ChriswUfGator]

Forget
About
Real
Transit?

Love it!

[cityimrov]

Why was the Skyway built as a monorail instead of a rail system like Chicago's L Trains?  At least with the L Trains, the tracks could be cheaply put on the ground and the rail system would be easily convertible.  Extending a monorail track, especially a monorail track that depends on concrete, isn't cheap.  

[thelakelander]

Because the skyway was a federal demonstration people mover project that Jacksonville competed for and won.  Also, the L is third rail.  To construct such a system in Jax would be just as expensive (probably more) than the skyway.

[Coolyfett]

Why was the Skyway built as a monorail instead of a rail system like Chicago's L Trains?  At least with the L Trains, the tracks could be cheaply put on the ground and the rail system would be easily convertible.  Extending a monorail track, especially a monorail track that depends on concrete, isn't cheap.  

The current track is overbuilt....the beam is on a track. all monorail needs from what Ive read is just the beam & beam support. The undertrack that the beam sits on was the rail waste of money...maybe Ock can correct me if Im wrong.

[Coolyfett]

Because the skyway was a federal demonstration people mover project that Jacksonville competed for and won.  Also, the L is third rail.  To construct such a system in Jax would be just as expensive (probably more) than the skyway.

I was thinking that too. L Train costing more

[cityimrov]

Because the skyway was a federal demonstration people mover project that Jacksonville competed for and won.  Also, the L is third rail.  To construct such a system in Jax would be just as expensive (probably more) than the skyway.

Would it cost more to extend a monorail system to the airport or a 3rd rail system to the airport?  

[thelakelander]

3rd rail would cost more.  To get a system to airport, we're better off focusing on commuter (currently proposed) or light rail.

[cityimrov]

Can a light rail run on the existing elevated portions of the skyway? 

[Ocklawaha]

Yes, third rail would absolutely blow the bank and every good old conservative on the board would simply die of heart failure... Hell Lake  and I might too!

Basically with third rail one is talking about a FULL SIZE RAILROAD on an elevated or subway structure. Do the math, BILLIONS! The old Chicago CTA (back when Ock was a pup) linked directly with the Chicago, North Shore and Milwaukee, AKA: North Shore Line Interurban. What would easily be known today as America's first HIGH SPEED RAIL line.  The big interurbans would haul ass between the two lakeside cities and hook up with the CTA and Milwaukee streetcars at each end. Even today the "Village of East Troy Railway" is a small part of the old system still under the original wires that feed freight from East Troy WI into the national network.

The Skyway is a Bombardier UMIII Monorail, which was marketed as a low cost, light transit vehicle. While I too question not only the Skyway in it's original form, I also question if this low cost vehicle was anywhere near the price tag of streetcar. Granted Monorail has certain advantages over streetcar, and in a complete FUBAR downtown where traffic is backed up to Union Street trying to move south, I'd rather be on the Skyway, how often does that happen? Was it worth the cost?

In any case we now have a monorail system which "could be" expanded for somewhat less if they don't hang 200 tons of extra Gate Concrete on it.

Light rail on the Skyway would require some major alterations to the stations themselves as the right-of-way is too narrow, otherwise it could be done and would certainly support it.


OCKLAWAHA

[cityimrov]

I was looking at the Skyway and thought to myself - "They are using a lot of concrete to build this thing".  It looks like it would have been cheaper to build it using steel beams.  

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a1/JTA_Skyway_train.jpg

Although the concrete does make the tracks look prettier. 

[Ocklawaha]

Similar monorail system in Kuala-Lampur, note that in the USA we would probably require a steel mesh catwalk between the tracks for emergencies but certainly not the walled city they built with the Skyway.

The walls on the Skyway are for noise abatement btw.

OCKLAWAHA