SPAR Tries to Pass Law to Ban Non Family Members from Living Together.

[braeburn]

The question was to you Stephendare- should there be no limit on single family home? Should I be allowed to cram 45 unrelated individuals into 1 bath 1 bedroom home, no matter what neighborhood it's in?

And my question was to you iluvolives...

[iluvolives]

I have no issue with boarding homes or recovery homes, braeburn, I grew up my entire life in riverside with one two doors down from my home with no issues. However I do feel that there should be regulation on the number of unrelated individuals  living in a single family home, otherwise it should be reclassified as multi family. As I have stated, my main issue with the thread is that it is misleading in the fact that it is saying that SPAR is creating a new law (where one already exists) and the fear mungoring that is implies that families with adopted children may be pushed out on the streets- it's ridiculous. 

[Springfield Girl]

Lisa,

Well, as you are on the board, and I have been told that you have said that SPAR Council, or actually the phrase used was “we”, are going ahead with the “new legislation”, I find you not knowing about it as being very odd.  If  I were you I would make a few calls and find out what’s going on. A suggestion just in case you really are out  of the loop.

 

You might want to start taking your own advice and go straight to the source instead of listening to what others supposedly have said. The whole "We are going ahead with the new legislation" quote that supposedly came from me is a complete fabrication. I think you know that sources you are using are not reliable or knowledgable but you would rather the hype. You might want to look in the mirror when calling people liars. You have accused me falsely and called me a liar many times and I'm tired of the hypocrasy. From someone who likes to threaten legal action I would think that you would refrain from constantly accusing innocent people of imaginary actions.

[strider]

My Quote:
Well, as you are on the board, and I have been told that you have said that SPAR Council, or actually the phrase used was “we”, are going ahead with the “new legislation”, I find you not knowing about it as being very odd. If I were you I would make a few calls and find out what’s going on. A suggestion just in case you really are out of the loop.

Lisa's quote:
You might want to start taking your own advice and go straight to the source instead of listening to what others supposedly have said. The whole "We are going ahead with the new legislation" quote that supposedly came from me is a complete fabrication. I think you know that sources you are using are not reliable or knowledgable but you would rather the hype.

Well, it is true that I am basing that comment on the word of someone else.  However, I have heard it several times so I doubt very much that it is a complete fabrication.  I will ask about it again, but for now, I will concede that there may be a communication error and will apologize to you for my previous statement.  However, the rest of my post certainly does stand.  You do need to make a few calls and see what is going on as it seems you are being kept in the dark.  The written proof exists that SPAR Council is having Dr. Gaffney draft some kind of legislation about this issue.

You might want to look in the mirror when calling people liars. You have accused me falsely and called me a liar many times and I'm tired of the hypocrasy. From someone who likes to threaten legal action I would think that you would refrain from constantly accusing innocent people of imaginary actions.

You also need to go look in that mirror as you have repeatedly, as a board member of SPAR Council, been a party a smear campaign against me, and worse, against a whole group of legal residents of Springfield, that is more often than not based on bold faced lies and not a campaign just on public forums where you sometimes expect things like this, but in E-mails to and in meetings with many city officials.  Statements that have no truth to them have been mailed to the public or e-mailed and posted by members of SPAR Council and the Executive board on multiple occasions.  And the legal action I have threatened has been only twice. First during the legal action taken against us two years ago and second recently to say that further harassment would result in legal action. We are heading that way.

This brings me to this; what innocent people am I accusing of imaginary actions?  The members of SPAR Council that I have accused of anything are far from innocent as proven by the e-mails they send, the laws they misquote and the actions they take. And those e-mails, false statements and unfounded complaints I have copies are far from imaginary.

[strider]

is there any number that you feel would be reasonable to limit the number of unrelated individuals (not including law, marriage or blood) living in a single family home that should be regulated?

Perhaps the answer you are looking for is that there is no need to set a new limit, one already exists.  It has existed for many years.  It is basically written that up to five (5) unrelated adults are defined as a family and may live in a single family home.  As stated earlier in this thread, there is no limit on those related by blood, marriage, ETC. 

Why not just leave it be then?  Well, if you do not like the men and women who use that part of the law to live together as a family unit, you look for ways to stop them from doing it.  If the current laws do not work to move these people out, then you must look for ways around the law. We have it an very good authority that someone involved with SPAR Council did ask if the city could just harass us until we moved, but as that would not be legal nor morally proper, they got told no, the city wouldn’t do that.

So, how do you get these people out of your neighborhood?  As you keep pushing the Code Enforcement for an answer, you hear that the owners of the houses complained about do not have to let code enforcement people into the homes so the proving  an illegal use is harder to do. 

This leave you with three basic choices.  One is to accept that these people have every right to be here.  Another is to try to get a law passed that would enable code enforcement to enter complained about houses without owner permission.  But that sounds a bit 1984 to me.

Another, and the most likely option is to somehow change the definition of a family and a single family home.  This can be accomplished by reducing the number of unrelated people who may reside in a single family home or possibly somehow redefining a “family” of unrelated people as something else other than a family and so eliminating them from being able to live in a single family home. However, the latter seems a little bit of a stretch and the former is an easier sell.  I say that because one can find other communities that  have lower numbers in some cases. 

So, above is what we believe is going on.  The written proof that has been backed up by verbal confirmation is that something at least on these lines is indeed going to be introduced.  It is my contention than all of the possible choices are morally corrupt and all have far reaching and very bad consequences for all of Jacksonville.

[cindi]

if you have multiple "families" living under one roof - why not call it what it is, "multi-family"?

[Springfield Girl]

Joe, I don't believe multiple people have given you this false information about me and it IS false. All of these SPAR themed posts sound like one big conspiracy theory being fanned by a few people. The big thing everyone seems to be missing is that SPAR is not some random, rougue group but an organization made up of individual residents of Springfield. We do not give up our right to have individual opinions like every other resident because we happen to sit on a board that meets once a month for a couple of hours. Much of the day to day goings on are handled by the executive board and staff of which I am not part of. Many have tried to quiet my opinion and those of others by labeling us SPAR, board members, developers or any other group they may deem not worthy of having an opinion. When I post I am always speaking my opinion not that of any group including SPAR and that is my right. If you want to get an official SPAR stance contact the executive director or a member of the executive board.

[AlexS]

I was trying to research the current "single family" law on the books. I could not find where it defines what a "family" is in regard to zoning laws. If it's defined in City ordinance, Florida Statutes or Federal Law, could someone who has this info please post where it is defined ?

[Springfield Girl]

I dont know if its a big conspiracy, and its certainly not a very unusual or uncommon kind of a thing.

When SPAR was doing good things in the community, it had less than 50 thousand a year budgets.

Once it started trying to drive out people who would 'bring down property values' or demolishing buildings that 'brought down property values', and declaring war on the owners of commercial property pressuring them to sell or else, suddenly it had triple the budgets---up to 175,000.00 dollars a year, funded directly by the people making money off of the real estate honey pot.

What is complex or difficult to understand about that?

What is difficult for me to understand about it, is why is the neighborhood supposed to put up with this malarky?

Stephen, I just don't see proof of this. I'm sure there are individuals that feel this way but I just don't see proof of a concerted effort by a group and SPAR has no authority to tear down properties, kick people out or force anyone to sell. No one is trying to kick groups of people out of the neighborhood, just restrict new boarding/halfway homes from opening per the zoning code. OK, I have to correct this. As individual residents we have tried pretty hard to run the criminals out out of the neighborhood and have been pretty successful. As far as the numbers, that additional money was not SPAR's to spend. The crime fund and litter patrol funds which were donated by individuals or businesses just ran through SPAR. The office took the money in and paid it to the groups it was designated for by those donating. 

[fsu813]

Stephen,

you couldn't misrepresent this issue more if you tried. "You won't be able to invite your college friends over if SPAR gets thier way!!!"

Geez. This is Fox News level of disingenuous manipulation of facts & intent.

This is about enoforcing CURRENT laws, for a most part.

Your various facebooks comments post earlier are ridiculous. The opinion's of those who OWN property in the area trump those whio are just passing through. Care to guess where most property owner's opinions fall on this issue?

You've already stated that'd you'd be fine with 50 non-realted people living in a residence, if the owner was ok with it.

This puts you in a very small, very odd minority. Which is a good thing.

And you continue to act like this is a shocking, unheard of act by SPAR when in realty this is common across the US.

How about being more honest and less shadey? That would do wonders for your credibility on this and future issues.

[Springfield Girl]

I think a community wide summit would be a great idea. Lets all get together and have a vote once and for all. All voters would have to have proof of a springfield address.

[Springfield Girl]

I would assume any concerted effort would be to keep Joe from expanding his empire, something he promised us profusely he would not do back when we worked on a compromise last year. A promise that everyone from City Council members, GC, city employees and Spar members heard loud and clear but wasn't kept.

[Springfield Girl]

You left out my last sentence. Why should anyone who doesn't live, own property or have a business in the neighborhood have a say? I don't try to tell other people what they should or shouldn't do in their neighborhoods.

I think a community wide summit would be a great idea. Lets all get together and have a vote once and for all. All voters would have to have proof of a springfield address.
[/quote

[Springfield Girl]

What question did you want me to answer earlier?

[Springfield Girl]

Of course no one has to ask SPAR for anything but sometimes it is a helpful first stop.