New proposed convenience store in Springfield

[fsu813]

educated guess
     
ed·u·cat·ed guess (plural ed·u·cat·ed guess·es)

noun 

Definition:
 
informed guess: a guess that is based on a degree of experience, knowledge, or information

[sheclown]

Then ...hopes for growth are futile...

If a convenience store, built as such...screwed by crazy and lazy zoning...is forced to turn into an industrial site because we are afraid of loiterers, the outlook is not so good.

[iloveionia]

Gloria,

There is a big difference between fear and disliking. Loitering is illegal in most cities and in front of most businesses.  I prefer to shop in peace and not be harassed.  A lot of businesses boast that they don't allow people to loiter, panhandle, ask for signatures, etc.  I truly appreciate that.  For example, I appreciate that I can shop at my local grocery store in peace, they are big on avoiding all the aforementioned peeves of mine.

I am not personally AFRAID of loiterers.  I dislike what they are doing.  I get that they are in a bad place in their lives.  It is not that I don't want to help those in need, I just don't want to help in this fashion.  I want to shop in peace. 

New business in Springfield = good.  Convenience stores are on every corner (exaggerating, but that is what it feels like to me,)  I don't want another.

Peace.  That's all I want. 

[sheclown]

Ionia,  I hear you; however, a "light industrial" zoning designation does anything BUT offers peace.  It offers factories and outdoor storage.  And there is nothing wrong with it in the warehouse district...except that this property was obviously a convenience store, built as such, intended to be one.

Isn't there any middle ground?  Couldn't we, as neighbors, contact the owner and find out how s/he feels about implementing a loitering policy?

In downtown areas, there are convenience stores on every corner.  And the fact that this business wants to open is good for the warehouse district.  It could bring some life into it.  It could also draw some business from the Swisher plant only a few streets up and make them leave some of their dollars in Springfield.  When the plant lets out, it is bumper to bumper (potential) customers.

[strider]

You need to go find out what the actual plans are for this store and then perhaps you can make an informed decission. So far, all of the negative has been is a reaction to the "not another convenience store" and not really based on fact but rather fear.

The urban core is not all about having that perfect house, 2.6 kids and a dog. If you moved to the urban core to have that suburban feel, you goofed.

Let me state once again:  as has been proven time and time again in other areas,  the best way to make the streets better is better lighting and more uses. Empty is bad, used is good.

[tpot]

Strider, you make assumptions.............saying that I or any others for that matter, need to check out the plans before we make what you call an "informed decission" is ridiculous.  You have no idea what research I have or have not done.  Just because my feelings about a convience store in SPR differ from yours does not make my decision "uninformed."  It simply differs from yours.

[thelakelander]

Can anyone share any personal research they may have on this project?  This would be the best way to eliminate any assumptions.

[ChriswUfGator]

I was going to say we should just start a new thread entitled "What Springfield DOESNT WANT" and consolidate all this kvetching about thrift stores, carwashes, convenience stores, BP's, Shell stations, a Community Center, homes for disabled veterans, sober houses, etc., etc., etc., ad nauseum.

But then I realized MetroJax would probably have to buy a whole new server. Then I realized the federal goverment would also probably need to install a whole new DNS just to handle all the bitching and complaining. FWIW, I think the new domain should be ".snotty"...

Seriously, that's all people say over there "we don't want....we don't want..." while 90% of the commercial property is vacant or has already been bulldozed. Within a mile of my house there are at least 6 convenience stores, and I am sure I'm forgetting to count a couple. Nobody is bitching about it over here, it's actually nice to have a place open at those hours where I can grab bottled water or some milk if I come in on a late flight. Are there some ghetto looking people around them getting beer/cigs/lotto/whatever? Yeah, sometimes. But so what? You're not there to make friends. And those people clearly live nearby anyhow or they wouldn't be there, so it's not like the store has anything to do with it. Most of them are real well-run.

[hooplady]

I'm not sure I understand the economics of a convenience store in this location.  There are already four stores on 8th between Hubbard and Walnut (I'm counting the liquor store).  Liberty & 11th is on the far edge of the residential district with the warehouse district to the north.  Where is their customer base?

It probably made sense when the industrial buildings were full and humming; a store could turn a profit on those workers during the daylight hours.  But now...not sure this is even viable.

[thelakelander]

Would it be the closest to an expanding Swisher and their +1,000 employees?

[iloveionia]

You need to go find out what the actual plans are for this store and then perhaps you can make an informed decission. So far, all of the negative has been is a reaction to the "not another convenience store" and not really based on fact but rather fear.

The urban core is not all about having that perfect house, 2.6 kids and a dog. If you moved to the urban core to have that suburban feel, you goofed.

Let me state once again:  as has been proven time and time again in other areas,  the best way to make the streets better is better lighting and more uses. Empty is bad, used is good.

You are correct Strider in regards to making an informed decision.  It takes time to gather information.  Two friends have helped me gather information.  With a full time job that takes up my 7-5 p.m., it has taken me a few days.  I will SUMMARIZE in brief what I have:

Joe Joseph owns a number of convenience stores and warehouses in economically deprived areas of Jax.  He and his family have an LLC that also owns several pieces of property too.  He has not committed any major crimes that can be noted.

At this point, I plan on attending the hearing to gather more information, directly from Mr. Joseph.  I could call him, the city, etc.  but the hearing is a hop, skip, and a jump away, I can wait until then.

And for the record, I am from the urban core, Los Angeles, California to be exact.  Oh, I get it,  but you have it wrong.  It's about having a perfect house, 1 kid, and a pack of SACARC dogs.  I didn't goof.  I just want for something different than a convenience store.

Historic Springfield is a great neighborhood that is much more peaceful than any part of Los Angeles.  Hooplady states as I, WAY too many convenience stores. . .

Now if Mr. Joseph wanted to put in a breakfast/lunch diner type establishment; Whoot, Whoot!  It is about wanting to grow from where we are, not stay stagnant with like the 100th convenience store opening up (yeah, yeah, I am exaggerating.)  I don't necessarily agree with the "empty is bad, used is good" concept, but I get what you are trying to say.  It certainly depends on HOW something is used and then maintained.  Will the convenience store be bad?  Dunno.  The gathering of information continues.  But for the meantime, what is wrong with wanting something different?  And by the way.  I LOVE thrift stores, antique shops, retro stores, yards sales, etc.  The junk of another is a thrill of a find for me.

[fsu813]

if you have the locations of his other conveniences stores, one could gather a lot of info by simply visiting them and seeing how they are maintained and operated.

[thelakelander]

^Good point.

[iloveionia]

everyone thinks alike, eh?
it is on my list of to dos prior to the hearing.
;-)

[hooplady]

Would it be the closest to an expanding Swisher and their +1,000 employees?

Wow, I didn't know Swisher had that many!  Yes, in that case it would make perfect sense.

And Ionia, I wasn't necessarily saying that there are "too many" convenience stores.  Like you, I would love to have more diversity in our retail choices but I can't argue that there are too many if they all seem to stay busy.  Adam Smith would say we have the right amount, I guess.