Jaxtoberfest relocating from downtown to SJTC

[Adam White]

To be honest, I don't think "most" people in Jax care where Jaxtoberfest is located. The mindset in Jax isn't significantly different from the general mindset across the majority of the country. This place is just a much smaller community than most of us believe. This is Dayton, OH with a lot more suburbs and a beach. This isn't meant to be a knock on Jax. It's just the reality of a smaller 200k city, consolidating with its core county.

I agree with the comment that most people wouldn't care in most places in America, or anywhere for that matter, people are pretty similar personality and interests-wise no matter where you are in the world from what I've found.  But this has nothing to do with Jacksonville being a smaller city.  My hometown Kalamazoo, MI was lame as hell when I was younger and people didn't care one way or another about anything like this, that was until they started improving downtown and holding large festivals like this downtown, not at shopping malls.  It gave people a different perspective and opinion of their city.  Still not the greatest place on earth but that town has seen huge improvements and civic pride as a result.  I've lived in Greenville, SC as well . . . . . same thing.  So I don't believe it's because Jacksonville is not the size of Chicago or Atlanta, etc.  Jacksonville is actually much bigger than those two smaller cities I've mentioned even if you just take the central area, not all of Duval County.  I believe the actual city populations of Kalamazoo and Greenville are both around 100k.

I guess I went about it the wrong way. I don't think it's a big deal that this event is moving to SJTC. I believe, we're making it a bigger deal than it really is because we're so focused on wanting to see DT Jax succeed. We've literally put it in our heads that a strip mall like SJTC actually competes against DT Jax. However, if we look, I'm sure we'll find several examples of private events moving, from some of the most vibrant downtown cores in the country, to other areas of their respective metropolitan areas regardless of city size.

As soon as major brand stores/restaurants move downtown and all the Mandarin and St. Johns County folks start coming downtown, these same people will bemoan all the newcomers who don't "get" downtown and how this is "their area" and all the fat white jort-wearing church-goers should stay in mandarin.

You know, that other thread popped into my head as well when reading this one. You make a good point.

[CCMjax]

Fyi: It was moved to SJTC because all of the other viable venues around Downtown were booked. Selling alcohol for-profit greatly limits the possible venues.

Thanks for the info Hoff, if that is true then the move to SJTC is understandable.

AW - I think the hate on the SJTC (at least for me) is not because it is a mall, it does serve a purpose and I go there myself every once and a while.  There is a place and market for malls and every city has them, I'm cool with that.  I get frustrated when people try to use it as an example of successful urban development, which it is not at all.  It is a successful twist on suburban style mall development in terms of profit for the developers and options provided for the customers only, and people like it because it's nicer and fresher than Avenues.  It is kind of nice once you're out of your car and you're right on the main strip but it doesn't really make the area around it nicer, just adds to the traffic counts, like most suburban strip style developments.  And it is not a community, it is an outparcel and big box development with an attempt at a faux main street in the middle of it, but it cannot in any way be classified as a real neighborhood.  My main beef with relocating a festival to the town center is that I would like to see Jaxtoberfest get better in Jax, and I think locating it in a mall parking lot doesn't really improve the festival.  I also think focusing on the TC as the epicenter of the Jacksonville area is a bad thing. 

[Adam White]

Fyi: It was moved to SJTC because all of the other viable venues around Downtown were booked. Selling alcohol for-profit greatly limits the possible venues.

Thanks for the info Hoff, if that is true then the move to SJTC is understandable.

AW - I think the hate on the SJTC (at least for me) is not because it is a mall, it does serve a purpose and I go there myself every once and a while.  There is a place and market for malls and every city has them, I'm cool with that.  I get frustrated when people try to use it as an example of successful urban development, which it is not at all.  It is a successful twist on suburban style mall development in terms of profit for the developers and options provided for the customers only, and people like it because it's nicer and fresher than Avenues.  It is kind of nice once you're out of your car and you're right on the main strip but it doesn't really make the area around it nicer, just adds to the traffic counts, like most suburban strip style developments.  And it is not a community, it is an outparcel and big box development with an attempt at a faux main street in the middle of it, but it cannot in any way be classified as a real neighborhood.  My main beef with relocating a festival to the town center is that I would like to see Jaxtoberfest get better in Jax, and I think locating it in a mall parking lot doesn't really improve the festival.  I also think focusing on the TC as the epicenter of the Jacksonville area is a bad thing.

I don't disagree with you there. It's a mall. I like it for what it offers. I guess it could function as a local "town centre" but it certainly isn't an example of successful urban development. I'm glad it is doing well - I hope it doesn't fall into disrepair as the other once-successful malls in Jax have done. We'll see.

There's no reason why SJTC can't thrive alongside a successful downtown.

[MusicMan]

So what is Jaxtoberfest?

A celebration of Fall weather and the art of beer making?

If you're doing this in Jacksonville and not featuring our amazing local breweries, why do it at all?

[Adam White]

So what is Jaxtoberfest?

A celebration of Fall weather and the art of beer making?

If you're doing this in Jacksonville and not featuring our amazing local breweries, why do it at all?

They seem to be offering a number of German beers that are traditionally sold at Oktoberfest. Well, they're going to have Hacker-Pschorr and Paulaner. Maybe it's more about "Octoberfest" and less about Jacksonville.

I reckon it's just an attempt by someone (brewers, distributors) to make a buck by selling beer to people.

[coredumped]

As has been stated several times, it isnt being held in a parking lot. It';s being held in a grassy field, several sizes larger than the Shipyards.  But keep fucking that chicken, guy.  It's fun to circle-jerk about how awful the SJTC is and one-up one another on how much we loooooooooooooove downtown.  I love downtown x 1,000,000,0000,000,000, 000. I love downtown so much I took it behind the middle school and got it pregnant.  Beat that.

The amount of energy being wasted here, and on facebook and other places, over this festival and it's location is supremely ridiculous. 

[fsquid]

maybe I'm blind but looking at an overhead picture of that area, where is this alleged grassy field?

[CCMjax]

Fyi: It was moved to SJTC because all of the other viable venues around Downtown were booked. Selling alcohol for-profit greatly limits the possible venues.

Thanks for the info Hoff, if that is true then the move to SJTC is understandable.

AW - I think the hate on the SJTC (at least for me) is not because it is a mall, it does serve a purpose and I go there myself every once and a while.  There is a place and market for malls and every city has them, I'm cool with that.  I get frustrated when people try to use it as an example of successful urban development, which it is not at all.  It is a successful twist on suburban style mall development in terms of profit for the developers and options provided for the customers only, and people like it because it's nicer and fresher than Avenues.  It is kind of nice once you're out of your car and you're right on the main strip but it doesn't really make the area around it nicer, just adds to the traffic counts, like most suburban strip style developments.  And it is not a community, it is an outparcel and big box development with an attempt at a faux main street in the middle of it, but it cannot in any way be classified as a real neighborhood.  My main beef with relocating a festival to the town center is that I would like to see Jaxtoberfest get better in Jax, and I think locating it in a mall parking lot doesn't really improve the festival.  I also think focusing on the TC as the epicenter of the Jacksonville area is a bad thing.

As has been stated several times, it isnt being held in a parking lot. It';s being held in a grassy field, several sizes larger than the Shipyards.  But keep fucking that chicken, guy.  It's fun to circle-jerk about how awful the SJTC is and one-up one another on how much we loooooooooooooove downtown.  I love downtown x 1,000,000,0000,000,000, 000. I love downtown so much I took it behind the middle school and got it pregnant.  Beat that.

The amount of energy being wasted here, and on facebook and other places, over this festival and it's location is supremely ridiculous.

Way to go!  Troll on!  It's a discussion board to share thoughts, not a council meeting trying to figure out how to solve the city's issues.  Your trolling is a waste of time.   

Tag your it!

[acme54321]

Tag your it!

*you're*

[Tacachale]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

[Adam White]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

Great minds think alike:

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/forum/index.php/topic,24503.msg415046.html#msg415046

[Adam White]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

Oh, dude, I LOVE the Circle Jerks (Have you HEARD "Wild in the Streets"? God DAMN it smokes!), but I am not sure what that has to do with anything...

I always thought they were overrated - but I was never a huge fan of LA hardcore anyway. Like I never understood Black Flag's appeal.

[Tacachale]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

Oh, dude, I LOVE the Circle Jerks (Have you HEARD "Wild in the Streets"? God DAMN it smokes!), but I am not sure what that has to do with anything...

I always thought they were overrated - but I was never a huge fan of LA hardcore anyway. Like I never understood Black Flag's appeal.

They had some good tunes, but their influence definitely outpaced their talent. I wished more of those musicians had listened to the Minutemen rather than Black Flag and the dozens of other indistinguishable bands.

Wait, what were we talking about?

[fieldafm]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

Oh, dude, I LOVE the Circle Jerks (Have you HEARD "Wild in the Streets"? God DAMN it smokes!), but I am not sure what that has to do with anything...

I always thought they were overrated - but I was never a huge fan of LA hardcore anyway. Like I never understood Black Flag's appeal.

They had some good tunes, but their influence definitely outpaced their talent. I wished more of those musicians had listened to the Minutemen rather than Black Flag and the dozens of other indistinguishable bands.

Wait, what were we talking about?

Minutemen is pretty intertwined with Black Flag (considering they toured together and recorded music together). The better question is, who was Black Flag's best frontman? My vote is Mike Vallely because he skates... and that pretty much means he is superior to everyone else

[Adam White]

You sure do make a lot of circle jerk references. Do you ever think maybe it's not everyone else who's fixated on circle jerks, maybe it's just you?

Oh, dude, I LOVE the Circle Jerks (Have you HEARD "Wild in the Streets"? God DAMN it smokes!), but I am not sure what that has to do with anything...

I always thought they were overrated - but I was never a huge fan of LA hardcore anyway. Like I never understood Black Flag's appeal.

They had some good tunes, but their influence definitely outpaced their talent. I wished more of those musicians had listened to the Minutemen rather than Black Flag and the dozens of other indistinguishable bands.

Totally agree.