Time to switch to sustainable energy, even locally.

[stephendare]

This clip is between Bill Maher and Jeffrey Sachs on sustainable energy.

Please check out the video and discuss.

Why shouldnt Jacksonville start investing in alternative energy for our citizens?


http://www.youtube.com/v/QTbTBQj2VJk

[fightingosprey07]

Does JEA have any plans for sustainable energy generation? I was surprised to see that they are building a natural gas plant soon. I wonder if they even considered a nuclear plant. The southside might not be the best place to put one, but we're definitely not short on land in this city.

[downtownparks]

I could have sworn they have been touting their alt energy resume in commercials recently. I do know they have Solar cells, as well as coal, and natural gas fired plants. Right before they started raising prices annually (a few years ago now), they used to have a commercial that said they didn't have to raise prices the way other company's did because they were diversified in power generation.

Again, this is all off the top of my head, so I could be wrong.

[JeffreyS]

Walking underneath the Main street bridge this morning the current seemed strong enough for some form of hydroelectric power.  The day you can spend one or two thousand dollars on a solar panel that will handle most of your homes needs will be a tipping point.

[Jason]

Walking underneath the Main street bridge this morning the current seemed strong enough for some form of hydroelectric power.  The day you can spend one or two thousand dollars on a solar panel that will handle most of your homes needs will be a tipping point.

There is a system out there touting affordability.  Check it out here: http://renu.citizenre.com/
I'm still skeptical but haven't found one sound reason to deny their legitimacy.

I could have sworn they have been touting their alt energy resume in commercials recently. I do know they have Solar cells, as well as coal, and natural gas fired plants. Right before they started raising prices annually (a few years ago now), they used to have a commercial that said they didn't have to raise prices the way other company's did because they were diversified in power generation.

Again, this is all off the top of my head, so I could be wrong.

You're right.  JEA uses multiple kinds of fuel for power generation (ie low sulfer coal, petrolium coke, natural gas, and solar).  The reason we aren't getting nuke plants (which they have clearly stated they want) is because the state isn't allowing them.  Many southeastern utilities ahve moved forward with permitting and construction of nuke plants but for some reason Florida doesn't want them.  The next problem is that even if the State says the will allow them and JEA started on the paperwork, design, etc. it would still be up to 10 years befor construction could begin and a couple years to finish.  The approval process is astronimically slow.

[Lunican]

The Renu/Citizenre thing may be dead. I think they were relying on the availability of cheap solar cells which may not have panned out. If you do a search on Google there are many articles referencing them as a failure and even possible scam. I haven't looked into it too much though. Does anyone know anything definitive?

[Driven1]

http://www.jea.com/community/conservcenter/programs/solar.asp

[Ocklawaha]

The name Petro-Coke is somewhat misleading as it doesn't come from oil, but produces it as a bi-product in a very light form.

Coal is converted to coke in large coke ovens. The coking process consists of heating coal in the absence of air to drive off the volatile compounds; the resulting coke is a hard, but porous carbon material that is used for reducing the iron in the blast furnace. The modern by-product coke oven recovers volatile chemicals in the form of coke oven gas, tars, and oils. Coke also burns very hot yet the process is so simple it could be done in a backyard firebrick oven.

I agree though that with some imagineering, our tides, river current, sun, wind farm on the Jettys and wave power could be captured for energy. Did you know that just North and South Dakota have enough wind to power the entire US energy grid? Yet we are still at about 1-2%, with a target of 20%. Hell my Oklahoma, or California desert place could probably power JACKSONVILLE!

Ocklawaha

[Driven1]

With rapid developments in thin-film technology, solar is going to become more and more mainstream.  Matter of fact, I was in West Marine 2 weeks ago, and there are now three different sizes of solar panels you can buy in that retail outlet - ranging in price from $300 to $900.

Was reading about something called Concentrated Solar Power (CSP) this weekend...very cool.  Consists of taking the sun's rays and, using mirrors, focusing them on water - which then boils and turns generators.  Very cool, but not nearly as researched and/or used right now as photovoltaic technology.  Spain has several of these that you can see online...they look pretty cool too.  


FPL Group (which is tied to FPL here in Florida) here in the U.S. is the only company that is research, developing this technology that I could find.  Incidentally, FPL (ticker is FPL) is the largest producer of wind energy in the U.S. also.

Getting back to PV usage...I read a few weeks ago that CA has passed a law where within 3 years or so, they have to get 20% of their energy from solar power.  Plan is to lease rooftops in LA and San Diego and put PV cells on there. 

[Lunican]

Does JEA allow net metering, meaning you can roll your meter backwards when you are generating electricity in the day?

[Driven1]

another item i read this weekend in the journal...don't remember the exact date they extended it to (maybe 2011??), but i think that congress extended the new solar installation tax credits that were due to expire in 2007.  

i personally think nuclear power (which it takes years to get a new plant up and running - at the Nuclear Resource Commission's website you can see where many new ones are in the planning/permitting stages and who is applying for the permits), followed by solar and natural gas are where more of our future energy supply will come from.  oil and coal will still play a major - but diminishing - role.  wind will grow small i think...just not as consistent.

btw...on that CSP thing i mentioned...i read that a 100 square mile field of mirrors would power the entire U.S.  who knows about the cost of getting something like that up and running, but if CVX, BP and the others agreed to direct some R&D $$$ towards that and picked up a bunch of land in AZ or NM, who knows?

[lindab]

I know they are required to buy back any energy a house produces.

You are wrong there, Stephen. As of right now, JEA only buys back to the end of the month and does not credit you for any extra they get from your production.

[Jason]

The name Petro-Coke is somewhat misleading as it doesn't come from oil, but produces it as a bi-product in a very light form.

Coal is converted to coke in large coke ovens. The coking process consists of heating coal in the absence of air to drive off the volatile compounds; the resulting coke is a hard, but porous carbon material that is used for reducing the iron in the blast furnace. The modern by-product coke oven recovers volatile chemicals in the form of coke oven gas, tars, and oils. Coke also burns very hot yet the process is so simple it could be done in a backyard firebrick oven.

I agree though that with some imagineering, our tides, river current, sun, wind farm on the Jettys and wave power could be captured for energy. Did you know that just North and South Dakota have enough wind to power the entire US energy grid? Yet we are still at about 1-2%, with a target of 20%. Hell my Oklahoma, or California desert place could probably power JACKSONVILLE!

Ocklawaha

Petrolium Coke is a byproduct of refining oil not coal.  It was once a pesky byproduct that the refineries had a hard time getting rid of.  Once they figured out it could be burned in a reactor for power generation it suddenly had a huge value.

I would think coastal seabreezes would be a big and consistent source of wind power.

The Renu/Citizenre thing may be dead. I think they were relying on the availability of cheap solar cells which may not have panned out. If you do a search on Google there are many articles referencing them as a failure and even possible scam. I haven't looked into it too much though. Does anyone know anything definitive?

I was hoping that they would make it.  The deal sounds unbeatable (on paper).  I'm going to look into them a bit more.


As far as solar power goes, once the equipment gets close to or equal with the average cost of a back-up generator ($4 - $6 thousand) for a home then the market will explode.  Imagine clean, quiet, free power during an outage.  Another perk is that the systems are designed to carry the entire load versus many generators being sized to handle about half forcing owners to use only the necessary systems and components.  Not to mention having to worry about a generator chugging a couple gallons of gas per hour....

[walter]

how about instead of brewing beer, brew some ethanol in a home brew kit... see this:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/27/technology/27proto.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

"In addition, it’s illegal in the United States to operate a car on 100 percent ethanol, with exceptions for off-road vehicles like Indy cars and farm equipment."

WTF?

[lindab]

Here's our system running since February