World Religions - Atheism Discussion Thread

[Adam W]

Einstein was also a Communist, so I guess that proves that Communism is correct, too.

[Garden guy]

Well, modern medicine calls it: Laryngeal prominence

I call it an Adam's Apple because that is what I was taught to call it.

That's funny you say that...you call it that because you were "told" that....is that what religion is....if we all keep saying it....that makes it true....perfect example of why christianity and religion is just bupkus hope turned into a lie turned into fact which is a lie...

[ronchamblin]

Ock and BT...thanks much, but please....  me and some partners on MJ are leading the way to the ultimate truth... yes, right here on MJ..., which will with time be found to be outside of religious opinion and dogma.  Some individuals, perhaps not having the time or inclination to generate arguments created within their own minds, use the statements of others who are presumed to be infallible, and while doing so, not offering other possibly contradicting statements from these individuals from elsewhere in their lives, not offering the context within which these statements occurred, and not suggesting that the use of the term "god" might be as I would use it; that is, to suggest that the term describes the perfect order of the universe, an order which is slowly being allowed our understanding as we study it, and as our continuing evolution better equips us.

I must work now, but tremble in your boots, as I will return with a vengeance, with sober logic, with concern, with wisdom, with honesty, with detailed opposition to some of the statements and arguments offered above.   

[strider]

As I have stated before, Religion is of Man, by Man and for Man and has no bearing on reality.  The teachings from the various religions, be it the Bible or the writings on the walls of ancient temples have to do with keeping the masses in line with what the religious leaders wanted, or as often the case in the Bible, to keep the followers from being fed to the lions.  Sometimes, the teachings were a form of birth control or just a way to help folks get along with each other.  Through the millennia, religions have been needed to explain what no one could explain and used as much for evil as they have been used for good.  Religions have also been used to pass on valuable information. How to be safe, how to avoid disease and avoid persecution by those in power.

As science has explained much of what the religions sought to with their teachings, the devote and their leadership can't help but seek explanations as to why their teachings are at odds with real science.   As people change, the religions must also to keep their followers. 


None of this is bad, it just is.  People as a whole need something greater than themselves to believe in.  Be it a god or just a cause to fight for.  None of us truly have all the answers, be us men of God or men of Science, which is sometimes as much of a religion as Christianity.

All of this is, of course, just one persons opinion.  My beliefs are just that, mine,  and what matters most is that they work for me.  If your beliefs work for you, well then, that's fine too.

Go with Peace.  Or May God be with you.  Or Shabbat shalom.  Or May the Force be with you.  They all mean the same in the end, do they not?

[BridgeTroll]

Ron... there really is no argument.  The quotes are simply show that some believers... HAVE thought through things as you have.  They have come to a differing possible conclusion regarding a "higher power".  The implication from many posting here and in other publications is that believers are somehow duped or delusional, or needing a crutch or simply continue on with what Mommy and daddy taught them.

This is a stereotype and a caricature.  I and many others are perfectly at peace with atheists, agnostics, christian, muslim or scientologist.  Whatever floats your boat!  Most adults have examined their belief system and have come to various conclusions.  The great part about all of this is... NONE of us know the truth... until we die!!

[ronchamblin]

Makes some sense Strider and BT, but there is more on those aspects in my view, more which I don't have the time now to discuss.  However, I am concerned about he CONSEQUENCES of thinking habits, or acting, not acting, and complacency, according to religious belief.  We've seen, I think most will agree, continue to see, questionable consequences of mass belief in religion, whether in the Middle East, in America, or right here in the city of Jax. I agree that we cannot immediately do anything about the millions who believe, as there are too many, and they are set in their thinking.  I will have to be satisfied for the moment, knowing that myself and a few others are on the right track. 

[ben says]

Ron... there really is no argument.  The quotes are simply show that some believers... HAVE thought through things as you have. 

Wrong. No believers have thought through things as Ron or any other rational/agnostic/atheistic person has. If they had, they wouldn't be religious. Religion is the cessation of rational thought. Let's not confuse the two.

[BridgeTroll]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Seems a bit irrational to me...

[ben says]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. As a species, by and large, humans are inherently irrational. Does that really come as a surprise to anybody who keeps their eyes open on a day to day basis?

Not to mention your "scientist quotes" are taken insanely, extremely, and disturbingly out of context. Laughably so.

[BridgeTroll]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. As a species, by and large, humans are inherently irrational. Does that really come as a surprise to anybody who keeps their eyes open on a day to day basis?

Not to mention your "scientist quotes" are taken insanely, extremely, and disturbingly out of context. Laughably so.

Awesome!  I bow to your superior intellect and rationality... 

[ben says]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. As a species, by and large, humans are inherently irrational. Does that really come as a surprise to anybody who keeps their eyes open on a day to day basis?

Not to mention your "scientist quotes" are taken insanely, extremely, and disturbingly out of context. Laughably so.

Awesome!  I bow to your superior intellect and rationality... 

I am not claiming I have superior intellect. In fact, this conversation has nothing to do with intellect. I certainly didn't mention it. With regards to rationality, as I said before, most if not all humans are inherently irrational. Some are more rational than others, and people can definitely become more or less rational. Just think about all the irrational things we do on a day to day basis! Especially actions based on....emotion!

[nomeus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqB3F6N527U

[Adam W]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. As a species, by and large, humans are inherently irrational. Does that really come as a surprise to anybody who keeps their eyes open on a day to day basis?

Not to mention your "scientist quotes" are taken insanely, extremely, and disturbingly out of context. Laughably so.

Awesome!  I bow to your superior intellect and rationality... 

I am not claiming I have superior intellect. In fact, this conversation has nothing to do with intellect. I certainly didn't mention it. With regards to rationality, as I said before, most if not all humans are inherently irrational. Some are more rational than others, and people can definitely become more or less rational. Just think about all the irrational things we do on a day to day basis!

It's also worth noting that a number of the scientists quoted are (or were) atheists (or similar). Stephen Hawking certainly is - and it's easy to see from the supplied quote that he was not literally referring to the actual mind of god.

[BridgeTroll]

Religion is the cessation of rational thought.

Wow... really Ben?  you are saying that the scientists quoted a few posts above along with the vast majority of human beings alive now and and past are not rational thinkers?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. As a species, by and large, humans are inherently irrational. Does that really come as a surprise to anybody who keeps their eyes open on a day to day basis?

Not to mention your "scientist quotes" are taken insanely, extremely, and disturbingly out of context. Laughably so.

Awesome!  I bow to your superior intellect and rationality... 

I am not claiming I have superior intellect. In fact, this conversation has nothing to do with intellect. I certainly didn't mention it. With regards to rationality, as I said before, most if not all humans are inherently irrational. Some are more rational than others, and people can definitely become more or less rational. Just think about all the irrational things we do on a day to day basis! Especially actions based on....emotion!

Ah... so you are simply more rational than the vast majority of humans to ever walk the earth.  I bow to you superior... um... er... rationality.

[Adam W]

Ah... so you are simply more rational than the vast majority of humans to ever walk the earth.  I bow to you superior... um... er... rationality.

You don't have to be a virtuoso to tell when someone else is singing out of tune.