Skyway Could Be Torn Down.....In 2036!

[thelakelander]

We're going the wrong way in regards to the skyway's future.  Instead of talking about making service worst for the next 25 years and driving the final nail in downtown's coffin, we should be implementing the affordable solutions that having been mentioned here for a number of years:

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2011-mar-salvaging-the-skyway

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2008-oct-re-evaluating-the-skyway

If we find a way to screw this skyway situation up (which given our history, its likely), imagine the national punchlines about being the largest city in the country with an abandoned monorail hanging over its downtown streets and what that will do for downtown revitalization.

Skyway could be torn down if ridership doesn’t improve â€" in next 25 years
Some hope a downtown resurgence will improve ridership numbers.

Skyway could be torn down if ridership doesn’t improve â€" in next 25 years
Jacksonville residents will only have about 25 more years to not ride the Skyway.

Jacksonville Transportation Authority officials, under prodding from City Council members, have conceded there may come a point when the Skyway will have to be torn down if ridership doesn’t increase.

JTA Executive Director Michael Blaylock  said the Skyway could be torn down at the end of its natural life, which would be around 2036.

Assuming the Skyway continues to run deficits of about $4 million a year, that would be an additional $100 million of taxpayers’ money gone away.

“I won’t live to see that,” Councilman Bill Gulliford  said this week.

The conversation  about the Skyway, built in the 1980s, began during budget hearings this month when Councilman Richard Clark  wondered why the Skyway was still around.

“Why are we still operating this?” Clark asked. “It’s almost become a novelty.”

People aren’t using the Skyway, and Clark doubts they ever will.

In response, Blaylock said the Skyway had not exceeded its natural life span. And if the system was shut down now, the federal government â€" which funded the project â€" would demand $70 million to $80 million back.

Full article: http://jacksonville.com/news/florida/2011-08-26/story/skyway-could-be-torn-down-if-ridership-doesnt-improve-next-25-years

[thelakelander]

Blaylock said he wasn’t looking to get rid of the Skyway, and the system still had a chance to be viable. That claim drew snickers from some City Council members.

“We’re finally seeing some hope to make the Skyway viable,” Blaylock said, “with downtown starting to come back.”

I snicker at this as well but not for the same reasons as some City Council members.  My view is that Jacksonville and JTA can't sit around and wait for ridership to increase as downtown revitalizes.  In my opinion, downtown isn't going to revitalize without mass transit and the skyway playing a huge leading role in that process.  Instead of waiting to win the lottery (we have a better chance of getting struck by lighting twice), let's work to come up with affordable solutions that reduce operational costs while increasing ridership now.

[peestandingup]

Thats typical Jacksonville leadership mentality isn't it. Build something half-assed, don't maintain what you do have, then wonder why no one is using it.

[thelakelander]

I kind of see the majority of Council as suburbanites who may not even know the full history of the skyway, how mass transit works in general or what the impact of downtown revitalization will mean for this city and their neighborhoods.  Unfortunate, but many of the things being said in these meetings confirm this viewpoint.

[dougskiles]

Headline should read "JTA has 5 years to deliver 100,000 riders per month or we will be shutting JTA down"

[jcjohnpaint]

Reading this article really saddens me.  When I go to work every day, I look forward to coming up with creative solutions to problems.  I see this bunch of snicker makers and seat fillers/ they are the people wasting our tax money.  It bothers me so much that leaders of this city don't even consider that there might be solutions to problems.  Again as Lake said... most council snicker makers don't know the history etc of the situation.  Most don't care to and maybe that is the problem.  If they don't care, they never will!  My advice to such council members is:  If you don't care about something, then don't do it!  You are a waste of tax payer money!   

[Bativac]

It seems like what we need are people to say "we have the skyway, now how do we make it work?" instead of "SHUT IT DOWN!!!!!"

The Skyway has already been built, is functional, and should become part of the plans to revitalize downtown. But knowing Jacksonville, the naysayers will win out, and they will continually reduce operating hours until nobody rides the thing because it only runs from 10 to 2 or something.

Very frustrating.

[Ocklawaha]

Welcome to Jacksonville, last bastion of the Cretaceous period.

Councilman Bill Gulliford's idea to cut back service to 'save money' is a formula for snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Anyone in transportation could tell him that the fastest way to distroy a transit system is to cut services. It starts a downhill snowball that frankly JTA has already started. Less frequency means less convenience and less convenience means less riders which in turn means less frequency... It's the classic Amtrak like fail, starve the system then complain that it doesn't perform.

Blaylock saying the system is showing signs of improvement is equally wrong, imagine if Metro-North in New York City only ran from Grand Central Station to 125Th Street? No trains to Danbury, no trains to New Haven, no trains to Poughkeepsie, just a short back and forth on Manhattan, pretty stupid eh? It wouldn't be the fault of parking garages either Mike, in the real world parking garages can work both ways. There is no reason someone from Mandarin or the beaches, who commutes into town and parks at a garage, wouldn't use the Skyway at lunch time or for some other downtown errand. Of course the Skyway would have to be convenient which takes us right back to Councilman Bill Gulliford's statement.

Y'all are right, half build it, don't maintain it, eliminate the services and complain that it doesn't work, it's the Jacksonville way. Just imagine as the relocation specialists for some blue chip company looks to relocate to Jacksonville. "The downtown isn't exactly the hub of commerce, there are few services for employees downtown and oh, they're tearing down their mass transit system... Say! Let's pick Jacksonville! NOT!" Momma Gump warned us about most of the people running our city, "Stupid is as stupid does."

OCKLAWAHA

[cline]

I kind of see the majority of Council as suburbanites who may not even know the full history of the skyway, how mass transit works in general or what the impact of downtown revitalization will mean for this city and their neighborhoods. 

^This.  This is the problem.  We have people on city council that only look at the numbers and decide it's a waste and should be gone.  They don't look at the root cause of why the numbers are so low and how this could be remedied.  Instead, they let it languish.

[Dashing Dan]

The skyway needs re-brandiing. 

Instead of the skyway, start calling it The Pelican.  It sounds greener that way.

[exnewsman]

I kind of see the majority of Council as suburbanites who may not even know the full history of the skyway, how mass transit works in general or what the impact of downtown revitalization will mean for this city and their neighborhoods. 

^This.  This is the problem.  We have people on city council that only look at the numbers and decide it's a waste and should be gone.  They don't look at the root cause of why the numbers are so low and how this could be remedied.  Instead, they let it languish.

+1

[L.P. Hovercraft]

Reading this article really saddens me.  When I go to work every day, I look forward to coming up with creative solutions to problems.  I see this bunch of snicker makers and seat fillers/ they are the people wasting our tax money.  It bothers me so much that leaders of this city don't even consider that there might be solutions to problems.  Again as Lake said... most council snicker makers don't know the history etc of the situation.  Most don't care to and maybe that is the problem.  If they don't care, they never will!  My advice to such council members is:  If you don't care about something, then don't do it!  You are a waste of tax payer money!   

Double true! 
We've got to elect better leaders--we need the best and brightest, not the worst and dimmest.

[cline]

Am I naive to think the solution is as simple as expanding the network, so that the Skyway goes to places people actually frequent? Is that too Pollyanna? If we had stations at Five Points, the Shoppes at Avondale, the Town Center, Atlantic Beach, and the airport (for starters), think of how many more people would ride.

I live in Riverside, and I would happily walk to a station near Five Points and hop a train to downtown so I could get dinner at Chew or have a drink at Mark's. But since it requires driving, I just end up walking to Sushi Cafe instead.

While I'm aware of the high costs of expanding the Skyway network, I'm certain the increased ridership would help mitigate those costs. Besides, public transit is an investment in the quality of life for a community; it should strive to be solvent, but not be viewed as a moneymaking endeavor...any more than the fire department.

I know, I know. I'll go back to the land of rainbows and unicorns now...

I think it is more about integrating the Skyway with other transit options rather than extending to the points that you mentioned.  If Streetcar were built, you could hop on the streetcar at a stop in Riverside and then transfer to the Skway and ride it over to San Marco (assuming it is extended there as has been discussed).  I don't think the Skyway is the answer to get to the airport.  That would be better served by some combination of commuter rail and bus.

[jcjohnpaint]

Reading this article really saddens me.  When I go to work every day, I look forward to coming up with creative solutions to problems.  I see this bunch of snicker makers and seat fillers/ they are the people wasting our tax money.  It bothers me so much that leaders of this city don't even consider that there might be solutions to problems.  Again as Lake said... most council snicker makers don't know the history etc of the situation.  Most don't care to and maybe that is the problem.  If they don't care, they never will!  My advice to such council members is:  If you don't care about something, then don't do it!  You are a waste of tax payer money!   

Double true! 
We've got to elect better leaders--we need the best and brightest, not the worst and dimmest.
[/quote

Yeah and I even feel that this problem is so much worst than dim politicians.  These people are so lost it isn't even funny.  I mean -  they all look at each other to say "this thing is still running"?  Come on!  If they pay this much attention to fixing this problem/ then this is how they deal with all of the problems of this city.  These people are not problem solvers by any means.  pathetic!  Inform Yourself/ Enlighten Yourself- or get a job flipping burgers!

[L.P. Hovercraft]

Am I naive to think the solution is as simple as expanding the network, so that the Skyway goes to places people actually frequent? Is that too Pollyanna? If we had stations at Five Points, the Shoppes at Avondale, the Town Center, Atlantic Beach, and the airport (for starters), think of how many more people would ride.

I live in Riverside, and I would happily walk to a station near Five Points and hop a train to downtown so I could get dinner at Chew or have a drink at Mark's. But since it requires driving, I just end up walking to Sushi Cafe instead.

While I'm aware of the high costs of expanding the Skyway network, I'm certain the increased ridership would help mitigate those costs. Besides, public transit is an investment in the quality of life for a community; it should strive to be solvent, but not be viewed as a moneymaking endeavor...any more than the fire department.

I know, I know. I'll go back to the land of rainbows and unicorns now...

I'm with you on chasing rainbows--it's like we're planning to fail.  The Skyway (maybe we could rebrand it as the Osprey Express?) is only partially completed so let's tear it down before we're done?  Huh?
Wha'?!

Finish the damn thing (or feed it with light rail/streetcar).  Connect it to Riverside/Avondale, Everbank Field/sports district, Jax Beach, SJTC--places people go already and I think the ridership would increase exponentially than if we just leave it unfinished downtown and in San Marco.  I would actually be way more apt to shop at the SJTC if I wouldn't have to drive there and could just hop on a streetcar in Riverside, jump on the Skyway to a light rail station downtown and then on to the Town Center. 
Yes, it would cost lots of money to expand our transit system, but it would be an infrastructure investment that would spur economic development downtown and along the route if we go by the historic precedence of our peer cities and don't succumb to some false local notion of "Jacksonvillian Exceptionalism".