Georgia plans to toll I-75 and I-575; Jacksonville next?

[thelakelander]

How does everyone feel about converting existing roads into toll to pay for more?

Georgia plans to toll 29 miles of I-75 and I-575; Jacksonville next?

Submitted by Larry Hannan on May 10, 2011 - 10:21am

Georgia is leeping into the public-private partnership game with a $1 billion project that will add toll lanes on interstates 575 and 75 in Cobb and Cherokee counties.

The project bears certain similarities to Florida's plan to build and toll the First Coast Outer Beltway in Jacksonville. That project fell apart when no private company was willing to partner with the state.

Florida is now looking into the possibility of tolling the existing 15 miles of Branan Field Road from Interstate 10 to Blanding Boulevard, and using the toll money down the line to construct the entire 46.5 mile road to Interstate 95 in St. Johns County.

Of course, traffic in the Atlanta area is significantly greater than traffic in Jacksonville. But Public-Private partnerships, which most government officials have annoyingly started calling P3's, are the new buzzword for governments that lack the revenue to do major transit projects.

So successful tolling of I-75 and I-595 in Georgia will make Florida more eager to move ahead with more (ughhh) P3's.

http://jacksonville.com/opinion/blog/400669/larry-hannan/2011-05-10/georgia-plans-toll-29-miles-i-75-and-i-595-jacksonville

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

I feel like this guy needs to grab a dictionary and maybe take an 8th grade grammar refresher......

Other than that, I don't have a problem with tolling roads, I just would like the revenue to go to something other than more roads.

[KenFSU]

Hate the idea, especially when you bring in private partners.

New roads and projects, let's have a look.

Existing roads, absolutely not.

Yet another way to further destroy the middle class.

[Doctor_K]

Aren't we technically already paying for these roads anyway?

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Hate the idea, especially when you bring in private partners.

New roads and projects, let's have a look.

Existing roads, absolutely not.

Yet another way to further destroy the middle class.

Private partners would probably assume most of the burden of the required infrastructure - toll booths, salaries, etc.. while the state would probably pay for the road widenings, signage, etc...

[JeffreyS]

I am sure many will find it shocking that roads cost and continue to cost massive amounts of money.  It could be bad for the roads though we know Republicans hate transit that directly contribute to their own operating costs like rail. They like purely taxpayers supported roads.

[jandar]

Repeal the 6 cents gas tax for road maintenance/upgrades and then start tolling roads.

The 6 cents gas tax was added to help fund road consctruction/maintenance, yet all the money now goes to the skyway and bus system.

The 0.5 cents sales tax in Duval county was created to end the toll booths on roads inside Duval County.

There is a slippery slope if tolls are added again. Will the 0.5 cents sales tax be repealled?
And what should be done about the 6 cents gas tax that JTA seems to waste on poor routes and such?

Branan Field Chaffee could be exempt from any of these issues, it will be a state road, under the FDOT for maintenance and control.

[simms3]

Traffic in Jacksonville is nowhere near bad enough to justify tolling roads.  What has been done at Brannan Field is done, and traffic is not bad enough for drivers in Jacksonville to use that road on their way to work in the morning Clay County-Downtown commute if it is tolled.  I say leave it free, sadly allow developers to come in a century from now when housing comes back, build communities, pay for all infrastructure improvements, and pay hefty impact fees.  Those fees will generate more revenue to pay for that road than tolling it would.

Cities like Atlanta and DC have no more room to widen highways further and arterial roads do not have sufficient capacity to relieve highway congestion.  I-75, 575, and I-85 in Cobb and Gwinnett Counties are 20 lane parking lots at least 6 hours a day.  It has become necessary (HOV in Gwinnett has now been converted to HOT).

Jacksonville should focus on adding more traffic to generate more visibility for businesses on our core roads.  Focus on pulling that traffic in, and then focus on providing alternative forms of transportation on the same corridors.  Create nodes like DC and boulevards like LA.

[Captain Zissou]

The 6 cents gas tax was added to help fund road consctruction/maintenance, yet all the money now goes to the skyway and bus system

Please show where you got this info.

[jandar]

The 6 cents gas tax was added to help fund road consctruction/maintenance, yet all the money now goes to the skyway and bus system

Please show where you got this info.

Here'e a recent article from the FTU:
http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2011-05-06/story/jta-faces-challenge-renewing-6-cent-gas-tax

The tax generates about $25 million to $30 million a year. It was created in 1986 by the City Council for needed road improvements in the city but limited to 10 years only.

Read more:
http://library.municode.com/HTML/12174/level2/TITXXIITA_CH799LOOPGATA.html
http://myfloridalegal.com/ago.nsf/Opinions/A0D8659C3DB444BF852562A70050C86A

Section 336.025, F.S., authorizes county governments to impose a local option gas tax on every gallon of motor fuel and special fuel sold in the county and taxed under Parts I or II, Ch. 206, F.S. Pursuant to the statute, municipalities must use moneys received pursuant to s. 336.025, F.S., "only for transportation expenditures."[1]

A definition of "transportation expenditures" is contained in the statute. Section 336.025(7), F.S., provides that:

"For the purposes of this section, the term 'transportation expenditures' means expenditures by the local government from local or state shared revenue sources, excluding expenditures of bond proceeds, for the following programs:
(a) Public transportation operations and maintenance.
(b) Roadway and right-of-way maintenance and equipment.
(c) Roadway and right-of-way drainage.
(d) Streetlighting.
(e) Traffic signs, traffic engineering, signalization, and pavement markings.
(f) Bridge maintenance and operation.
(g) Debt service and current expenditures for transportation capital projects in the foregoing program areas, including construction or reconstruction of roads."

[north miami]

So what's up.....in the past plenty of public funding for infrastructure,now we must resort to outside sources.
Could there be something larger,a diminishing growth margin dynamic?

[tufsu1]

We are already tolling existing roads in Florida...started with the HOT lanes on I95 in Miami...and now on I-595 in Broward.

The key is that the tolls are only placed on NEW lanes

That's also the general plan for SR 23 in Clay County...they are currently designing the frontage roads which will be free...the expressway, if ever built in the middle of the ROW, will be tolled....Tampa has a similar case w/ the southern portion of the Veterans Expwy.

[jandar]

We are already tolling existing roads in Florida...started with the HOT lanes on I95 in Miami...and now on I-595 in Broward.

The key is that the tolls are only placed on NEW lanes

That's also the general plan for SR 21 in Clay County...they are currently designing the frontage roads which will be free...the expressway, if ever built in the middle of the ROW, will be tolled....Tampa has a similar case w/ the southern portion of the Veterans Expwy.

You mean SR23, SR21 is Blanding Blvd.

[tufsu1]

oops...sorry...corrected

[jandar]

Np, just didnt want people to freak that Blanding would soon have tolls...