Is Springfield Regressing??

[letters and numbers]

Hey so what are the solutions on main street? Ive been looking and theres plenty of store fronts but almost all of them need so much work! Man what's it going to take there are only a few to have I think.

[ChriswUfGator]

You know I spent hours and hours talking and researching because I don't buy a house and open a business lightly. I'll just say this about this topic. Don't believe everything you read on the internet and some of these posters have crazy personal histories that are the reason for this "beef" I think. A lot of this talk on here is just crazy.  I could say more but I don't like flame wars you know. But everyone can just form their own opinion. let's drink to that!!

Crazy personal histories huh? Man you've been here like a month and already drinking the SPAR koolaid!

Haven't you noticed how many people say the same thing about SPAR? Even just in this thread. Do you really think that when so many people are all saying the same thing, that each one of them has some crazy personal axe to grind, or is it more likely that the problem is that the organization they are all referring to has the crazy history? How many times can random lightening possibly strike the same place?

And you clearly didn't sound that much time researching if you weren't aware of SPAR's history...

[iloveionia]

^ regardless gator, let's discuss viable solutions to bring life to Main Street.

[peestandingup]

I was there for the planning sessions, and yes that is indeed why they implemented the blockages.

No one would listen to the concerns arising from business needs.  Lord knows, I tried.

It really wouldnt be that hard to fix.  restore street turns  between 4-12th since thats where the usable buildings are and install more pedestrian friendly crosswalks.

That would certainly help, but it wouldn't be a "fix" IMO. Pedestrians would still still be fighting against 4 lanes of traffic to get to the other side. And depending on what time of the day it was, could be very "highway-like" in nature. It would be similar to trying to walk across Blanding Blvd, as opposed to say St Johns Ave in Avondale.

If it were me & I had total control over a design that could be retrofitted over what was already there, I'd tear up the median putting the streetcar line in the middle & take the car lanes back down to one lane on the sides, which would also leave enough room for dedicated bike lanes. Everyone gets their own equal space & it doesn't discourage walkability because it's more manageable street traffic.

Basically similar to what they had there back in the day.

[ChriswUfGator]

Hey so what are the solutions on main street? Ive been looking and theres plenty of store fronts but almost all of them need so much work! Man what's it going to take there are only a few to have I think.

They look like that because SPAR boycotted, harassed, and ran off all the businesses that were there.

You're presently lecturing the actual guy who started the revitalization of Main street a decade ago by opening up the first nice restaurant on the street. After he moved in, the arts community followed and there was really a nice gentrification going until Louise DeSpain and SPAR showed up and decided they wanted a Starbucks and a Panera Bread, and ran off a bunch of the mom and pop businesses, and then started demanding huge "neighborhood discounts" from the ones that remained open. He subsequently moved out of the neighborhood because of all of the B.S., and Main street in Springfield has been going downhill since that exact moment. But I guess since you researched this so extensively you probably already knew all that?

[ChriswUfGator]

^ regardless gator, let's discuss viable solutions to bring life to Main Street.

The medians have to go. The bus stops need to come back. SPAR presently administers the LISC and facade grant programs for the neighborhood, but as has been repeatedly discussed, they have refused to dole out any of the money to any businesses. Instead they concocted this asinine idea by where you had to get their approval for your storefront design, then you paid an exorbitant amount of money to a contractor SPAR demanded you use, and the "grant" was that they would then give you a "free" awning (that SPAR designed and picked out) if you managed to comply with the 47 pages of rules they attached, and even then it wasn't really a grant since you had to spend 10 times the amount the silly awning cost with SPAR's contractor.

We need an actual grant program to encourage small businesses to open up on Main, run by people who are capable of doling out the money without a bunch of power games and politics. Why is SPAR in charge of that program, when they've yet to fund a single grant in 3 years?

But the street redesign is horrible, and is presently throttling the commercial corridor. They made it next to impossible to get to any of the businesses easily in your car, and they removed all the bus stops etc., which eliminated a lot of foot traffic that businesses need to stay open. That needs to be undone or else I can't see how the street is going to be viable long-term.

[marksjax]

Medians kill retail business.

Unless in a setting such as San Marco or St John's Town Center, where there are plenty of places to turn left and walk safely to the other side and where there is a wide enough lane to allow on street parallel parking next to the median AND a traffic speed that is not over 15-25mph.

To prove this point look at these examples and look at the empty retail buildings on one or both sides of the street:

1) Baymeadows Rd between i-95 and Philips Hwy (medians killed what was a a once vibrant retail corridor), not enough chances to turn left (to other side of street) AND traffic flow/speed too fast.

2) Mayport Rd., medians have not helped as promised, just made it more difficult to attract customers. Not enough chances to turn left AND traffic flow too fast.

3) Jax Beach 3rd St north and south between 2nd and 6th Ave. Same issues as above. Businesses on west side of A1A are getting killed by medians. Traffic on 3rd St is actually worse (more congested) which has probably resulted in more rear end type accidents (not sure on that, just a hunch).

I asked DOT why the urge to put up medians and the answer was: 'To cut down on the amount of accidents'

So public safety is the ultimate 'go to' reason the gov't will give when justifying these wasteful and poorly planned designs.

So, for the record: From what I have seen anyway, in this town, medians are a failure of epic proportions.

[Springfielder]

You know I spent hours and hours talking and researching because I don't buy a house and open a business lightly. I'll just say this about this topic. Don't believe everything you read on the internet and some of these posters have crazy personal histories that are the reason for this "beef" I think. A lot of this talk on here is just crazy.  I could say more but I don't like flame wars you know. But everyone can just form their own opinion. let's drink to that!!

Given that I didn't make an attempt at trying to insult you, I find it sad that as a new comer and one that wants to open a business here in the neighborhood, that you'd so quickly draw a line in the sand and call all of us who aren't 100% in support of spar, you refer to those who have crazy personal histories with spar. Shame on you, making a judgment without knowing what you're talking about and without having been here long enough to know the histories. Had you'd bother to read, and actually do real research, you'd see that there's most certainly a history and it's not a pretty one when it comes to spar and the neighborhood.

Yet, the majority of what we've mentioned, we also clearly stated it was under the former ED's leadership....and that even though there's still members of the spar board who are harmful to and for the neighborhood, that most of us are supportive but do not fully trust all the board members of spar.

It's nice to be able to sweep it all under the carpet or to keep ones head in the sand...but don't go tossing insults to those of us who have been here for years and years, and who have seen first hand what the former spar ED and her regime did to this neighborhood. They alienated people, they picked and choose whom they felt were 'good enough' to open a business. As I said, there's still people sitting on the board who are detrimental to the health of this neighborhood.

[tufsu1]

^ regardless gator, let's discuss viable solutions to bring life to Main Street.

but its so much more fun to complain about things!

[ChriswUfGator]

^ regardless gator, let's discuss viable solutions to bring life to Main Street.

but its so much more fun to complain about things!

Actually if you'll read my comments, I suggested several valid ideas for generating growth on Main Street.

[Ernest Street]

Letters and Numbers...I'm not sure if you grew up here, but the past damage done by SPAR is a classic example of the "Good Ole boy club"..which doesn't bother to maintain contact with the public or read silly Forums like MJ.
I mean I won't wax it any more. Rich..privileged..retired..holding onto a 1930-1950 attitude.12 year old scotch .elitist..hate artists..mostly baptists..prude. Are you sure you want to operate a business under a microscope?
They mostly wrote a blank check to restore THEIR Springfield homes....not like the rest whom sweated,Bled,stressed,and actually WORKED on their own homes.(And bought stuff from the local Springfield Hardware stores and lumber suppliers)
 See..The real restoration crew of Springfield is on these threads.
I have followed their battles and worked in and on these homes.
For Gods sake,The Pearl was "Darted" for Christmas lights? that is just down right mean spirited.  and that is my last description of SPAR..
Mean Spirited.

These SPAR folks were intending to be good neighbors?  

[Kiva]

Rich..privileged..retired..holding onto a 1930-1950 attitude.12 year old scotch .elitist..hate artists..mostly baptists..prude.

These SPAR folks were intending to be good neighbors?  

I know that SPAR in the past made huge mistakes. Demolishing houses etc. But the people moving into Springfield now are not rich, privileged, or retired. Most of the new homeowners are in their 20, 30 or 40s. It would be great if we discussed the present, not the past.  I, like most people actually living in Springfield love artists, we are not Baptists or prudes (come and spend time in our hot tub).

[Ernest Street]

I'm not referring to the new residents...please do your research and reread my post.
The SPAR Illuminati moved into Springfield the same time as the artists,restaurateurs, and Bohemian crowd.

FACT:The older SPAR members thought Springfield should be another Georgetown (DC) Starbucks..insert chain store here..etc
FACT: They showed open hostility towards struggling business that didn't fit their mold at the time...Neighbors are watching their behavior closely(do you blame them?)
As pointed out earlier they simply wanted to skip phases of gentrification...hood to scrubbed clean.

In the early days it was quite wild with the "Hood" not quite knowing how to deal with these "Crazy people" that would restore a house by themselves and actually walk to the bars and enjoy their neighborhood.
Several residents had the pleasure of having thier house burned down or damaged by some crazy crack head whore that claimed the restoration was ruining her bussiness!..Remember her!?
These restoration bogged down folks certainly didn't need some OVERLORD deciding what was correctly restored.(RAP did this in Riverside with thier hate of aluminum windows)
These same people(SPAR) made sure that many homes were demolished..
As recent as November,Some a$$hole Sic'd Code and Enforcement Bastards on the artist that was painting the boards in mothballed houses with a HEART!! (How heartless is that?)
Get the picture?


Lake?..Stephan? How and When in the Hell did SPAR get this awesome power in the first place?

[peestandingup]

I'm not understanding what really triggered the elitist bunch to move to Springfield in the first place, especially before it was gentrified? That's usually not how these things evolve & it skipped over a couple steps. I know the artist community & eccentrics were making a scene before, but it doesn't seem like it lasted long (I guess because they were run off??).

The way I understand it, that particular group (small at first, but wealthy & made a lot of noise) moved in quickly in the early to mid 2000's & wanted to take complete control of the entire neighborhood & see to it that it was molded (by force, not naturally) into their own image. Word got up to a lot of investors in Atlanta ("OMG, this is the next Buckhead!!") & then they followed suit, snatching up property left & right, half-assing a lot of businesses & restorations, etc. Bad decisions were made as the process played out, bridges were burned, real estate bubbles were popped, investors skipped town, until we're left with what it is today. It's lightened up a bit (mainly because of the crash), but many of those same people (the original ones) are still there & still in control with the same "Georgetown on my mind" attitudes, completely disconnected from reality, probably thinking "Ah, this market will pick right up & we'll just start back up where we left off".

Is that about the gist of it??

[ChriswUfGator]

Rich..privileged..retired..holding onto a 1930-1950 attitude.12 year old scotch .elitist..hate artists..mostly baptists..prude.

These SPAR folks were intending to be good neighbors?  

I know that SPAR in the past made huge mistakes. Demolishing houses etc. But the people moving into Springfield now are not rich, privileged, or retired. Most of the new homeowners are in their 20, 30 or 40s. It would be great if we discussed the present, not the past.  I, like most people actually living in Springfield love artists, we are not Baptists or prudes (come and spend time in our hot tub).

It's not "the past." They're still running around screwing stuff up...

The bus stops were just removed within the last month or two at SPAR's urging because SPAR and its SHADCO chapter determined (and I quote) "the wrong types won't have any excuse to be on the street when there's no bus to wait for." That will prove to be the final death knell for Main street business, since SPAR already eliminated a lot of the auto traffic with those asinine medians and now the removal of the bus stops eliminated the foot traffic.

The car wash zoning appeal, where the same crew tried to stop Silas Jones from opening his car wash, was within the last 6 months. A month ago, SPAR called code enforcement on Preservation S.O.S. and forced them to run around and paint over all the S.O.S. hearts because they complained about "graffiti." I am so sick of these ignorant psuedo-lectures about "dwelling on the past" because they imply that SPAR's behavior is actually in the past. It isn't.