OK-Newbie question-Sign Ordinance

[Matt]

What are the limits for signs downtown, because that einstein's sign is nothing, and that took a good long while. What is the problem with signs? ...probobly hurts suburban cavedweller's eyes...but really

[zoo]

Jacksonville's sign ordinance is, like everything else in Jax, overly-suburban in nature.

Anyone ever heard of Charles Landry ("The Art of City-making" and "The Creative City")? He was in jax recently and gave several talks on urban art (and the pain our city caused his eyes, with its bare gray cement, cement, cement and surface lots in every direction).

I agree with him that some of the most interesting things in our downtown are the remnants of retail signs left on brick buildings. Or what about the jaguar on the Guaranty and Trust bldg -- it's so interesting, the city is giving the owner trouble about it.

Times Sq in NY (ok, that may be a bit over the top for Jax), the famed Marlboro Man outdoor board on the Sunset Strip in L.A. (and that was advertising before it was considered urban art!), or even the 20' tall pink neon pegasus in Dallas (I think... even though Mobil is officially no more, this "art" remains a part of their cityscape).

These things become a critical part of urban vibrancy and activity. I'm not saying get rid of the sign ordinance, as some would abuse, take advantage and use tastelessly. But herein lies the problem: what is tasteless to some is art to others, and vice versa.

At the very least, there should be a mechanism for one-time variances. Then the council can decide by majority vote what is tasteless, rather than keeping our structures visually bland as a default.

[Lunican]

This is a pretty creative billboard. Obviously not in Jacksonville:

[zoo]

That is awesome, right down the spilled on cars below and the cooperation from the "reputable" Nationwide Ins. Note there is no phone# or URL in the art/advertising from Coops Paints, but that Nationwide chose to include its .com.

How did theurbancore.com get approval for its mural on the side of Burrito Gallery bldg?

[urbanlibertarian]

If I'm not mistaken they had to beg forgiveness after the fact because they did not seek permission beforehand.

[Suzanne Jenkins]

I worked on the downtown sign overlay regulations in 2001 I think and it was passed.  It takes into account the difference required for urban signage, off street frontage of building space that needs signage and the uniqueness needed for downtown and pedestrian style signage.  The sign companies have yet to figure out that downtown is different and allows for other sign types than just flat wall suburban signage.  We even put in illustrations to give visual examples of what we are trying to encourage.  I have asked Eric Lindstrom to look into the signs that are going in downtown and find out why the sign companies aren't utilizing the ordinance.

[thelakelander]

Is this in Columbus, OH?  I think I took a picture of that building (I remember the Nationwide side of the ad) yesterday.

This is a pretty creative billboard. Obviously not in Jacksonville:

[Lunican]

Actually it is in Columbus, OH.  Three blocks south of the convention center off High Street.

[Lunican]

The ad was done by Orange Barrel Media. It seems that is one of their favorite buildings for ads.

http://www.orangebarrelmedia.com/postitnote1/portfolio/

[zoo]

Ok, Suzanne, give me some assistance. I've looked at the city's "sign laws"

http://www.coj.net/Departments/Public+Works/Building+Inspections/Sign+Laws.htm

Even looked at section titled "Sign Exemptions". Didn't see anywhere, anything about a downtown overlay with different rules. Did I miss it? Where might I find it? Can Eric Lindstrom post a reply to my inquiry?

Thanks a bunch.

[spidey]

Try looking here:  http://www.municode.com/resources/gateway.asp?pid=12174&sid=9  or somewhere close by in the ordinance code.

SUBPART B. DOWNTOWN SIGN OVERLAY ZONE

Sec. 656.1331. Intent.
The purpose of this Subpart is to create the policy for a comprehensive and balanced system of signs and street graphics to facilitate the enhancement and improvement of the downtown area through the encouragement of urban, innovative signs and street graphics which will aid in the creation of a unique downtown ......

[Suzanne Jenkins]

Thanks Spidey

[thelakelander]

Actually it is in Columbus, OH.  Three blocks south of the convention center off High Street.

Yes, I checked the pics I had already taken.  It just so happened, on Saturday, I took a shot of a bus stop shelter, which was directly in front of that ad.  The building across the street has a huge Skybus (the airline that's going to fly into St. Augustine) ad on it.

[spidey]

Suzanne:  Thanks Spidey

I am computer illiterate, but I do know how to search the web pretty well. 

What's that saying?  "Even a blind pig finds a nut every once in awhile"   

[zoo]

Hey.... are you callin' me a blind pig? ;-)