Fighting H8. Nationwide Protest due to Prop. 8 passing

[David]

Back to the fetish thing...

I've got this one real bad fetish I can't seem to conquer, no matter how many times I pray to sweet 6 pound, 8 ounce baby jesus: It's just....it's just I  like to sleep with women!  it's...a horrible horrible  fetish I've been cursed with since birth.

We should amend the state's constitution to ban such atrocities.

[GatorShane]

First off I would like to apologize to uptowngirl. You are exactly right when you say that certain behavior turns you off in your support of certain groups of people. I was responding in anger and that is never a good solution. Its just frustrating for us in the gay community that certain people just dont understand why we feel the way we do. Yes there are some of us that dont even care about marriage, but the majority of us just would like to be afforded the same benefits that everyone else receives . Again I apologize and I do respect your opinion and your ideas. Next to RiversideGator. Wow you truly are a person that I could have some lively debates with. I love the fact that you live in Riverside and are a Gator fan(I think). I think that is where our similarities would end. Not to attack you, but calling homosexuality a fetish is probably the most ignorant thing I have ever heard on this site. That being said, to all of you that say that being gay doesnt constitute your ability for Civil Rights, I say that by the basic definition it does. I am a law abiding, tax paying, legal resident of the United States of America. If I am denied any of the rights that everyone else recieves based on who or what I am then that is a violation of my Civil Rights.God Bles Everyone!   

[TheProfessor]

Anderson Cooper is quite a cool Homo.  I wish there were as many protests here in FL as there were in CA.

[Bewler]

Back to the fetish thing...

I've got this one real bad fetish I can't seem to conquer, no matter how many times I pray to sweet 6 pound, 8 ounce baby jesus: It's just....it's just I  like to sleep with women!  it's...a horrible horrible  fetish I've been cursed with since birth.

We should amend the state's constitution to ban such atrocities.

Yeah we really should just ban this whole sex thing entirely. As well as any form of affection (kissing, hugging, handshaking, eye contact...). It's all just filthy, disgusting, sinful behavior.

[uptowngirl]

First off I would like to apologize to uptowngirl. You are exactly right when you say that certain behavior turns you off in your support of certain groups of people. I was responding in anger and that is never a good solution. Its just frustrating for us in the gay community that certain people just dont understand why we feel the way we do. Yes there are some of us that dont even care about marriage, but the majority of us just would like to be afforded the same benefits that everyone else receives . Again I apologize and I do respect your opinion and your ideas. Next to RiversideGator. Wow you truly are a person that I could have some lively debates with. I love the fact that you live in Riverside and are a Gator fan(I think). I think that is where our similarities would end. Not to attack you, but calling homosexuality a fetish is probably the most ignorant thing I have ever heard on this site. That being said, to all of you that say that being gay doesnt constitute your ability for Civil Rights, I say that by the basic definition it does. I am a law abiding, tax paying, legal resident of the United States of America. If I am denied any of the rights that everyone else recieves based on who or what I am then that is a violation of my Civil Rights.God Bles Everyone!   

Thats cool, I understand the frustration!

[Tripoli1711]

GatorShane:  As I inartfully attempted to point out earlier, homosexuals have no fewer legal rights than do heterosexuals.  I know it sounds crazy but if you think about it, it is true.  Whether homosexual or heterosexual, men cannot marry men but they can marry women and visa versa.  The analysis begins and ends with whether a heterosexual man (for example) can do something that homosexual (man) cannot.  You may say "they can get married" but that is incomplete, they can get married "to women".  Both CAN do that.  Both are prohibited from marrying men.  There are no rights that heterosexuals have that homosexuals do not.

On the wider issue I personally do not have a problem with some sort of civil union bringing most of the same legal benefits to the same sex couples that marriage does to opposite sex couples.  I believe, antiquated as it may be, in the sanctity of the institution of "marriage" and that should be reserved only for opposite sex couples.  What I have the biggest problem with, however, is an unelected judge overturning the will of millions of voters.  The framers of our nation built this nation the way they did for a reason.  One major concern was, of course, any sort of despotism or monarchy.  I can think of nothing more similar to the royal rule that was so feared by the framers than a life appointed unelected judge creating law from the bench that overturns the will of the voting public.  For that reason I disagree with the protesters.  I fully support your right to protest and do not begrudge you for doing so, but I cannot agree.  The voters in every state that has ever had the issue posed have rejected gay marriage.  The only way it should be legalized is through the constitutional process.  My fear with a large number of the protesters (who are protesting the decision of their fellow citizens) is that the old standard line that their opponents are "bigots", "filled with hate" etc. will be the tone.  This always annoys me because it seems that the more liberal among us have a tendency to feel the more conservative are just not capable of rational thought or heartfelt decisions and are therefore acting out of some animalistic reaction of hate or fear. 

[RiversideGator]

I simply want to preserve traditional marriage.

First of all the whole idea of traditional marriage is flawed in the first place. It doesn't work for 50% of the couples out there.  So what are you wanting to preserve exactly?

It is not for you or the government to decide which individuals can get married.

Woman used to not be allowed to vote and that is exactly what this ridiculous argument sounds like.

Probably the most annoying part of this debate are the straw man arguments and the false analogies (i.e. this is just like banning interracial marriage or preventing women from voting).  Anyone with an ounce of logic in their bodies would reject such bogus comparisons out of hand.

[stephElf]

I simply want to preserve traditional marriage.

First of all the whole idea of traditional marriage is flawed in the first place. It doesn't work for 50% of the couples out there.  So what are you wanting to preserve exactly?

It is not for you or the government to decide which individuals can get married.

Woman used to not be allowed to vote and that is exactly what this ridiculous argument sounds like.

Probably the most annoying part of this debate are the straw man arguments and the false analogies (i.e. this is just like banning interracial marriage or preventing women from voting).  Anyone with an ounce of logic in their bodies would reject such bogus comparisons out of hand.

How is that?

Give me one good reason why gay people should not be allowed to get married?

[mandy6488]

The "sanctity" of marriage. Like I said before, if marriage is so holy, is it a problem if two atheists get married? I don't think marriage should be thought of as something that is automatically linked to religion. People get married by justices of the peace. It is NOT a religious event for all people. If it is, that's fine, that's cool. If not, that's cool too. I just don't get why we have to keep this "tradition" of one man and one women. It doesn't hurt anyone else. It doesn't threaten anyone else's marriage. I just don't get the problem.

There have been plenty of AWFUL tradition's in the history of the world. Traditions can and sometimes should be changed.

[RiversideGator]

A) Gay people getting married DOES NOT cheapen marriage.

Yes it does.  As I stated before, this has been the experience in those European nations which allow gay marriage.  Specifically, less men and women get married where there is gay marriage.  This may be simply correlation rather than causation but I think it is a symptom of a general coarsening and degradation of the culture.

B) Marriage does not equal family.

No. but marriage is the foundation of most successful families.

C) People can exist as a family without marriage, without kids, without sharing blood.

I suppose we could construct some scenarios where this might occur, but on the whole successful families which produce kids and strengthen society are comprised of a man and wife joined in marriage.

[mandy6488]

I simply want to preserve traditional marriage.

First of all the whole idea of traditional marriage is flawed in the first place. It doesn't work for 50% of the couples out there.  So what are you wanting to preserve exactly?

It is not for you or the government to decide which individuals can get married.

Woman used to not be allowed to vote and that is exactly what this ridiculous argument sounds like.

Probably the most annoying part of this debate are the straw man arguments and the false analogies (i.e. this is just like banning interracial marriage or preventing women from voting).  Anyone with an ounce of logic in their bodies would reject such bogus comparisons out of hand.

I'm not sure that you should be the one accusing people of not being logical..

[stephElf]

A) Gay people getting married DOES NOT cheapen marriage.

Yes it does.  As I stated before, this has been the experience in those European nations which allow gay marriage.  Specifically, less men and women get married where there is gay marriage.  This may be simply correlation rather than causation but I think it is a symptom of a general coarsening and degradation of the culture.

B) Marriage does not equal family.

No. but marriage is the foundation of most successful families.

C) People can exist as a family without marriage, without kids, without sharing blood.

I suppose we could construct some scenarios where this might occur, but on the whole successful families which produce kids and strengthen society are comprised of a man and wife joined in marriage.

We can just agree to disagree.

Your views in my opinion are antiquated and extremely narrow-minded.

Cheers.

[RiversideGator]

I am not insulting you.  It is a fact that you sound ignorant and like a bigot.

More name calling.  This does nothing to win your argument.

By your logic a heterosexual person has a fetish for the opposite sex.

No, by my definition, a fetish does not include sexual fixation on genital part of the body of the opposite sex.  This is normal heterosexual attraction.  However, it too can be misdirected.

[stephElf]

A) Gay people getting married DOES NOT cheapen marriage.

Yes it does.  As I stated before, this has been the experience in those European nations which allow gay marriage.  Specifically, less men and women get married where there is gay marriage.  This may be simply correlation rather than causation but I think it is a symptom of a general coarsening and degradation of the culture.

B) Marriage does not equal family.

No. but marriage is the foundation of most successful families.

C) People can exist as a family without marriage, without kids, without sharing blood.

I suppose we could construct some scenarios where this might occur, but on the whole successful families which produce kids and strengthen society are comprised of a man and wife joined in marriage.

Whether gay people get married or not they still exist! And neither degrade our culture. They are a PART of it.
You are in denial.

As far as our culture and society taking a downturn we have bigger fish to fry! Like violence.
If anything this narrow-mindedness is what is toxic for our culture. Trying to sweep things under the rug, act like they are dirty and don't exist.

People in general are not getting married as often or as early.  Why? Because my generation realizes that marriage is not always all it is cracked up to be or necessary for happiness.

I suppose the fact that I am a woman and can now wear pants and work seriously threw our culture into a tail-spin as well.  The insanity of it all!

::: goes back to baking an apple pie :::

[JeffreyS]

I just don't get the problem.

Mandy I will fill you in.  They just don't like gay people.  The convoluted logic of oh it will affect what Webster's prints this year or if someone else has a bad marriage it will cheapen mine are dumb arguments.  They are just people trying not let on that they would rather oppress people than live and let live. Sometimes if it smells like #2 that is what it is.