New life for Berkman II? Owners seeking Commercial CBD Rezone

[KenFSU]

Details remain scarce, but credit to Curry for forcing the issue.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/berkman-plaza-ii-sold

[jaxnyc79]

Berkman 2 Will not be torn down. It will become hotel and entertainment complex. The property was sold yesterday and a developer will be announced soon. We could see the new hotel and other amenities within the next three years. Live report at noon. @wjxt4 https://twitter.com/wjxtjimpiggott/status/1019240462211846145/photo/1

If that means street-level commercial to further the aim of street-level activation (which the other Berkman lacks), this is especially positive news.

[Steve]

Details remain scarce, but credit to Curry for forcing the issue.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/berkman-plaza-ii-sold

I'll reserve my judgement for when the details come up, but yes I agree. I kept hearing "it was happening" forever now so I wasn't expecting it anytime soon.

But yes-on the surface this is a good thing. Choate wasn't going to develop it, so the chances of this actually being developed just went up!

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Does the city withhold all financial incentive up until something tangible is in the works or does the city cut un-announced developer a check to the tune of +/- $36.5M before they even put a shovel in the ground?

[downtownbrown]

Heck, that didn't take long... Only 8 months after the first rumors.  Will be interesting to hear the brand.

[Steve]

Heck, that didn't take long... Only 8 months after the first rumors.  Will be interesting to hear the brand.

And only 11 years since the construction accident which stalled it.

[acme54321]

2006

[KenFSU]

Does the city withhold all financial incentive up until something tangible is in the works or does the city cut un-announced developer a check to the tune of +/- $36.5M before they even put a shovel in the ground?

1) Curry's expecting work to begin as early as this week.

2) Berkman II is expected to be open for business in less than three years. And the USS Adams - which will be docked at the foot of Berkman II in that leftmost Shipyards pier - will be on its way sooner than later, as it was recently approved for donation to Jacksonville and the museum has picked up support from the state. Seems like a great time to really start thinking about completing that land swap, building the proposed flagship park adjacent to Berkman and the Adams, and opening up Met Park to whatever the Jags want to do with it.

3) This adds an interesting wrinkle to the convention center RFP. 350 rooms, plus restaurant/retail required in the RFP, and here we've got 200+ rooms and entertainment literally being built next door to potentially poach that business away. Hopefully it makes us rethink those requirements a bit.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Does the city withhold all financial incentive up until something tangible is in the works or does the city cut un-announced developer a check to the tune of +/- $36.5M before they even put a shovel in the ground?

1) Curry's expecting work to begin as early as this week.

2) Berkman II is expected to be open for business in less than three years. And the USS Adams - which will be docked at the foot of Berkman II in that leftmost Shipyards pier - will be on its way sooner than later, as it was recently approved for donation to Jacksonville and the museum has picked up support from the state. Seems like a great time to really start thinking about completing that land swap, building the proposed flagship park adjacent to Berkman and the Adams, and opening up Met Park to whatever the Jags want to do with it.

3) This adds an interesting wrinkle to the convention center RFP. 350 rooms, plus restaurant/retail required in the RFP, and here we've got 200+ rooms and entertainment literally being built next door to potentially poach that business away. Hopefully it makes us rethink those requirements a bit.

It's just the pessimist realist in me.  But it really seems like a lot of the things that we're doing now were the same types of things we were doing 13-15 years ago and we know how that ended.

And I'm sure you didn't miss the hint, but for those of you that are kind of new to Jax - look up Tri-Legacy Shipyards.

[FlaBoy]

Does the city withhold all financial incentive up until something tangible is in the works or does the city cut un-announced developer a check to the tune of +/- $36.5M before they even put a shovel in the ground?

1) Curry's expecting work to begin as early as this week.

2) Berkman II is expected to be open for business in less than three years. And the USS Adams - which will be docked at the foot of Berkman II in that leftmost Shipyards pier - will be on its way sooner than later, as it was recently approved for donation to Jacksonville and the museum has picked up support from the state. Seems like a great time to really start thinking about completing that land swap, building the proposed flagship park adjacent to Berkman and the Adams, and opening up Met Park to whatever the Jags want to do with it.

3) This adds an interesting wrinkle to the convention center RFP. 350 rooms, plus restaurant/retail required in the RFP, and here we've got 200+ rooms and entertainment literally being built next door to potentially poach that business away. Hopefully it makes us rethink those requirements a bit.

It may make more sense for a smaller hotel that is more niche' on the site, especially a 5 Star. We will see how the economics work but definitely makes a hotel on site less needed.

[thelakelander]

With or without Berkman, there's no need for a hotel at the proposed convention center site. That's what we subsidized Hyatt to be two decades ago.

[downtownbrown]

this is where a Marriott Delta makes sense.  Part business hotel, part ownership model, which makes sense for it's proximity to event sites.  Great news for the long suffering owners of the Plaza Townhomes which now find themselves in the center of the universe.

[Captain Zissou]

It's just the pessimist realist in me.  But it really seems like a lot of the things that we're doing now were the same types of things we were doing 13-15 years ago and we know how that ended.

And I'm sure you didn't miss the hint, but for those of you that are kind of new to Jax - look up Tri-Legacy Shipyards.

Some projects yes, some projects no.  I'd say shipyards and district, as currently designed, no chance.  Hotel Indigo, the trio, maybe the ambassador hotel, and a couple other small things will get built.  In 2006 there were some monstrosities proposed without anything really to support them.  The JEA building redevelopment, the 2 towers on the Aetna property, Bishopgate, 323 Duval, and others all just seemed to be development for development's sake.  There is a demand for downtown living new hotel offerings.  Beyond that I don't know that the market and time will support for future development

[thelakelander]

I'd agree. This is no different from all the multiple mall proposals in the suburbs back in the 1980s. Some of these are way more realistic than others, with much shorter implementation timelines. Courtyard at the Trio, Hotel Indigo, Residence Inn Brooklyn, etc. all seem more realistic then concepts proposed at the District, Shipyards/Lot J, city hall site convention center, Sister Cities Plaza, etc.  A few of these will fizzle out depending on market dynamics and the success/failure of the first few completed hotel projects.

[Downtown Osprey]

I'd agree. This is no different from all the multiple mall proposals in the suburbs back in the 1980s. Some of these are way more realistic than others, with much shorter implementation timelines. Courtyard at the Trio, Hotel Indigo, Residence Inn Brooklyn, etc. all seem more realistic then concepts proposed at the District, Shipyards/Lot J, city hall site convention center, Sister Cities Plaza, etc.  A few of these will fizzle out depending on market dynamics and the success/failure of the first few completed hotel projects.

Fine by me. I'll take all of the "smaller" project wins over the Shipyards or District any day of the week for numerous reasons. 1) These are all in the central core of downtown where the most help is needed and 2) we are bringing once beautiful buildings back to life. (minus the brooklyn projecT)