Jaguars amphitheater, flex field construction to begin next month

[Steve]

They are going to stay practice fields. The flex field is only one field, so they still need all the fields. Plus, the roof likely will make kickoff and punt practicing very difficult.

[jaxjaguar]

The main goal of the flex field was to have a place to practice when the weather turns. I remember the jags had the most missed practices of any team in the NFL a few years ago. It was one of the reasons Khan wanted it.

I'd imagine at some point the current practice fields will be rethought. I could see the Armada potentially looking to take over one of those fields. It'd be a perfect spot for a soccer stadium / field for fans to watch the jags summer practices, etc.

[BenderRodriguez]

I'd imagine at some point the current practice fields will be rethought. I could see the Armada potentially looking to take over one of those fields. It'd be a perfect spot for a soccer stadium / field for fans to watch the jags summer practices, etc.

A smaller (10/15k-ish) dedicated soccer stadium with the Armada as it's main tenant would be the most ideal in my opinion. Also, I know a lot of you guys may not like it, but, another parking garage along with a smaller surface lot footprint would probably be ideal as well.

[RattlerGator]

So, vicupstate is at least honest enough to give up the ghost. More than I can say for stephendare, still parading around as a know-it-all when in fact he has lost a political battle (I can't imagine why, can you?) and wants to pout about it while blatantly lying about the law and what it permits *and* constrains. Rather than discussing the clearly progressive utilitarian addition the city and the Jaguars have built into our sports complex, of course.

Yes, stephendare, they're morphing it unassailably into something much more than a sports complex. Deal with it.

But MetroJacksonville.com can't compliment the city or the organization for that. No, we must be showered with -- at worst -- some doctrinaire (dare I say, FANATIC) comment tripe from the operators of a board that should be (at the very least) neutral about this incredible addition to downtown Jacksonville or -- at best -- we are enlightened (not) with some snarky take that borders on dismissive.

No curiosity whatsoever about the possibilities. No benefit of the doubt given to the city or the Jaguars, if for nothing more than the sake of analysis. Very telling.

The Jaguars were very smart to push for that change in the local code (all above-board and legal) and the city was very smart to agree. Most of the city residents, stephendare, very clearly agree with this. Not that it matters to our resident totalitarian who truly wishes he could dictate to the city how it must do X, Y or Z. After all, you're Mr. OohHeIsSoSmuglySuperSmartWhileHeYawns, dontcha know? So . . . so . . . cosmopolitan! Maybe just maybe if I lived within the city limits I'd be able to bask in your oh-so-marvelous glow. Maybe.

And jaxjags wants more, more, more taxes. Good luck with that, jaxjags; it's definitely not a popular take but I'm sure you know that already. There is very definitely dreaming and doing going on in Big Duval. It may not be sufficient for you, but it is happening. And this re-imagining of the sports complex is Exhibit A. Many municipalities are going to envy what the City of Jacksonville will have accomplished with this effort.

You know, while pining for the BarnettBankBldg/LauraTrio, etc., it shouldn't be so difficult for MetroJacksonville.com to at least acknowledge that much.

[spuwho]

So, vicupstate is at least honest enough to give up the ghost. More than I can say for stephendare, still parading around as a know-it-all when in fact he has lost a political battle (I can't imagine why, can you?) and wants to pout about it while blatantly lying about the law and what it permits *and* constrains. Rather than discussing the clearly progressive utilitarian addition the city and the Jaguars have built into our sports complex, of course.

Yes, stephendare, they're morphing it unassailably into something much more than a sports complex. Deal with it.

But MetroJacksonville.com can't compliment the city or the organization for that. No, we must be showered with -- at worst -- some doctrinaire (dare I say, FANATIC) comment tripe from the operators of a board that should be (at the very least) neutral about this incredible addition to downtown Jacksonville or -- at best -- we are enlightened (not) with some snarky take that borders on dismissive.

No curiosity whatsoever about the possibilities. No benefit of the doubt given to the city or the Jaguars, if for nothing more than the sake of analysis. Very telling.

The Jaguars were very smart to push for that change in the local code (all above-board and legal) and the city was very smart to agree. Most of the city residents, stephendare, very clearly agree with this. Not that it matters to our resident totalitarian who truly wishes he could dictate to the city how it must do X, Y or Z. After all, you're Mr. OohHeIsSoSmuglySuperSmartWhileHeYawns, dontcha know? So . . . so . . . cosmopolitan! Maybe just maybe if I lived within the city limits I'd be able to bask in your oh-so-marvelous glow. Maybe.

And jaxjags wants more, more, more taxes. Good luck with that, jaxjags; it's definitely not a popular take but I'm sure you know that already. There is very definitely dreaming and doing going on in Big Duval. It may not be sufficient for you, but it is happening. And this re-imagining of the sports complex is Exhibit A. Many municipalities are going to envy what the City of Jacksonville will have accomplished with this effort.

You know, while pining for the BarnettBankBldg/LauraTrio, etc., it shouldn't be so difficult for MetroJacksonville.com to at least acknowledge that much.

RG,

I totally get what you are saying and understand your POV.

Being that we are not NYC or Chicago, certain civic investments are sometimes required to maintain public assets that benefit the few more than others.

Stephen, being a student of history, has read up on the many examples of internal self advantaged arrangements people have come to in COJ and as you will see, has been a consistent opponent of public investment in things that have very narrow interpretations of public value.

In his thoughts, spending civic dollars maintaining an asset (Jaguars) owned by a billionnaire and used by several millionaires runs counter to healthy public policy.

I too understand that position, and while I also agree with components of his argument, we differ on scope.

I cant speak for Stephen, but if the Jaguars or Mr Khan spent $20M on civic assets that had no direct financial benefit to them, his posture might be different.

For example, setting up a foundation for the care of our historic parks, Hemming, Hogans Creek/Klutho greenway.

However, the Jaguars are focused on long term revenue streams in what is considered a small market for the NFL. Therefore they have to place their money where it has the most benefit to them and have asked the city to partner with them. So far I have seen a progression of good will, but I am not blind and know that the good will is not permanent and is predicated on our willingness to keep up in the NFL arms race.

[Steve]

Regarding point #2: what would be the advantage for Khan's folks to schedule crappy shows there? Remember, though the taxpayers invested $45 million, so did he. It's to his advantage to fill the thing and keep pumping talent through there.

[exnewsman]

The amphitheater is going to seat 5,500 people so anyone who thinks Beyoncé is performing there shouldn't be calling Ticketmaster just yet. The St. Augustine Amphitheater seats 4,000 - so the performs will likely be on the same level of the acts that perform at that venue.

[finehoe]

It was suggested in an earlier thread that there are dozens, if not hundreds, of acts that skip North Florida altogether because they only play 5000 seat outdoor venues.

[KenFSU]

But, I am skeptical that its programming will be dominated by crappy country musicians and third-tier, washed up has-beens.  I hope I am wrong, but remain doubtful.

Zero reason to be doubtful.

A 5,500 seat amphitheater is the perfect sweet spot these days for awesome artists too big for the Florida Theater or Times-Union Center, but too small to sell out an arena.

I certainly wouldn't expect third-tier, washed up has beens, or crappy country musicians to dominate the bill. Think Lumineers, Fifth Harmony, Alabama Shakes, Walk the Moon, Counting Crows, Third Eye Blind, Chvrches, Frank Ocean, Aretha Franklin, Josh Groban, Dashboard Confessional, Bob Dylan, Willie Nelson, Meagen Trainer, Smashing Pumpkins, Florence + The Machine, Chicago, Skrillex, Sarah McLachlan, etc. These are the types of artists who tour the ~5,000 seat venue circuit, and there's zero reason to believe promoters won't be chomping at the bit to tap into a market of 1.3 million that has never had an appropriate sized venue for such acts.

[Dapperdan]

Anyone know when the original stadium paydown from the 1/3 bed tax is retired ? If I remember, that was taken out in 1995 ?? so We are over 20 years on that debt.

[JBTripper]

There's a BIG difference between a 5,500-seat amphitheater in Jacksonville and a 4,000-seat amphitheater in St. Augustine.

1.) 37% increase in seating capacity.
2.) A 300% increase in population (St. Johns vs. Duval). They might be nearby, but two hours round-trip is a huge barrier for most.
3.) An attached venue that draws 60,000 people seven Sundays (hello, Friday and Saturday night), plus FL/GA and the Gator Bowl.
4.) An organization with the means and incentive to attract and pay top talent. (Jaguars vs. SJC Parks & Rec)
5.) It's accessible to the entire region vs. easily accessible to the Anastasia campgrounds.

It's going to be night and day, y'all.

[Tacachale]

But, I am skeptical that its programming will be dominated by crappy country musicians and third-tier, washed up has-beens.  I hope I am wrong, but remain doubtful.

Zero reason to be doubtful.

A 5,500 seat amphitheater is the perfect sweet spot these days for awesome artists too big for the Florida Theater or Times-Union Center, but too small to sell out an arena.

I certainly wouldn't expect third-tier, washed up has beens, or crappy country musicians to dominate the bill. Think Lumineers, Fifth Harmony, Alabama Shakes, Walk the Moon, Counting Crows, Third Eye Blind, Chvrches, Frank Ocean, Aretha Franklin, Josh Groban, Dashboard Confessional, Bob Dylan, Willie Nelson, Meagen Trainer, Smashing Pumpkins, Florence + The Machine, Chicago, Skrillex, Sarah McLachlan, etc. These are the types of artists who tour the ~5,000 seat venue circuit, and there's zero reason to believe promoters won't be chomping at the bit to tap into a market of 1.3 million that has never had an appropriate sized venue for such acts.

Correct. Venues of this size have been the trend for many touring acts for years. We miss out because we have a lack of this type of venue in our metro area. Many if not most of the acts in this category we do get are playing out at the St. Augustine Amphitheater (which is 45 miles away) or Ponte Vedra Concert Hall (out in the middle of nowhere). So a lot of people who'd otherwise go to those concerts miss out because of the distance. Unless they've royally miscalculated the amphitheater design or get complacent with their bookings, I'd expect to see it attract good shows and good crowds. That in and of itself would be a positive change for the city.

[spuwho]

There's a BIG difference between a 5,500-seat amphitheater in Jacksonville and a 4,000-seat amphitheater in St. Augustine.

1.) 37% increase in seating capacity.
2.) A 300% increase in population (St. Johns vs. Duval). They might be nearby, but two hours round-trip is a huge barrier for most.
3.) An attached venue that draws 60,000 people seven Sundays (hello, Friday and Saturday night), plus FL/GA and the Gator Bowl.
4.) An organization with the means and incentive to attract and pay top talent. (Jaguars vs. SJC Parks & Rec)
5.) It's accessible to the entire region vs. easily accessible to the Anastasia campgrounds.

It's going to be night and day, y'all.

I am already thinking of two black gospel festivals there annually.

Rockville

Freedom Fest

Some throwback rock festivals from the 80's (think the Journey/Boston/Styx era)

Political rally

NFL Draft Day

Mayoral Inaugurations

[spuwho]

Just got an email that suggested that they host a Marvel movie premiere here.  Bring out the actors, show the movie and have autograph session in the stadium.

Out of box thinking at least.

[Jomar]

Venues of this size have been the trend for many touring acts for years. We miss out because we have a lack of this type of venue in our metro area. Many if not most of the acts in this category we do get are playing out at the St. Augustine Amphitheater (which is 45 miles away) or Ponte Vedra Concert Hall (out in the middle of nowhere). So a lot of people who'd otherwise go to those concerts miss out because of the distance.

I don't make it to many local concerts, but if a lot of these acts really wanted to come to Jax, wouldn't Veterans Memorial be an acceptable alternative, even if they just filled the lower sections?  Or is the outdoor amphitheater component a make-or-break factor in most cases?