Convention Centers: How do we compare?

[finehoe]

The terminal should be used for transit again.

This part is true.  Another option is not move the CC, but shut it down.

[thelakelander]

^What's the economic benefit in not having a convention center? That's a different discussion from one focusing on whether we should expand or not. For example, how much money does it lose or generate? Is it currently economically beneficial to downtown hotels and restaurants? Those are some questions that would have to be answered before seriously having a discussion about a 1.5 million MSA not having a decent sized exhibition space of any kind.

[BridgeTroll]

Is convention center even the right term?  We use the Prime Osborne as an exhibit center... for car shows... boat shows... gunshows... home and garden... etc.  Conventions?  I dont think so...

[finehoe]

Those are some questions that would have to be answered before seriously having a discussion about a 1.5 million MSA not having a decent sized exhibition space of any kind.

You're absolutely right; but as far as I've seen, we aren't answering those questions or having that discussion.  It seems to be taken as a given that the economic benefits outweigh the costs, but I haven't seen any Jacksonville-specific data that verifies that assumption.

[FlaBoy]

In Jax, we need to move ours. The terminal should be used for transit again.

This!!!

Lake,

Have you ever done a story on the potential best sites for a Convention Center? We have talked about sites near the Hyatt, but what about sites around the Omni/Performing Arts area or near the Arena where there is already space?

[spuwho]

Owensboro Kentucky has a viable center because they dont pursue large cons. They target the small to mid size meeting markets that need more parking than a hotel meeting space can provide.

Many of their shows are really regional in nature and Jacksonville should be no different.

We are too close to Atlanta and Orlando and should not be pursuing the large con market as they are too few.  Business spending on conventions is going down.  Spending on specialty cons is growing.  These are fan cons for sci-fi, fantasy, comic-con, tv shows or special movie genres.

As an example, the Minecraft convention,  Minecon 2016 in Anaheim sold out 12,000 tix in less than a minute. Not saying we should host it, its an example of the growth in gaming cons.

[Snufflee]

Owensboro Kentucky has a viable center because they dont pursue large cons. They target the small to mid size meeting markets that need more parking than a hotel meeting space can provide.

Many of their shows are really regional in nature and Jacksonville should be no different.

We are too close to Atlanta and Orlando and should not be pursuing the large con market as they are too few.  Business spending on conventions is going down.  Spending on specialty cons is growing.  These are fan cons for sci-fi, fantasy, comic-con, tv shows or special movie genres.

As an example, the Minecraft convention,  Minecon 2016 in Anaheim sold out 12,000 tix in less than a minute. Not saying we should host it, its an example of the growth in gaming cons.

I agree, a large business based Convention Center is not what Jacksonville needs or can afford. A modern space that is perfect for regional shows or allowing for smaller Fantasy/Gaming/Sci Fi shows to have another option is where it is going... Comi-Con isnt coming here no matter what happens in San Diego.. Pax West and Pax East are not coming to Jacksonville in our wildest dreams. But small con's that really have no place to expand or grow is the market Jax should be targeting if and when they ever move forward.

[finehoe]

Owensboro Kentucky has a viable center because they dont pursue large cons. They target the small to mid size meeting markets that need more parking than a hotel meeting space can provide.

Many of their shows are really regional in nature and Jacksonville should be no different.

We are too close to Atlanta and Orlando and should not be pursuing the large con market as they are too few.  Business spending on conventions is going down.  Spending on specialty cons is growing.  These are fan cons for sci-fi, fantasy, comic-con, tv shows or special movie genres.

As an example, the Minecraft convention,  Minecon 2016 in Anaheim sold out 12,000 tix in less than a minute. Not saying we should host it, its an example of the growth in gaming cons.

I agree, a large business based Convention Center is not what Jacksonville needs or can afford. A modern space that is perfect for regional shows or allowing for smaller Fantasy/Gaming/Sci Fi shows to have another option is where it is going... Comi-Con isnt coming here no matter what happens in San Diego.. Pax West and Pax East are not coming to Jacksonville in our wildest dreams. But small con's that really have no place to expand or grow is the market Jax should be targeting if and when they ever move forward.

That route probably would be the best for Jacksonville to follow if we had a well-located facility already in place, but the question no one wants to ask is, even if we could nab every fancon and the like available, would the revenue they bring in be worth the cost of a brand-new CC? 

[Snufflee]

Owensboro Kentucky has a viable center because they dont pursue large cons. They target the small to mid size meeting markets that need more parking than a hotel meeting space can provide.

Many of their shows are really regional in nature and Jacksonville should be no different.

We are too close to Atlanta and Orlando and should not be pursuing the large con market as they are too few.  Business spending on conventions is going down.  Spending on specialty cons is growing.  These are fan cons for sci-fi, fantasy, comic-con, tv shows or special movie genres.

As an example, the Minecraft convention,  Minecon 2016 in Anaheim sold out 12,000 tix in less than a minute. Not saying we should host it, its an example of the growth in gaming cons.

I agree, a large business based Convention Center is not what Jacksonville needs or can afford. A modern space that is perfect for regional shows or allowing for smaller Fantasy/Gaming/Sci Fi shows to have another option is where it is going... Comi-Con isnt coming here no matter what happens in San Diego.. Pax West and Pax East are not coming to Jacksonville in our wildest dreams. But small con's that really have no place to expand or grow is the market Jax should be targeting if and when they ever move forward.

That route probably would be the best for Jacksonville to follow if we had a well-located facility already in place, but the question no one wants to ask is, even if we could nab every fancon and the like available, would the revenue they bring in be worth the cost of a brand-new CC?

No doubt a cost benefit analysis would need to be done..but if there is a benefit like you are preaching over building and overspending is only going to lead to failure.

[Adam White]

I think Jax should have a privately-owned convention center. That way people can build what they want and the taxpayers won't get stuck paying for some stupid vanity project that will fail, despite being heralded as the next great project to save Downtown.

[finehoe]

I think Jax should have a privately-owned convention center.

Seriously.  If a new facility will be as lucrative as it's supporters say, the Florida Restaurant & Lodging Association should have no problem financing the design and construction.

[Adam White]

I think Jax should have a privately-owned convention center.

Seriously.  If a new facility will be as lucrative as it's supporters say, the Florida Restaurant & Lodging Association should have no problem financing the design and construction.

I agree. (There I go again, blindly agreeing with you).

I know it seems like I'm trolling, but I'm not.

You can't build a convention center in isolation and expect it to thrive. The reason Jax isn't get conventions (or enough conventions) might have something to do with a space that's too small or not enough hotel rooms. But I bet another big reason is because there ain't shit to do downtown. It's practically a wasteland. I love Jax, but it's a bit sad. If you came from out of town for a convention, you'd have nothing to do (except maybe get drunk or have a burrito).

I think we need to revitalise downtown first - or at least get the process going - before we start looking at new convention centres. Maybe plan for one, but I don't see the point in building one. If it is built (and costs a lot of money, as these things end up doing) and ends up underperforming, it will just reinforce the notion that downtown is beyond help.

The answer is single, big projects. It's got to be some sort of well-developed long-term plan. It's incremental change - but planned incremental change.

[FlaBoy]

Can I throw out a crazy idea? Atlanta, Orlando, and Tampa have great venues. Miami Beach and Ft. Lauderdale are the only larger convention centers near a beach. People love the beach and the beach is the bar/nightlife entertainment capital of North Florida. What if you put together a huge public/private deal with some upscale hotel and convention center on the beach?

[Adam White]

Can I throw out a crazy idea? Atlanta, Orlando, and Tampa have great venues. Miami Beach and Ft. Lauderdale are the only larger convention centers near a beach. People love the beach and the beach is the bar/nightlife entertainment capital of North Florida. What if you put together a huge public/private deal with some upscale hotel and convention center on the beach?

That's not that crazy an idea. Though I wonder if the beaches could handle the traffic, etc. Genuinely unsure - this isn't really my area of expertise!

[Steve]

Can I throw out a crazy idea? Atlanta, Orlando, and Tampa have great venues. Miami Beach and Ft. Lauderdale are the only larger convention centers near a beach. People love the beach and the beach is the bar/nightlife entertainment capital of North Florida. What if you put together a huge public/private deal with some upscale hotel and convention center on the beach?

You could....but I'm not sure why COJ would contribute to this then. Though COJ technically comprises all of Duval County, the Beaches are quasi-independent; in the manner that St. Augustine is separate from St John's County.

Generally convention centers are Public Private Partnerships, and I'd think that this doesn't happen without some COJ money (up front or over time).

One of the reasons I'm in favor of a convention center is to help out the retail scene during the week. If a nightclub/restaurant just had to turn a profit Thursday/Friday/Saturday, there would be a lot more places downtown. The convention business helps out dramatically Mon-Wed.....just look at San Diego.