US Dead Malls

[thelakelander]

^Past articles giving a shout out to the old Philips Mall:

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2013-apr-the-story-of-phillips-highway-plaza

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2008-oct-the-malling-of-jacksonville

[Adam White]

When I lived in Tampa, my office was right across the street from a mall near Raymond James stadium.

Lakelander will know the place, I'm sure.

I think it is probably gone now. That was the deadest mall I'd ever been to. It basically stayed open so local workers could eat at the food court.

That would be the former Tampa Bay Center mall. I spend a good part of my youth there. It has been torn down about 15 years now. It is now the location of the Bucs training center. Property is owned by the owner's of the Bucs.

Ah, yes! I lived in Tampa in 2001 - 2002. Probably right before it was torn down. There was a Cuban food place in that mall. And a decent sandwich place, as I recall. One of the only stores that was still open at the time was the Sanrio store - so you could get some Hello Kitty stickers to enjoy with your Cuban sandwich.

[thelakelander]

I remember when that mall was pretty popular back in the late 1980s/early 1990s. It used to get packed when the Florida Classic was played in the old "Sombrero". The architecture was pretty similar to Governor's Square in Tallahassee.  There was also Eastlake Square and Floriland Mall in Tampa. Both of those died before Tampa Bay Center.

[Adam White]

There's something very sad to me about a dead or dying mall. I think maybe because I loved spending Friday nights at Regency Square when I was in junior high. No money - just meet up with friends and walk around window shopping, wishing I could afford stuff. Good times.

[I-10east]

Whatever I say, blah blah blah blah (hopefully Stephen doesn't disagree with it, or you know what).

[thelakelander]

There's something very sad to me about a dead or dying mall. I think maybe because I loved spending Friday nights at Regency Square when I was in junior high. No money - just meet up with friends and walk around window shopping, wishing I could afford stuff. Good times.

It's never bothered me. Most from my childhood died years ago. Only felt a little sorrow for Winter Haven Mall when everything but Macy's was torn down for a Lowe's back in 1998. That was the one I could bike to as a kid to go to the movies,  Toy King, Barrel of Fun game room and Spec's music store.

[Adam White]

There's something very sad to me about a dead or dying mall. I think maybe because I loved spending Friday nights at Regency Square when I was in junior high. No money - just meet up with friends and walk around window shopping, wishing I could afford stuff. Good times.

It's never bothered me. Most from my childhood died years ago. Only felt a little sorrow for Winter Haven Mall when everything but Macy's was torn down for a Lowe's back in 1998. That was the one I could bike to as a kid to go to the movies,  Toy King, Barrel of Fun game room and Spec's music store.

I also worked in Regency Mall when I was in college - I worked at Camelot Music. I'm biased, I know, but back in its prime, Regency was a great mall. It always had so much more personality than the Avenues, I thought.

[thelakelander]

Passing through town as a kid, I always thought Gateway had a lot of personality. We never really crossed the Mathews, pretty much sticking to the Northside and Orange Park. For you longtime Jaxsons, what's your memories of Gateway?

[Adam White]

Regency had that perfect mix in the 80s.  Cool kids working in all the shops, no real competition from any of the historic districts for awesome youth culture, Kona right around the block, and those awesome dunes right in the back of the property.

The kids came in from the Beaches (I was one of them) and it had lots of music places in the area. Camelot, Coconuts and a few other shops.  The movie theatre inside the mall was also a cool draw, as the lobby was basically the food court and surrounded by all the restaurants. 

There was a real incentive to show up for a movie early, eat and drink in the upstairs at the food court and hang out and meet people.  There was a huge group of senior citizens that walked the mall every morning for health, and in the early part of the day it was full of the surviving Jazz Age.  Former flappers and guys from WW1 and 2.  They socialized with the little punk rock kids very well.  (its one of the reasons why Jville punk and gothic girls all looked like flappers without pearls.

It may seem odd, but I remember Regency Mall very well from the early 1970s as well.  Before the comforting tile, lower ceilings, and recessed lighting in the early 1980 renovation.

It was starker and more elegant.  Way more modern.  There were several modernist fountains in the mall and the interior court was full of painters and artisans making things for sale.  The department stores were truly departmented instead of corporate shops made to look like there were departments, and there was a large professional class of seamstresses, tailors and showgirls that smoked and gossiped around the Penneys.

The architecture and decor were kind of hip and cutting edge for 1970---a reflection of when the city's elite was heavily populated by architects, I suspect.  Now its heavy with branding and marketing people.

In a lot of ways, the public taste was more refined and ahead of the times than it is now.  In the 70s the Mall was mostly concerned with longhairs, or hippies.  A few of the acceptable ones were part of the artisan community in the Mall, but the younger ones were still limited to the bars and beaches.

I moved to Jax in 1979 and we went to Regency a number of times before it was renovated. What's weird is that I seem to remember it being the old mall for so much longer than it actually was. The new section was cool at first, but it never really matched the original mall for me.

The Regency area was great for music at one time. As you mentioned, Camelot and Coconuts. But also Record Bar, Tape World (later on) and the original Music Shop (owned by the Faircloths). And, of course, Turtles! I worked there, too. Loved that place.

[spuwho]

I will admit I do miss going into the music stores and perusing the albums.

Our favorite as a kid was to go into the Rolling Stones section and pull the zipper down on the Sticky Fingers album.

It was always exciting to go and grab an Orange Julius and then down the record store to see what Elton John had come up with.

Or walk over to Video Concepts to watch ABBA concerts off laserdisc on the first projection TV's.

No cell phone stores, and sports stores were about sports and not just shoes.

Go down to the TShirt shop and find a transfer that would get the most attention at school.

Bring my custom mix cassette (TDK SA-90 of course!) Go to the stereo store and tick off the manager by playing my current favorite song on the system closest to the main mall.
(at an exceptional volume of course)

It's all gone now!!

[Adam White]

I will admit I do miss going into the music stores and perusing the albums.

Our favorite as a kid was to go into the Rolling Stones section and pull the zipper down on the Sticky Fingers album.

It was always exciting to go and grab an Orange Julius and then down the record store to see what Elton John had come up with.

Or walk over to Video Concepts to watch ABBA concerts off laserdisc on the first projection TV's.

No cell phone stores, and sports stores were about sports and not just shoes.

Go down to the TShirt shop and find a transfer that would get the most attention at school.

Bring my custom mix cassette (TDK SA-90 of course!) Go to the stereo store and tick off the manager by playing my current favorite song on the system closest to the main mall.
(at an exceptional volume of course)

It's all gone now!!

TDK SA-90!

I remember never quite understanding what the deal was with thos CRO2 tapes or whatever. Were they worth the extra money? Could my tape player use them?

[Gunnar]

I will admit I do miss going into the music stores and perusing the albums.

Our favorite as a kid was to go into the Rolling Stones section and pull the zipper down on the Sticky Fingers album.

It was always exciting to go and grab an Orange Julius and then down the record store to see what Elton John had come up with.

Or walk over to Video Concepts to watch ABBA concerts off laserdisc on the first projection TV's.

No cell phone stores, and sports stores were about sports and not just shoes.

Go down to the TShirt shop and find a transfer that would get the most attention at school.

Bring my custom mix cassette (TDK SA-90 of course!) Go to the stereo store and tick off the manager by playing my current favorite song on the system closest to the main mall.
(at an exceptional volume of course)

It's all gone now!!

TDK SA-90!

I remember never quite understanding what the deal was with thos CRO2 tapes or whatever. Were they worth the extra money? Could my tape player use them?

Yes and Yes. IMHO, there was a noticeable difference between "normal", chrome and Metal tapes if the source material was sufficiently good and your tape deck supported it.

In general, the frequency range was greater with good tapes.

The problem with many pre-recorded Cassette albums was that they used the cheaper tape type, so they did not sounds as good as they could have.

One tape that I would love to have is the Sony Metal Master 

[Adam White]

I will admit I do miss going into the music stores and perusing the albums.

Our favorite as a kid was to go into the Rolling Stones section and pull the zipper down on the Sticky Fingers album.

It was always exciting to go and grab an Orange Julius and then down the record store to see what Elton John had come up with.

Or walk over to Video Concepts to watch ABBA concerts off laserdisc on the first projection TV's.

No cell phone stores, and sports stores were about sports and not just shoes.

Go down to the TShirt shop and find a transfer that would get the most attention at school.

Bring my custom mix cassette (TDK SA-90 of course!) Go to the stereo store and tick off the manager by playing my current favorite song on the system closest to the main mall.
(at an exceptional volume of course)

It's all gone now!!

TDK SA-90!

I remember never quite understanding what the deal was with thos CRO2 tapes or whatever. Were they worth the extra money? Could my tape player use them?

Yes and Yes. IMHO, there was a noticeable difference between "normal", chrome and Metal tapes if the source material was sufficiently good and your tape deck supported it.

In general, the frequency range was greater with good tapes.

The problem with many pre-recorded Cassette albums was that they used the cheaper tape type, so they did not sounds as good as they could have.

One tape that I would love to have is the Sony Metal Master 

I wish I would've had you around to explain this stuff to me when I was spending serious allowance money on blank tapes. I remember there was a switch on my tape deck for chrome tapes - but it only made things sounds slightly darker, as I recall.

I probably could've got away with cheap tapes - I doubt all my shitty indie rock and punk music required fancy cassettes.

[Gunnar]

In terms of your issue with Chrome tapes, it may have been this:

1971:   Equalization of chromium dioxide (CrO2) tape set 70 μs by the DIN committe. The only reason for different equalization was to reduce noise by 4.5 dB - but that came with the cost of reducing SOL (= high dynamics)

From: http://vintagecassettes.com/_history/history.htm

One thing I never liked was using Dolby NR since to me it removed too much of the treble, i.e. I preferred having some noise / hiss rather than reduced audio quality. I may have gotten one or two metal tapes but to me they were useless since the source material when recording was not good enough and it was also a money thing being a kid / teenager.

[Adam White]

In terms of your issue with Chrome tapes, it may have been this:

1971:   Equalization of chromium dioxide (CrO2) tape set 70 μs by the DIN committe. The only reason for different equalization was to reduce noise by 4.5 dB - but that came with the cost of reducing SOL (= high dynamics)

From: http://vintagecassettes.com/_history/history.htm

One thing I never liked was using Dolby NR since to me it removed too much of the treble, i.e. I preferred having some noise / hiss rather than reduced audio quality. I may have gotten one or two metal tapes but to me they were useless since the source material when recording was not good enough and it was also a money thing being a kid / teenager.

Thanks for the link. I'm totally going to read that tonight. I kind of miss tapes, to be honest. Even though they didn't sound too great and tended to have issues.