The next U.S. President will be elected by the U.S. Electoral College

[BridgeTroll]

What else is "questionable" in that document?  Those incredibly insightful men even left you a mechanism to make changes.  Use the mechanism.

[Cheshire Cat]

What else is "questionable" in that document?  Those incredibly insightful men even left you a mechanism to make changes.  Use the mechanism.

Yes there is a mechanism in our system to address changes to an amendment but it is a politically volatile and difficult process, especially with today's political environment and corruption.  Right now the issue I am addressing is Amendment 12 and the Electoral College.  As insightful as our forefathers were, they could not have planned for or seen all the social and political issues facing this nation down in a system that is now corrupt.  To my view we need to elect our President and Vice President via "popular vote".  I am not alone in this belief.  I think if enough people begin to understand how the electoral college has been impacted by partisan corruption we will see an effort undertaken to change the amendment and change the process.  Having said that I am not one of those individuals who thinks we need to rewrite the constitution but changes are sometimes necessary to preserve the integrity of the process.  It has been done before. 

[BridgeTroll]

It was meant to be a difficult process.  Seems to me you and others have a hard time giving the founders credit. Corrupted system?  I think they saw plenty... dirty politics...Those guys invented it.

[Cheshire Cat]

It was meant to be a difficult process.  Seems to me you and others have a hard time giving the founders credit. Corrupted system?  I think they saw plenty... dirty politics...Those guys invented it.

Actually I give them a lot of credit.  They were amazingly insightful in the drafting of the Constitution. I have been angered by many of the attempts to re-write all that they did by those with self serving agenda's.  In this one instance however I believe that the truly democratic thing to do is to empower the individual voter with the understanding and reality that yes, each and every vote goes to the person it is cast for rather then massed together in the hope that those in the Electoral College will do the right thing.  That rarely happens in politics anymore.  Such a move would give the power of the vote solely to each and every individual regardless of political affiliation.  Money and politics can by electoral votes.  Buying the votes of all American voters is not so easy. 

[BridgeTroll]

Yet no real examples of electoral chicanery?  Zero chance of any possible amending here...try guns...or ERA...lol

[blizz01]

It's only broken if your candidate loses...

[Cheshire Cat]

Yet no real examples of electoral chicanery?  Zero chance of any possible amending here...try guns...or ERA...lol

Historically there are examples but I tell you what, I am honestly not going to take the time to ferret them out right now.  If you think the Electoral college is working fine and honestly that is your right.  However after decades of being both inside and outside of politics and exposing corruption I know the current process is flawed and manipulated and there is nothing in the constitution or the laws of most states to deal with that.  That should concern anyone who understands that our politicians are bought and our political parties are using a playbook the average voter simply does not understand.  I along with many others think we should use the individual votes cast (popular vote) to decide our election of the top two office holders in our country.  That is truly empowering the people and putting the future in their hands as opposed to the hands of an entity called the Electoral College. 

[Cheshire Cat]

Yet no real examples of electoral chicanery?  Zero chance of any possible amending here...try guns...or ERA...lol

you mean other than the 2000 and 2004 presidential elections?  In 2000, Al Gore had a commanding lead in the popular vote, if you remember.

Or the 2006 controversies in Ohio?

Or any number of suspicious changed votes nationwide in electronic voting?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/06/us/politics/us-voting-flaws-are-widespread-study-shows.html?_r=0

Indeed Stephen those are great examples. 

[Cheshire Cat]

It's only broken if your candidate loses...

That is not true.  It is broken when the individual will of the voter can be over ridden by a group of individuals picked by political parties, which is how the members of the Electoral College are chosen with a few exceptions in some states.  Honestly folks, time to step away from a partisan mindset and look at what might be best for all Americans who vote regardless of party.  That is exactly why I am suggesting that the Electoral College may no longer be the way to decide Presidential elections.

[Adam White]

What else is "questionable" in that document?  Those incredibly insightful men even left you a mechanism to make changes.  Use the mechanism.

Yes, there is a mechanism - but the very fact that it has had to be used shows how "questionable" some of the decisions by these "insightful" men actually were.

Unless, of course, you're cool with slavery. Or the fact that States could deny women the right to vote. Or that the President isn't elected by direct, popular vote. (Not that I am saying you, Bridge Troll, feel this way).

The so-called "founding fathers" were a group of elitists who were highly undemocratic in nature - they drafted a document which enshrined the status quo and protected their class interests. I don't think they did this because they were evil and I don't think they did this on purpose (for the most part) - they drafted the kind of document you'd expect them to.

I think it's well past time to scrap it and develop a newer, better constitution. And that one will likely need to be changed in a few hundred years' time (if not sooner).

[BridgeTroll]

I have no doubt you feel the way you do... but really... good luck with that.  Use the amendment process... even the founders used it with the first ten.  Scrap it for a better version... rofl... did you really say that?? 

[Adam White]

I have no doubt you feel the way you do... but really... good luck with that.  Use the amendment process... even the founders used it with the first ten.  Scrap it for a better version... rofl... did you really say that?? 

I did indeed and I honestly believe that.

[BridgeTroll]

I have no doubt you feel the way you do... but really... good luck with that.  Use the amendment process... even the founders used it with the first ten.  Scrap it for a better version... rofl... did you really say that?? 

I did indeed and I honestly believe that.

I know you do... your grandchildren will have died of old age before that happens...

[Adam White]

I have no doubt you feel the way you do... but really... good luck with that.  Use the amendment process... even the founders used it with the first ten.  Scrap it for a better version... rofl... did you really say that?? 

I did indeed and I honestly believe that.

I know you do... your grandchildren will have died of old age before that happens...

Of course - Americans are strangely averse to admitting when they get something wrong or don't do something well.

[BridgeTroll]

I have no doubt you feel the way you do... but really... good luck with that.  Use the amendment process... even the founders used it with the first ten.  Scrap it for a better version... rofl... did you really say that?? 

I did indeed and I honestly believe that.

I know you do... your grandchildren will have died of old age before that happens...

Of course - Americans are strangely averse to admitting when they get something wrong or don't do something well.

The US Constitution may have flaws... but it certainly should not be "scrapped for a better version".  That most appear to lack the will to simply amend the objectionable parts is no reason to scrap and start over... in fact it shows amending is the best and easiest way to make changes you so long for...