Dependence on Food Stamps

[BridgeTroll]

Oh but wait... apparently you do not even need to graduate HS for most...

http://www.careerinfonet.org/oview3.asp?level=overall&id=1&nodeid=5

1,2,3,6,7,8, and 10 on you list require less than HS diplomas... about 20 million or so...

Sounds about right.  How much should under trained under educated workers make?

[fsquid]

It is and never was meant to be an occupation where you can raise a family and send the kids off to college.

It may not have been "meant" to be that way, but it's the reality of today's economy:

so raising their wage is the answer?  or maybe fixing the economy and making the US a great place to make your products again?

[finehoe]

How much should under trained under educated workers make?

Enough so that the taxpayers don't have to subsidize their living expenses.

so raising their wage is the answer?  or maybe fixing the economy and making the US a great place to make your products again?

Why does it have to be either/or?  Why not both?

[JHAT76]

Enough so that the taxpayers don't have to subsidize their living expenses.

Which is what?  $9, $10.10?  Why not make it $1000 / hr?

[tyrsblade]

It's not my job, nor is it my corporation's job to help others. It's my job to concentrate as much wealth into my families and my business coffers. There is no mandate that says help all the dumb clucks , who won't (not can't) improve their lot in life. Who I choose to help and be charitable to is my business, the myth of "the living wage" is that it's a crowbar to leverage more money out of the hands of those that earn it.

Don't want to make 7.50 an hour? don't get knocked up in 9th grade , know who your dad is, finish high school, learn a trade or goto college for a technical/medical  degree.

this isn't hard.

[finehoe]

I just don't get why you guys are so adamantly against paying people more.  You have no problem with CEOs making outrageous sums, many making more than they could ever possibly spend.  Yet you're against paying those at the bottom a few dollars more an hour, which they certainly will spend, which will increase the size of the economy and be better for everyone. 

[peestandingup]

College educated with a fine arts degree pretty much guarantees you'll be bringing my order or ringing up my groceries for the foreseeable future.

And you apparently are perfectly content to help Wal-Mart pay their salaries via your tax dollars.

Is Publix or Winn Dixie paying higher than Wal Mart?  How about a Stein Mart cashier... or local 7-11?  Just who is paying better cashier wages than Walmart?

I don't care, I did that once , long ago and decided it sucked. Got an education and training (on my own dime, cause you know a white male isn't going to get it any other way) and moved on from sub 20$/hour jobs.

Which is part of the point... many of us started as cashiers... it is a starter job.  It is and never was meant to be an occupation where you can raise a family and send the kids off to college.  Perhaps you move uop to a cashier supervisor and on to department and eventually store management.

You're applying your own experience onto everyone else though. More & more often, esp these days, these types of jobs aren't "starter jobs". They're just jobs. It's what happens when corporations like Wally World corner the market then are allowed to outsource labor & products for pennies on the dollar. Any idiot could have seen this coming, even a crazy old coot like Ross Perot (the "giant sucking sound").

Besides, do you really expect everyone to jump into the abyss of college loan debt just for the chance they might make more money down the road? For one, that's a huge risk & the numbers back that up. And two, quite frankly not everyone is college material & it shouldn't be a prerequisite in our country to leap into that fire or to otherwise be poor & live on food stamps if you have a job, even if it is a cashier.

Trust me, my wife's been a professor for over a decade & I promise you half of those kids do not need to be there. But that's the only choice we're giving them.

[JHAT76]

I just don't get why you guys are so adamantly against paying people more.  You have no problem with CEOs making outrageous sums, many making more than they could ever possibly spend.  Yet you're against paying those at the bottom a few dollars more an hour, which they certainly will spend, which will increase the size of the economy and be better for everyone.

I never said I was against paying more.  However, I don't want the nominal wage to go up without a nice increase in actual purchasing power.  I don't mind paying more for things made here.  I would pay the estimated $60 more for an iPhone made in the US.  I would love for the US to push  itself less as the World Police and more as a Germany style high tech manufacturer.

Again I ask what wage is enough in today's environment?  You say increase the size of economy.  I say that can't be done without increasing the quality of jobs and especially purchasing power that comes from those wages.

[finehoe]

I say that can't be done without increasing the quality of jobs

Of course it can.  There is no iron law of economics that says the pay of the CEO of Wal-Mart needs to be $6,898 an hour while the average worker there only makes $8.86.

You as a taxpayer are making it possible because you top-off the low-wage worker's salary with various forms of federal aid.

[johncb]

Its been my observation that every time there is a minimum wage hike,everything else(food,housing etc) quickly follow with their own hikes.You can raise walmart workers wages to $15 per hour,and within a very short time all the rents in a 20 mile radius to walmarts will go up.The powers that be will NEVER let a large segment of the population get ahead simply because wealthier means better educated.Then they wont be able to pull the crap they pull now with impunity when a significant segment of the populace is informed and incensed.

[IrvAdams]

The disappearance of the middle class in this country continues, starting with the lower end of it. We are moving toward strictly "Haves" and "Have-nots", no more "Have some" or "average, middle of the road" classes. Seems like a return to over a hundred years ago, before labor movements and minimum wage laws, etc. It's regressive.

[southsider1015]

Why isn't every high school graduate college material?  Is the fault really on the teachers and schools? Or is it the parent(s)?  Why do we subsidize single mothers with multiple kids?  Why are college students getting liberal arts degrees?  Why aren't we more focused on STEM degrees?  Why are college students earning degrees in fields that don't have jobs? 

Our country isn't falling apart because of Walmart, billionaires, and the "haves".  Many Americans have forgotten about the importance of education, health/nutrition, financial intelligence, and a strong, supportive family.  We've become a country of lazy, obese, single parents working paycheck to paycheck in a world of "gotta have the latest iPhone now," celebritism, and trash reality TV.

The blame now is because of the income gap or inequality.  Frankly, for those who have found success in life, its become easier to sustain it because of it.  And those who don't/can't/won't continue to fall deeper, dragging their family with them.  So the solution is becoming more about spreading the wealth, and less about earning the wealth.  Instead of focusing on education or nutrition or social values, we're worried about money, and who should share more of it with others.

Do you really think that by paying Walmart workers more that they will be able to increase their livelihood and overall success in life?  When they're paid a livable wage, will they spend it correctly?  Will they save it, or continue to live paycheck to paycheck?  Will their 3 children go to college now?  What will they spend this extra money on?  Investing in themselves, their future, or children?  Or a new iPhone?

[IrvAdams]

I cannot, and am not trying to, grant these employees a higher wage. Walmart has to do that. What I'm saying is that for the last 30 years there is an increasing gap between top and bottom that has progressively gotten worse and will eventually lead to such concentrated wealth that a true fair sustainable balance of income for all citizens will be impossible to reattain.

At that point the flow of goods and purchase of day to day items of need will be so skewed towards the top tier that the majority of people will have to live on some sort of transfer subsistence from the government to survive. This is not much of a healthy economic model.

[fsquid]

or just keep subsidizing their pay with your tax dollars so that the owners of walmart dont have to pay their employees a living wage.

Everyone seems to be happy with that.

since most of us have the stock in our 401k or mutual funds, yes we probably are happy with that.

[BridgeTroll]

Oh but wait... apparently you do not even need to graduate HS for most...

http://www.careerinfonet.org/oview3.asp?level=overall&id=1&nodeid=5

1,2,3,6,7,8, and 10 on you list require less than HS diplomas... about 20 million or so...

Sounds about right.  How much should under trained under educated workers make?

How much did your grandfather make, BridgeTroll?

Both of them were poor... bordering on very.  Education level was HS or below.  Family size was at least 4... they did however... remain families.  Their children were all lower middle class with two exceptions... the two who managed to get upper education.  The same held true for the grandchildren... about half remain lower middle class(HS or below) the other half... attended upper education and are doing OK.  A minority of those had their educations "paid for".