Zimmerman Found Not Guilty

[NotNow]

   A defendant can make any motion, whether it be a SYG defense or any number of other defenses' against prosecution.   A judge has to entertain this crap irregardless of the likelihood of success.  This is just another example of useless time delaying motions by an attorney, and has nothing to do with SYG.  Do you want to get rid of the mental health defense because so many defense attorney's attempt to use it, even when it is obviously just a ploy? 

I have stated repeatedly that the Zimmerman defense did not use the SYG exception to prosecution, and that Zimmerman's acquittal is apparently due to the jury believing that he thought his life was in danger (I am told that was supported by medical testimony). 

Of course we can't prevent criminals and their lawyers from using ALL of the different defense's against prosecution.  (There are many different "defense to prosecution" clauses in all states.)  NO state can.  To use one of these frivolous motions as any kind of argument against SYG is just...dumb.

[Cheshire Cat]

NN, I wonder if South Carolina law is same as the one in Florida?  Any idea?

[NotNow]

No.  Again, this discussion is silly. 

[Cheshire Cat]

Why is it silly to discuss a piece of information that shows there are people in society who try to exploit our laws to their own ends?  This is an outrageous example to be sure, but does not take away from the reality that there are some crazy ideas about how the law is applied. Even some in the legal community will use a variety of loopholes within laws to defend a client.  I agree this claim of self defense has no chance to succeed in the real world of courtroom law, but it is a fantastical exploitation of a law that a blockhead thought could be used to his own ends. 

[NotNow]

It is silly to highlight this use of a "defense against prosecution" as anything but a frivolous motion by a defense attorney.  It says absolutely nothing about the law itself.  Now, if you want to discuss the waste of time and money by defending attorney's in our court systems, then we should be able to go many pages with just examples.  This is just one.

[Cheshire Cat]

It is silly to highlight this use of a "defense against prosecution" as anything but a frivolous motion by a defense attorney.  It says absolutely nothing about the law itself.  Now, if you want to discuss the waste of time and money by defending attorney's in our court systems, then we should be able to go many pages with just examples.  This is just one.

I understand Not Now.  It's frivolous, that's was the point.  lol 

[sheclown]

Dionne Warwick Joins Boycott of States w/ Stand Your Ground Laws

am certain most if not all of you have been bombarded with CNN and the news of the Trayvon Martin/George Zimmerman trial and i must say i was stunned at the verdict of NOT GUILTY........it took a while for this to settle in my brain since Zimmerman admitted killing this youngster.........my very dear friend Stevie Wonder has decided to keep his incredible talent from those states that carry the "Stand Your Ground" law here in the United States (30) of them and i am going to join him as i feel as seriously concerned as he does that we have to start caring more about each other and conversing with regard to the values we ALL should share with regards to our lives and the well being of each other.............it's really a shame that we feel the need to have to carry a weapon to feel safe around each other.............i will miss those states that have supported my career for these past 50 years but i feel absolutely compelled to show solidarity with Stevie showing him he is not alone in feeling the way he does.

http://www.blackyouthproject.com/2013/07/dionne-warwick-joins-protest-of-states-w-stand-your-ground-laws/

http://www.youtube.com/v/X0EA7a5LqDg?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0"></param><param%20name

[NotNow]

http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/19/under-floridas-stand-your-ground-law-bla


Under Florida's 'Stand Your Ground' Law, Black and White Defendants Fare Equally Well
Jacob Sullum|Jul. 19, 2013 12:17 pm

Video via The Orlando SentinelIn my column last week, I noted two complementary narratives that cloud people's understanding of the George Zimmerman case: one about race, the other about the alleged defects of Florida's self-defense law. Last year the Tampa Bay Times tried to get a sense of how these two factors interact by looking at racial patterns in self-defense cases. Its findings belie the idea that the enforcement of Florida's law is biased against black defendants:

The Times analysis found no obvious bias in how black defendants have been treated:

• Whites who invoked the law were charged at the same rate as blacks.

• Whites who went to trial were convicted at the same rate as blacks.

• In mixed-race cases involving fatalities, the outcomes were similar. Four of the five blacks who killed a white went free; five of the six whites who killed a black went free.

• Overall, black defendants went free 66 percent of the time in fatal cases compared to 61 percent for white defendants—a difference explained, in part, by the fact blacks were more likely to kill another black.

That last point relates to a finding that could be seen as evidence of racial bias: While black and white defendants fared equally well, people who killed blacks were more likely to make successful self-defense claims than people who killed whites. "People who killed a black person walked free 73 percent of the time," the Times reported, "while those who killed a white person went free 59 percent of the time." The Times conceded that its analysis "does not prove that race caused the disparity between cases with black and white victims," since "other factors may be at play." For example, "black victims were more likely to be carrying a weapon when they were killed" and "more likely than whites to be committing a crime, such as burglary, at the time."

Critics of Florida's law may seize upon the numbers regarding victims and cite Zimmerman's acquittal as another example of how the criminal justice system values black people's lives less than white people's. But they will find no support in the numbers regarding defendants for the often heard claim that Trayvon Martin would have been arrested immediately and ultimately convicted if he had shot Zimmerman instead of the other way around. And as Reason Contributing Editor Walter Olson notes in a recent CNN.com essay, anyone who is concerned about racial disparities in the justice system should think twice before responding to Zimmerman's acquittal by supporting legal changes that would make it easier to convict people and send them to prison.

It may be risky drawing any firm conclusions from these numbers, since self-defense claims involving the use of lethal force are pretty rare. The Times found a total of 192 such cases since 2005, or less than 20 a year, which is less than 2 percent of all homicides in Florida. When you get into subgroup analyses, the numbers are tiny. For example, the Times identified "only 26 completed cases in which a black person was killed and only eight fatalities with a Hispanic victim."

The other thing to note about these cases is that it's not clear to what extent, if at all, the new features of Florida's law, such as eliminating the duty to retreat for people attacked outside their homes, affected the outcomes. It is therefore misleading to call them "stand your ground" cases, as the Times does.

Addendum: Speaking of misleading journalistic references to "stand your ground," NPR host Robin Young yesterday explained its relevance to Zimmerman's acquittal this way: "The law was not used by the Zimmerman defense team, but it infused the case." That gloss (which Robert Woolley brought to my attention) is reminiscent of New York Times reporter Cara Buckley's assertion that the trial was "spotlighting Florida's Stand Your Ground law," even though "that law has not been invoked in this case." Attorney General Eric Holder was a bit subtler on Tuesday, saying "it's time to question laws that senselessly expand the concept of self-defense," although that issue is "separate and apart from the case that has drawn the nation's attention."

[Thanks to John Banzhaf for the tip.]

[sheclown]

I guess Dionne is telling Stevie "that's what friends are for..."

[JayBird]

Stand Your Ground laws tend to track the existing racial disparities in homicide convictions across the U.S. — with one significant exception: Whites who kill blacks in Stand Your Ground states are far more likely to be found justified in their killings. In non-Stand Your Ground states, whites are 250 percent more likely to be found justified in killing a black person than a white person who kills another white person; in Stand Your Ground states, that number jumps to 354 percent.

Much more statistics and several studies
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/criminal-justice/is-there-racial-bias-in-stand-your-ground-laws/

For anyone whom thinks more white criminals get away with murdering blacks in Stand Your Ground states, that is wrong. They get away with more in every state. And of course that racial bias exists, one of these Zimmerman threads someone posted a great video today with absolute proof that a white person can commit a crime an get away with it easier than a minority. I don't think anyone debates that. The question is, how to change that.

The problem with these studies is that just like in finance, the books are so easy to cook and manipulate and fit whomever the person orchestrating the study needs it to say. Actually, it is exactly rigging say a parking study in Riverside-Avondale.

[sheclown]

^Indeed they might but we don't have to be first out of the gate with that discussion do we?  lol  I think we have enough to talk about just sticking to today's issues.

Its the same issue.  Progress for an individual isn't necessarily progress for everyone.  Its not like racism suspended itself in order to elect Obama.

The country was literally in the middle of a free fall collapse caused by 16 years of idiotic, corrupt Republican mismanagement.  The economy had literally crashed for the first time in 80 years, while we were in the middle of at least two wars.

Its not like white people were wandering through a meadow one day, thoughtfully turned to each other and softly whispered:  "Its time.".

A great sign, yes.  But it will be more hopeful in the future, as we work our way through the bigotry that is at the core of so much public policy.

its ridiculous to think of how much politics is expended in making sure that so many different groups don't get a leg up.

this is the funniest thing I've ever read. 

[deathstar]

I am scared as hell right now to live in this city, especially the side of town that I reside in, which seems to have had a murder almost every single day now for the past 2 weeks. What the hell is going on? I don't know if it's just me, but ever since the Mayor announced the budget cut, BOOM, the shit just hit the fan. My work place, which just so happens to be close to the CVS involved in just one of many robberies/shootings, has got us on a tight leash now. Good thing, sure. But, in all the years I've worked there, it's never been an issue. We are no longer allowed to keep the back door open when receiving a truck. When we walk out to our cars, management wants someone to walk with us and for us to park closer while on break if we're working late. I'm sure a lot of these issues have been discussed here lately, but I just had to come online and vent. Am I the only one who feels this way? I don't own a gun, and with the Stand Your Ground BS going on right now, I don't know how I'd react if someone were to run up on me with a gun, demanding money or something, if I had a gun. I carry a mighty large pocket knife, but would that save me? And, if I used it in self defense, then what? I read somewhere there have been 56 homicides so far this year, and even 1 frightens the hell out of me. I just wonder what's more important right now, the budget? Which, I've already read many opinions on the job that JSO is doing, and I'm still on the fence.. but is there anything they COULD do to put fear into the civilians who are out for blood?

[Garden guy]

D, Welcome to a redneck city in the southeast with lots of poor and uneducated people who are desperate...and so many of our cities decide to follow the republicans and defund public schools and programs...i see this all as a sample of what happens when kids dont learn and learn early...record amount of babies showing up at school not knowing a thing...

[sheclown]

Jacksonville is one of the cities.

For more info:

http://nationalactionnetwork.net/events/563/justice-for-trayvon-national-day-of-action-vigils-in-100-cities/

[sheclown]

"Mary Mary" has joined Stevie Wonder's boycott:

http://www.youtube.com/v/V7eZD3TKn_M?version=3&amp;hl=en_US

"Just say no to Florida"

http://goblackcentral.com/2013/07/mary-mary-joins-stevie-wonder-and-eddie-levert-in-florida-boycott-boycottflorida/