Elements of Urbanism: Charlotte

[chipwich]

Charlotte definitely appears to be pulling ahead to become another Atlanta.  Aside from Salt Lake City, I think their downtown is the cleanest urban setting I haven seen in our country.

They have are pulling in a good deal of companies from the research triangle and trying hard to attract new residents and shake off their small town roots.

I am really hoping Jacksonville can do the same.  We are a good city and have allot going for us, but like David said, I too have always considered Charlotte our "sister city" and judge our progress based on how Charlotte is doing (among other mid-sized cities).  At the moment, it looks like their playbook is filled with better strategies and more forward thinking leadership.

[fsujax]

it is interesting to read some of the comments in that story. Some actually arguing downtown Charlotte is still dead. I shudder to think what they would say about our downtown. Actually, they never even mention us. Nashville and Raleigh are mentioned by the posters.

[Keith-N-Jax]

Some really nice looking buildings.

[peestandingup]

I understand our downtown lacks in comparison, but I'm trying to figure out why people give Charlotte such props. I mean, yeah, I get it. It's got some places to eat downtown, some bars & a light rail, but it's a mini version of Atlanta, just without the history. The reason why it looks so clean is because it's practically a brand new city in many ways. Built on the banking industry & sprawl, two major players that's really screwed up the nation in the last couple decades (can anyone deny that?). A boom town that got built out with the automobile in mind instead of people, but trying to retrofit it to be the other way around (in some areas), all surrounded by ugly glass high rises & uninteresting chain crap.

Am I missing something? Is this the kind of stuff that other cities in the south are striving to be like now, or are we all just "OOO-ing" & "AHHH-ing" because the majority of southern cities stink so badly?? Honest questions.

I think Bradley's comment sums it up: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-and-economy/2012/09/anatomy-boomtown-real-story-behind-rise-charlotte/3129/#comment-639554467

[Tacachale]

^I don't know, maybe because they've started doing some things right and it's paying off? Why else would be talking about this?

[vicupstate]

I understand our downtown lacks in comparison, but I'm trying to figure out why people give Charlotte such props. I mean, yeah, I get it. It's got some places to eat downtown, some bars & a light rail, but it's a mini version of Atlanta, just without the history. The reason why it looks so clean is because it's practically a brand new city in many ways. Built on the banking industry & sprawl, two major players that's really screwed up the nation in the last couple decades (can anyone deny that?). A boom town that got built out with the automobile in mind instead of people, but trying to retrofit it to be the other way around (in some areas), all surrounded by ugly glass high rises & uninteresting chain crap.

Am I missing something? Is this the kind of stuff that other cities in the south are striving to be like now, or are we all just "OOO-ing" & "AHHH-ing" because the majority of southern cities stink so badly?? Honest questions.

I think Bradley's comment sums it up: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-and-economy/2012/09/anatomy-boomtown-real-story-behind-rise-charlotte/3129/#comment-639554467

Isn't Jacksonville the same thing, only WITHOUT the downtown eaterys/bars and light rail?   

[Captain Zissou]

Some cities start historic and stay historic (Savannah, Jax, Charleston), some start historic and add modern (Atl, Jax-ish, NoLa), some lack historic building stock but develop anyway (Charlotte).  Cities develop in different ways, but all have their place..  Charlotte has developed in rapid fashion over the past few decades and with a concentration on smart growth around the downtown core.  You can't blame them for lacking the historic building stock, but it is a disadvantage compared to Jax. 

[JFman00]

Some cities start historic and stay historic (Savannah, Jax, Charleston), some start historic and add modern (Atl, Jax-ish, NoLa), some lack historic building stock but develop anyway (Charlotte).  Cities develop in different ways, but all have their place..  Charlotte has developed in rapid fashion over the past few decades and with a concentration on smart growth around the downtown core.  You can't blame them for lacking the historic building stock, but it is a disadvantage compared to Jax.

I will say for NOLA, I am very impressed with how that city has developed since the storm. While I think the geographic challenges of the area have proved a somewhat effective barrier to sprawl, I am shocked at how quickly and (mostly) effectively areas like the Warehouse District, CBD and Uptown are developing even in the midst of the downturn and a famously problematic local government.

I think it's hopeful seeing cities like Charlotte (a former backwater) and New Orleans (one of the great cesspits of the US) revitalize their urban areas. If they can do it, so can Jax.

[peestandingup]

^I don't know, maybe because they've started doing some things right and it's paying off? Why else would be talking about this?

Paying off for who? They don't seem like they're interested in investing in people as much as they are "stuff", just plopping it down as fast as they can. And like I said, all built on two shaky, arguably unsustainable growth methods. A lot of that is really artificial, so "working" doesn't necessarily mean "smart" & is arguable.

Isn't Jacksonville the same thing, only WITHOUT the downtown eaterys/bars and light rail?

A lot of it. But I'd say our core neighborhoods are a hell of a lot more interesting & set up to work with each other better, on a pedestrian level. Although many of them aren't being utilized (or are being/have been torn apart) & are the product of city leaders who don't know WTF they're doing.

[David]

Am I missing something? Is this the kind of stuff that other cities in the south are striving to be like now, or are we all just "OOO-ing" & "AHHH-ing" because the majority of southern cities stink so badly?? Honest questions.

Pretty much. Who else do we really have to compare ourselves to? Atlanta's 4 times our size. Orlando/Tampa/Miami are a different breed in my opinion. More of what people think of when they think Florida.

I'd say the oohs and ahhhs come from them being ahead of us. Vibrant downtown, the legendary LIGHT RAIL and steady (urban) growth. In the mid 2000's it seemed our downtown was poised for explosive growth and since then there's been some improvements, but Charlotte's experiencing what I thought we'd have here by now. 

[vicupstate]

Atlanta and Charlotte had just as much history  and urban development as Jax or more, but they systematically and deliberately destroyed it.

This was done primarily in the 60's , 70's and '80's.  This was considered 'progress' back in those days, by government, and Chamber of Commerce types.

Finally, they have learned to keep what little they have left.  So much was gone that they had to build new, and fortunately they had the growth and determination to fulfill that option.

Jax is still following the pattern of tear it down and hope something new comes in to replace it.  The powers that be are only now realizing that is the wrong idea, and trying to change that trajectory.  Lets hope they succeed and before Bostwick and Annie Lytle, etc. fall to the wrecking ball too.

[thelakelander]

Charlotte was half the size as Jax before the 1960s, so its historic core is somewhat smaller. 

Charlotte during the 1950s.

http://specialcollections.uncc.edu/

Like Jax, they also ripped down a chunk of it during the 1970s.

Uptown Charlotte 1973

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=4986942&postcount=50

Charlotte skyline 1975

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=4985365&postcount=46


There's still historic fabric.  There's certainly successful adaptive reuse in the images below.  However, it tends to blend in, which says a lot about their maintenance and preservation of what's left.

[fsquid]

I believe there is also only one historical district in Charlotte where you have to go through architectural things like Springfield, Riverside, etc.    That is Dilworth.  In any other part of town, you can buy an old home and tear them down and build what you want.   Myers Park and Eastway are probably the wealthiest neighborhoods there and you can go down any street in those neighborhoods and see where someone has bought a house built around the 40s and 50s and is tearing it down to build new.

[ben says]

I understand our downtown lacks in comparison, but I'm trying to figure out why people give Charlotte such props. I mean, yeah, I get it. It's got some places to eat downtown, some bars & a light rail, but it's a mini version of Atlanta, just without the history. The reason why it looks so clean is because it's practically a brand new city in many ways. Built on the banking industry & sprawl, two major players that's really screwed up the nation in the last couple decades (can anyone deny that?). A boom town that got built out with the automobile in mind instead of people, but trying to retrofit it to be the other way around (in some areas), all surrounded by ugly glass high rises & uninteresting chain crap.

Am I missing something? Is this the kind of stuff that other cities in the south are striving to be like now, or are we all just "OOO-ing" & "AHHH-ing" because the majority of southern cities stink so badly?? Honest questions.

I think Bradley's comment sums it up: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/jobs-and-economy/2012/09/anatomy-boomtown-real-story-behind-rise-charlotte/3129/#comment-639554467

I'm going to go out on a limb here and take the unpopular position that you've expressed....I don't "get" Charlotte either. Been many times, never been impressed. There history is nil, their historic stock is smaller than Jax, and the newness gives me the sterile vibe. It feels like a modern prop-up town, like in Blazing Saddles....look behind everything and you'll find fresh paint and fresh paint only.

I'll take ATL, Jax, Savannah, Charleston, Nola, Nashville ANYDAY to Charlotte.

[thelakelander]

I spend less time on focusing on the landscape and more time focusing on how things have been implemented to get where they are today.  Think whatever you want to think about the place and its character, but can you imagine if Charlotte's leaders had Jacksonville's assets and location at their disposal?