What Khan We Expect for the Laura Street Trio?

[Anti redneck]

Chris.. If not renovated into apartments or lofts, what would you /everyone envision working in the Trio Space?

just curious.

I'm not Chris, but.....

A fancy hotel and a nice fancy restaurant. Duh.

[Timkin]

Chris.. If not renovated into apartments or lofts, what would you /everyone envision working in the Trio Space?

just curious.

I'm not Chris, but.....

A fancy hotel and a nice fancy restaurant. Duh.

Um.. okay..   Duh. 

[Steve_Lovett]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

[ChriswUfGator]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

I can't help noticing that there are already two large upscale hotels within blocks of there barely making it, one of which is already taxpayer-subsidized. Maybe I lack fiscal sensibilities, but I'm having a bit of difficulty with the concept of demand being insufficient to support two, so the intelligent thing to do is to build a third? What term would you prefer I use for that?

Is the hotel still part of the project, or is it just down to the condo portion for the Laura trio now?

[Tacachale]

^Presumably it's still all part of one project, as that was the only way to get all the tax credits they were talking about before.

Also, the hotel is supposed to be one of those chic places with a heavy emphasis on its bars and nightlife. If that's the case, that will would be a big chunk of their revenue. And there's nothing like that in Jacksonville.

[ChriswUfGator]

There are plenty of bars and clubs that don't have 18 stories of hotel on top of them to support. Those do well in travel hubs, which we aren't. I'm not sure that concept works in that location. Will people go look at it and have a drink at the bar? Yes. Will they stay there the 300-something days a year when there is no convention or football game in town? Doubtful. I guess there might be a few exceptions, but barring renovations or something, most people don't stay in hotels in the same city where they already live. And there is no travel traffic, that location is nowhere near the airport, train station, or anything else. It would be competing for the same convention and game-day business that is insufficient to support the existing hotels. If they want to open up a nightclub, then open up a nightclub. That might actually work out.

[acme54321]

Maybe like the Bohemian in Savannah?  I thought the Barnett plan had only a portion of the floors as hotel and the rest were condos/apartments?

[hightowerlover]

A W Hotel would change the status quo.

[Steve_Lovett]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

I can't help noticing that there are already two large upscale hotels within blocks of there barely making it, one of which is already taxpayer-subsidized. Maybe I lack fiscal sensibilities, but I'm having a bit of difficulty with the concept of demand being insufficient to support two, so the intelligent thing to do is to build a third? What term would you prefer I use for that?

Is the hotel still part of the project, or is it just down to the condo portion for the Laura trio now?

The hotel concept in the Barnett/Trio has never been "large upscale" to compete with the Omni/Hyatt. It's a different space and scale in the market than those trying to fill 600-900 beds per night in a nameless, faceless property.

The Laura Trio hasn't had a "condo portion".

[ChriswUfGator]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

I can't help noticing that there are already two large upscale hotels within blocks of there barely making it, one of which is already taxpayer-subsidized. Maybe I lack fiscal sensibilities, but I'm having a bit of difficulty with the concept of demand being insufficient to support two, so the intelligent thing to do is to build a third? What term would you prefer I use for that?

Is the hotel still part of the project, or is it just down to the condo portion for the Laura trio now?

The hotel concept in the Barnett/Trio has never been "large upscale" to compete with the Omni/Hyatt. It's a different space and scale in the market than those trying to fill 600-900 beds per night in a nameless, faceless property.

The Laura Trio hasn't had a "condo portion".

What was the companion tower in the renderings for then?

[ChriswUfGator]

Maybe like the Bohemian in Savannah?  I thought the Barnett plan had only a portion of the floors as hotel and the rest were condos/apartments?

We could spend hours discussing the differences between the wharf area in downtown Savannah and the Barnett building in downtown Jacksonville. You'd almost have to be trying to lose money at that location in Savannah. The same hardly holds true here.

[acme54321]

Maybe like the Bohemian in Savannah?  I thought the Barnett plan had only a portion of the floors as hotel and the rest were condos/apartments?

We could spend hours discussing the differences between the wharf area in downtown Savannah and the Barnett building in downtown Jacksonville. You'd almost have to be trying to lose money at that location in Savannah. The same hardly holds true here.

Really?

[ChriswUfGator]

Maybe like the Bohemian in Savannah?  I thought the Barnett plan had only a portion of the floors as hotel and the rest were condos/apartments?

We could spend hours discussing the differences between the wharf area in downtown Savannah and the Barnett building in downtown Jacksonville. You'd almost have to be trying to lose money at that location in Savannah. The same hardly holds true here.

Really?

Have you been downtown this decade?

[Steve_Lovett]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

I can't help noticing that there are already two large upscale hotels within blocks of there barely making it, one of which is already taxpayer-subsidized. Maybe I lack fiscal sensibilities, but I'm having a bit of difficulty with the concept of demand being insufficient to support two, so the intelligent thing to do is to build a third? What term would you prefer I use for that?

Is the hotel still part of the project, or is it just down to the condo portion for the Laura trio now?

The hotel concept in the Barnett/Trio has never been "large upscale" to compete with the Omni/Hyatt. It's a different space and scale in the market than those trying to fill 600-900 beds per night in a nameless, faceless property.

The Laura Trio hasn't had a "condo portion".

What was the companion tower in the renderings for then?

Apartments. Rental product. Not condo.

[ChriswUfGator]

I assure you that the project is not dead in the water.

There is forward-moving progress occurring daily.

I can also assure you that the development plan is not a fiscal folly.

I can't help noticing that there are already two large upscale hotels within blocks of there barely making it, one of which is already taxpayer-subsidized. Maybe I lack fiscal sensibilities, but I'm having a bit of difficulty with the concept of demand being insufficient to support two, so the intelligent thing to do is to build a third? What term would you prefer I use for that?

Is the hotel still part of the project, or is it just down to the condo portion for the Laura trio now?

The hotel concept in the Barnett/Trio has never been "large upscale" to compete with the Omni/Hyatt. It's a different space and scale in the market than those trying to fill 600-900 beds per night in a nameless, faceless property.

The Laura Trio hasn't had a "condo portion".

What was the companion tower in the renderings for then?

Apartments. Rental product. Not condo.

That's even worse.

11E and the Carling have only hung on because of taxpayer subsidies, and those projects nearly bankrupted Vestcor, which narrowly escaped when the city agreed to renegotiate bond payments. Judging by the price tag of this project, I'm guessing this won't be affordable housing. So we're back to square one, which is that there is already insufficient demand to support identical competing uses, so clearly the smart move is to build another one?

Figure out a way to make it affordable housing, it'll fill up.

But what you're proposing, there's no market for.