Dump the Pump

[peestandingup]

Well its working some somebody. JTA had 10-11 million trips last year and they're running more than 8% higher this year. I think duvaldude is a good example. It works for him. I'm sure it works for many. And for many it doesn't.

I am of the opinion that a majority of those 10-11 million trips are from riders who have no other choice for transportation other than walking.  I think JTA can serve almost all of us, it is just not a good use of time to do so. 

Some people just have no other choice than to use the inefficient JTA. 

Truth. Anyone who's ridden the bus here in Jax multiple times knows that the vast majority of people who are on there simply HAVE to be. You've got your poor, your disabled, the guy who got busted one too many times for DUI, the single mom with her kids, etc. I'd imagine there's a very very tiny percentage of riders there simply because they chose to go carless.

Which is really why the whole "dump the pump" thing is kinda absurd at this point. Like I said, JTA & city transit authorities. You first.

[Doctor_K]

Which is really why the whole "dump the pump" thing is kinda absurd at this point. Like I said, JTA & city transit authorities. You first.

+1

[ChriswUfGator]

Well its working some somebody. JTA had 10-11 million trips last year and they're running more than 8% higher this year. I think duvaldude is a good example. It works for him. I'm sure it works for many. And for many it doesn't.

I am of the opinion that a majority of those 10-11 million trips are from riders who have no other choice for transportation other than walking.  I think JTA can serve almost all of us, it is just not a good use of time to do so.  

Some people just have no other choice than to use the inefficient JTA.  

Truth. Anyone who's ridden the bus here in Jax multiple times knows that the vast majority of people who are on there simply HAVE to be. You've got your poor, your disabled, the guy who got busted one too many times for DUI, the single mom with her kids, etc. I'd imagine there's a very very tiny percentage of riders there simply because they chose to go carless.

Which is really why the whole "dump the pump" thing is kinda absurd at this point. Like I said, JTA & city transit authorities. You first.

+1

JTA is not a usable transit system for people who have any other option available to them.

Hour-long headways on many routes, combined with an asinine route structure that forces every rider to first go downtown and change buses at Rosa Parks station regardless of whether or not their destination was right down the street, really eliminates the possibility of JTA being a viable transit option for people with any kind of schedule.

It takes two hours to get anywhere on JTA. After you wait a half-hour for the bus, you then spend 40 minutes circling back to Rosa Parks station downtown, where you get to wait another half hour for the connecting bus, and then spend another 40 minutes on that circling around to your destination. Plus however much time you spent walking to/from the bus stops.

There are only 8 hours in the average work day. Most people would rather ride a herpetic donkey to work than spend an additional 4 hours commuting there and back on JTA.

[danem]

If all the routes currently go downtown, seems like one fix is to put several of transfer stations as hubs throughout this large city. Have shorter loops that only end at these hubs, which allow people to go elsewhere (even downtown) from there.

Gainesville is a lot smaller in land area, and even their routes don't all go downtown!

[Doctor_K]

If all the routes currently go downtown, seems like one fix is to put several of transfer stations as hubs throughout this large city. Have shorter loops that only end at these hubs, which allow people to go elsewhere (even downtown) from there.

Gainesville is a lot smaller in land area, and even their routes don't all go downtown!

Makes a lot of sense.  With the passage of the mobility plan, and thus I believe commuter rail finally moving forward for real, some of those 'hubs' could be at multimodal stations along the rail spine.  

For the south commuter rail route alone, that could mean that stations at...

Greenland Rd, The Avenues, Baymeadows, JTB, University/Bowden/Old St. Aug, Emerson, and San Marco/Atlantic

...each would have a handful of dedicated "regional" or "shuttle service"-type bus routes emanating from them for the immediate surrounding areas.

More reliable and available service, MUCH shorter headways, links to the commuter rail spine, denser infill along at least the rail spine, less traffic (or at least reduced traffic growth) on the Southside due to reliable and relevant bus- and rail-based mass transit.

And if I remember correctly, this southeast commuter rail alignment was projected to have the lowest ridership of the original three.  I can only imagine how much greater the impact would be on the North side and in the Southwest quadrant.

I can't see any down sides to this.

[tufsu1]

Truth. Anyone who's ridden the bus here in Jax multiple times knows that the vast majority of people who are on there simply HAVE to be.

this is true for almost every mass transit agency in the country...generally, those that are transit-captive (have no access to a car) comprise 60-80% of system ridership....even transit-heavy cities like DC, CHI, and NYC are around 60%....in the case of JTA, it is around 75%.

[Gators312]

Truth. Anyone who's ridden the bus here in Jax multiple times knows that the vast majority of people who are on there simply HAVE to be.

this is true for almost every mass transit agency in the country...generally, those that are transit-captive (have no access to a car) comprise 60-80% of system ridership....even transit-heavy cities like DC, CHI, and NYC are around 60%....in the case of JTA, it is around 75%.

TU-

I am curious how much of that 60-80% choose to not have a car in the cities you mention?  Transit works there so it is a real alternative to having a car.  The NE corridor transit is capable of moving people from large city to large city in addition to being efficient inside those cities as well. 

It pretty much eliminates the need for a car, and in those cities parking is a huge logistical issue and expense for the everyday car owner.

   

[tufsu1]

I think the choice of having no car at all is really only made in NYC...in cities like Chicago, Dc, Bostron, San Fran, etc. most still choose have at least 1 car...but they may choose not to have 2 or more.

so the real question here is...assuming JTA had a decent transit system, how many folks would be willing to give up their car(s) entirely?

[danem]

I think the choice of having no car at all is really only made in NYC...in cities like Chicago, Dc, Bostron, San Fran, etc. most still choose have at least 1 car...but they may choose not to have 2 or more.

so the real question here is...assuming JTA had a decent transit system, how many folks would be willing to give up their car(s) entirely?

I don't know about entirely. I like to be able to trek off out of town or go see family, and in some instances, I prefer the more direct route that the car could take. That said, I would gladly take transit at least part of the time to cut down on using the car just for certain errands nearby--especially for some SJTC visits.

[urbaknight]

Well its working some somebody. JTA had 10-11 million trips last year and they're running more than 8% higher this year. I think duvaldude is a good example. It works for him. I'm sure it works for many. And for many it doesn't.

I am of the opinion that a majority of those 10-11 million trips are from riders who have no other choice for transportation other than walking.  I think JTA can serve almost all of us, it is just not a good use of time to do so. 

Some people just have no other choice than to use the inefficient JTA. 

I'm one of them, due to being legally blind. And with the southern conservative, it's every man for himself, and if you can't get yours than tough but don't expect us to bail you out, powers that be, I find it very frustrating that they treat us like welfare abusers. And nevermind the lack of regard for pedestrian rights.

Social services are all located in the burbs, some of them like Social Security and the Division of Blind Services (I use these as examples because I familiar with them) do not even Have a bus that runs by them! The people they serve can't drive! So instead of forcing us to be a further burden on loved ones, let's move ALL social services downtown in some of these empty buildings. Many are just blocks away from the Skyway. DBS preaches and teaches of independence in living and mobility. Here's the perfect chance at implementing this lesson. Encourage these people with disabilities to get themselves to their appointments at their specific service sites DownTown.