Why market forces will favor walkable over auto-dependent neighborhoods

[dougskiles]

Doug, does he really believe that the vision of a sprawled out city is actually sustainable for the city's budget?  Who pays for the infrastructure (highways, ROW, public safety, libraries, parks, schools, etc.) and their ongoing maintenance to keep this type of development style going?  Also, next time you get into one of these discussions, ask him if he can provide one example of a city in Jax's tier that has been successful at ignoring sustainability and downtown revitalization altogether to promote sprawl.  My guess, is that he won't be able to answer that question because that community doesn't exist.  Thus, considering it doesn't exist, what factual evidence is he bringing to the table to suggest that Jax should go down the path of uncharted waters?

Funny that you say that about examples - because I asked for one.  Nothing.

Like most people, if you tell yourself a lie long enough, at some point you will begin to believe it.  These guys could care less about the quality of life in Jacksonville as long as they can continue to get more roads to serve their shopping centers and tax breaks.

With regard to electric cars, they would promote a more compact urban development pattern because of their limited range.  My next car will be electric.  If there is a next car.

[peestandingup]

Hopefully the mindset will change soon, but we may be taking a huge step back if Hogan is elected.  I was talking this morning to one of Hogan's key supporters and he was telling me how we have it all wrong.  We shouldn't be looking for a more dense urban core like Indianapolis, instead we should celebrate that we have a very large and spread out city with lots of undeveloped land to work with. Not a surprising response from him considering that he works for one of the larger shopping center developers in the city.  I'm trying - albeit not very successfully - to get them to focus on re-developing older neighborhoods, but unfortunately they are so heavily invested in suburban land that I don't see them turning around any time soon.  You would think that as someone who benefits from people having disposable income to spend in retail stores that they would want to see a system where people aren't spending all of their money on gas, but they apparently can't see past the property tax reductions they have been promised in return for their political support.

That's simply amazing. This guy's wanting more of it & spinning expansion/sprawl as a positive when anyone with half a brain knows damn well it's not. To a certain extent it's needed I suppose if its called for, but not more of it the MOST SPREAD OUT CITY IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY WITH A HALF DEAD CORE.

Most cities these days are scaling back big time & putting an absolute halt on anymore boundary or development expansion whatsoever. This is funny this came up here because I just read an article today in Lexington's paper (old stomping ground) where their new Mayor is doing just that. http://www.kentucky.com/2011/04/27/1720180/boundary-for-development-in-fayette.html Speaking of which, this guy's awesome & has me actually thinking of moving back there (something I would have never considered a few years ago). They've got bike lanes & paths up the wazoo now, a crapload of core development, and an openly gay Mayor (not that I care either way, but that's pretty freakin progressive for the south).

You guys ever thought of doing an "Elements of Urbanism" on them?? I'd be curious to see what you came up with.

Anyways, regarding Hogan, this guy's gonna screw Jacksonville 12 ways from Sunday. I can't believe he's talking about expansion in THIS town, especially with things the way they are right now. "Conservative" my ass.

[tufsu1]

Electric car or not, you still have to pay for and forever maintain the additional infrastructure needed to serve less people per square mile. 

that's someone else's problem 20 years from now!

[hillary supporter]

There is a way out and that hinges on the bet of a future electric car system.  That is one super risky bet that the entire country seems to be taking.  There are so many things that can go wrong with that bet it's not even funny thinking about it.  

However, if that bet does work, well, we can continue working the way we do.  

P.S.  If you don't like nuclear power & major mining disasters, you might not like this direction.  Think about it.  

Its my opinion through experience that the bet on electric cars is a bit safer than you may be aware. Nissan Leaf has been selected 2011 car of the year. I drove one this past spring and its incredible. the price for 100 mile capacity is $2.15 at 1/6th price of gas. It can recharge at 80% capacity in 30 minutes. There will be recharging stations throughout the metropolitan area.
Yes, you will have to maintain infrastructure, but it would realistically be along the same cost as rapid mass transit including fixed transit. If not less.
If you re considering a new car, you must look at the electric cars. They will be the cars of the future, with the only holdout or, more to the point holdup today, being battery technology.
Tesla motors has developed a  higher performance car that is competitive to mid size autos. All the major car manufactors are in this market and it will define the future of what we are talking about here. In a true dense urban area,electric cars will not be (as) realistic as they will need charging stations. But less urban areas as our core neughborhoods will be perfect for electrics. Electrics should be appliable to suburban areas also.
As an example, 100 mile capacity is a lot for even the Jax metro area.