Poll: 67% of Floridians support state or federal funding for High Speed Rail

[FayeforCure]

Why Would Scott be So Stubborn & Irresponsible?
More likely than not, I think the reason for Scott rejecting the funds is basically to continue the new extreme Republican party’s complete obstructionism to everything the Obama administration tries to do. They want to make Obama look like a failure by ruining the United States (or their portion of the United States) while he’s in office. It’s a political move that essentially means holding the public hostage.

Florida Support for High-Speed Rail
If you think Scott is playing to the preferences of the voters, think again. 67% of Floridians polled on the matter support state or federal funding for high-speed rail and only 17% oppose it.

Floridians want high-speed rail. They are tired of traffic jams and want the economic growth and job creation that comes with the project, which is nearly entirely funded by the federal government anyway. They don’t want to go down the route of Wisconsin and be the laughing stock of the United States.

http://planetsave.com/2011/03/02/florida-gov-rick-scott-gets-sued-for-stupidity-regarding-high-speed-rail/

Did I mention yet that Tea Party Governor Rick Scott is a LIAR?

His repeated statement is such a joke and a certified LIE: that he is protecting the tax-payer

Joyner said, “The issue at hand is the ability to create a state-of-the-art rail line, at no cost to the taxpayers, and put people to work now and in the future."

She added that “Stopping this project not only went against everything the governor promised during his campaign, it goes against his constitutional authority as well. The money Florida taxpayers sent to Washington should return to benefit Florida. Unfortunately, litigation was the only way to make that happen.”

"We need to let (Scott) know that this is not a monarchy and he is not a king," Joyner said.

Altman added, “Our founding fathers created a system of three separate and co-equal branches of government. To maintain the integrity of our democracy, it is incumbent that we assert the rights of the people who elect their representatives. And the Supreme Court is the proper venue to seek relief.”

The emergency petition was filed because of a one-week deadline given by U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood for Florida to accept the rail funding. Altman and Jones have since asked for an extension on that deadline as the case is being investigated



Read more: http://www.allheadlinenews.com/briefs/articles/90037459?FL%20lawmakers%20sue%20governor%20for%20rejecting%20high-speep%20rail%20money#ixzz1FU4dzkwO

[FayeforCure]

Joseph Little, professor emeritus at the University of Florida law school who specializes in state Constitutional law, said he believes Altman and Joyner have a strong case.

“In my opinion, once the Legislature enacts the statute and directs that something be done, then the governor’s job is to enforce that statute,” Little said. “He can say he doesn’t like it, but he has to enforce it.”



Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/03/02/2094553_p2/scott-again-slams-high-speed-rail.html#ixzz1FVGOgsfw

[BridgeTroll]

If you think Scott is playing to the preferences of the voters, think again. 67% of Floridians polled on the matter support state or federal funding for high-speed rail and only 17% oppose it.

Kinda sucks these folks will take the time to answer a telephone poll... but cannot take 15 minutes to vote...

[thelakelander]

Joseph Little, professor emeritus at the University of Florida law school who specializes in state Constitutional law, said he believes Altman and Joyner have a strong case.

"In my opinion, once the Legislature enacts the statute and directs that something be done, then the governor's job is to enforce that statute," Little said. "He can say he doesn't like it, but he has to enforce it."



Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/03/02/2094553_p2/scott-again-slams-high-speed-rail.html#ixzz1FVGOgsfw

It appears this guy is predicting a win for both sides.  He'll be right, either way.

Joseph Little, an emeritus law professor at the University of Florida and a constitutional law expert, said he thinks the Supreme Court may well side with Scott. "It's highly likely," Little said.

One of Scott's strongest arguments, Little said, is that Altman and Joyner do not have the legal standing to file the suit. The two are acting as private citizens, he said, and not with the backing of the Legislature.

To argue before the court, Little said, the two lawmakers would have to show they might suffer a loss greater than the public at large. In Little's opinion, they have not met that hurdle.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-high-speed-rail-respond-20110302,0,2266145.story

[Ocklawaha]

No doubt Faye, I'm surprised it's not 98% of Floridians... Because something like:

99% of them believe monorail is the train of the future

99.6% of them think you can build HSR anywhere, just build it and they will come

90% think Florida HSR is an honest effort to build the best railroad in the nation

Poll: U.S. hiding knowledge of aliens

CNN, June 15, 1997

original source  |  fair use notice

Summary: Nearly 50 years since an alleged UFO was sighted at Roswell, New Mexico, a CNN/Time poll shows that 80 percent of Americans think the government is hiding knowledge of the existence of extraterrestrial life forms.

Nearly 50 years since an alleged UFO was sighted at Roswell, New Mexico, a new CNN/Time poll released Sunday shows that 80 percent of Americans think the government is hiding knowledge of the existence of extraterrestrial life forms.

While nearly three-quarters of the 1,024 adults questioned for the poll said they had never seen or known anyone who saw a UFO, 54 percent believe intelligent life exists outside Earth.

Sixty-four percent of the respondents said that aliens have contacted humans, half said they've abducted humans, and 37 percent said they have contacted the U.S. government. The poll has a margin of error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

But only 9 percent said they believed there were any aliens near the Hale-Bopp comet, which recently passed close enough to Earth to be seen with the naked eye.

Some "ufologists" believed a spacecraft was hidden near the comet, and members of the Heaven's Gate cult committed suicide, believing that they would be taken aboard the craft and returned "home."

What happened in Roswell?

As for the Roswell incident, nearly two-thirds of the respondents to the poll said they believed that a UFO crash-landed in a field outside the New Mexico town 50 years ago next month.

In one of the most famous UFO "sightings" in U.S. history, Roswell residents in 1947 saw lights in the night sky, followed by a loud explosion. A rancher found the "crash site" and removed a large piece of debris, storing it in his shed.

A few days later, Air Force officials from nearby Roswell Air Force Base inspected the site and the debris, and issued a press release announcing the recovery of a "flying disc." The Air Force quickly retracted that statement, and claimed the debris was from a weather balloon.

But countless statements -- some from military personnel -- appeared to contradict the Air Force's revised position. And several "witnesses" claimed to have seen bodies of dead aliens whisked away by the military.

Roswell today capitalizes on its fame as a UFO crash site -- whether or not it actually happened -- and is hosting a 50th anniversary celebration the first week of July.

Friend or foe?
Most people -- 91 percent -- told the pollsters that they had never had contact with aliens or known anyone who had. A similar number -- 93 percent -- said they had never been abducted or known anyone whisked away by beings from another planet.

But if they do meet someone from a galaxy far, far away, 44 percent said they expect to be treated as friends, while 26 percent think they'll be treated as enemies.

Thirty-nine percent don't expect aliens to appear very humanoid, although 35 percent said they probably look "somewhat" human.

SOURCE:  http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc920.htm

(CBS)  This Halloween may be filled with trick-or-treaters in scary costumes, but for more than one in five Americans, some costumes might be real: they told CBS News pollsters they have seen a real-life ghost in some form. And whether or not they've seen one, even more Americans believe that ghosts actually do exist.

Nearly half of Americans say they believe in ghosts, or that the dead can return in certain places and situations.

DO YOU BELIEVE IN GHOSTS?

Yes
48%
No
45%

Women are more likely to say they believe in ghosts than are men: 56 percent of women believe, while 38 percent of men do. More than half of younger Americans aged 18 to 45 believe in ghosts; those over 45 are less likely.

More than one in five Americans says they have seen a ghost themselves, or have felt themselves to be in the presence of one.

HAVE YOU PERSONALLY SEEN OR FELT THE PRESENCE OF A GHOST?

Yes
22%

No
77%

On this question, too, there are age and gender differences: women are about twice as likely as men to say they've seen a ghost. More than one-quarter of younger Americans under 45 say they have encountered one; those over 45 are much less likely to say this.

SOURCE:  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/10/29/opinion/polls/main994766.shtml

Hey, we could increase tourism about 1,000% if we could run high speed trains, powered by alien space technology and filled with ghosts... just saying. Orlando could even bill it as another amusement ride.


OCKLAWAHA

[FayeforCure]

Well yeah, why bother polling Floridians, KING SCOTT knows where it's at.

See how well that worked out for Bush who despised polls too!!!

[Captain Zissou]

A couple things. First, you do know it's spelled liAr, right? If you're going to put something in all caps to draw attention to it, make sure it's spelled right.

Second, who wouldn't support $2.4 billion in free money??  That doesn't necessarily mean you support HSR.

Also, you can't use a voluntary survey's results as credible fact.  In the next 20 minutes, I could do a phone survey and find 100% of people who don't want HSR.  This survey probably had selection bias, false or confusing wording, and again, it doesn't fully address the rail line, just funding.

[FayeforCure]

A couple things. First, you do know it's spelled liAr, right? If you're going to put something in all caps to draw attention to it, make sure it's spelled right.

Second, who wouldn't support $2.4 billion in free money??  That doesn't necessarily mean you support HSR.

Also, you can't use a voluntary survey's results as credible fact.  In the next 20 minutes, I could do a phone survey and find 100% of people who don't want HSR.  This survey probably had selection bias, false or confusing wording, and again, it doesn't fully address the rail line, just funding.

Corrected.

Well it is Scott who according to his own words is worried about funding:

"I represent the taxpayers. This does not make sense," Scott said.

He also said fears the state would have to pay back the money to the federal government if the project failed.

But a letter that the federal government sent late last month to the mayors of Orlando, Tampa and Lakeland promised the administration would not seek reimbursement of the $2.4 billion if the project were abandoned.

That vow also goes for the cities, which have offered to take responsibility for the $2.7 billion project, as well as the state, according to the letter, dated Feb. 28 and signed by John Porcari, deputy secretary of the U.S. Department of Transportation.

One of Scott's biggest complaints about the train is that. But the letter disputes that claim. (Hence Scott is a LIAR, what else is new?)

"In light of the Cities' recent proposal, FRA (Federal Rail Administration) will make clear in any future cooperative agreements for the Tampa-Orlando project that the state of Florida does not bear any financial responsibility for the reimbursement obligation,'' the letter says.

Attempts to reach Scott and federal transportation officials were not successful.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/os-high-speed-rail-respond-20110302,0,2266145.story

So polling Floridians about funding HSR, is quite appropriate and often used for policy decisions.

[thelakelander]

All this tells me is the bidding process should continue and its foolish to cut it off without allowing the rail professionals the opportunity to take over.  If it's feasible, it will move forward.  If it's not, it won't.  We don't need an Ock or Rick Scott to make that decision before rail companies, who may be willing to invest millions of their own, are given the opportunity to bid on it.

[FayeforCure]

Well yeah, why bother polling Floridians, KING SCOTT knows where it's at.

See how well that worked out for Bush who despised polls too!!!

Well, here is a hilarious intermezzo of the King's Speech:

Someone please embed for me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnxNnJYziMY

[Ocklawaha]

All this tells me is the bidding process should continue and its foolish to cut it off without allowing the rail professionals the opportunity to take over.  If it's feasible, it will move forward.  If it's not, it won't.  We don't need an Ock or Rick Scott to make that decision before rail companies, who may be willing to invest millions of their own, are given the opportunity to bid on it.

Amazing, that my opinion isn't needed... Really guys, do you think I like being against this rail project? Do you think I just decided one day it would make good argument material? Not! I will continue to strike against this thing until such time as FDOT or Florida Rail Enterprise steps up, corrects the applications and data, and suggests that the route itself may be changed (to line up with the corridor, and to actually serve Floridians) by the bidders. Until then, GIVE EM HELL.

The companies in this race admit that this line will be a loser, but some of them are willing to suck that up if it "get's them in the door to build more and successful lines in the USA." My contention is simple, they are going to bid based on BAD DATA or FABRICATIONS, so when it fails we have set ourselves up to take the fall.

Secondly, if it fails like I think it will fail if it's built according to the State Plan, don't expect there to be another investment in HSR in general, or in the Southeast in particular.

OCKLAWAHA

[thelakelander]

The bidding process should take place regardless of what any of us think on this particular issue.  Don't take it personal, its not a knock on anyone.  With $2.4 billion in funding on the line, its more logical to vet with facts and statistical data instead of opinions.  Regardless of how this turns out, that's my position.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Been keeping an un-in-the-know eye on this thread because it's interesting, and may ultimately affect me, but I'm going to defer to Ock on this one - not because of his extensive railroad knowledge, but because of the cloudy view that I percieve the world in general.

If we receive the HSR funds and build a workable system, then whomever was the highest bidder, starts here and expands across the country with the sole rights that they negotiated for to begin with.  Good for Florida, good for them (the euro co. that gets the contract).  

If it bombs here, we have the country's version of the Skyway - an unused eyesore that takes a few people nowhere.  Florida now became the reason that HSR in the country is unfeasible and we have a black-eye as a state.

If we defer the money to some other state, then they alone will bear the burden of making it successful, but they also will bear the burden if it fails miserably.  If it's a success, then plans will start popping up around the country - Florida could very well be next in line, and if it's a failure, then we, as a state, can point our fingers and tell them what they should have done.

This (HSR) is supposed to free the country from foriegn oil, eliminate highway congestion and affordably allow the common man to tavel 180 mph across the country for $.05/mile.  The expectations have been set extremely high.  How could a country as advanced as we fail in somehting that so is common overseas?

Long and short, if it works, we'll have it soon enough and CA can say I told you so.  If it doesn't, we won't be left standing there with no chair when the music stops.

[thelakelander]

You can't live your life or plan your community in fear.  Why does this infrastructure only have to be used for HSR?  Instead of talking about this only from a HSR perspective, we should be talking about how to best utilize the infrastructure that would be constructed by the $2.4 billion.  Again, all this leads to is more reason to issue the RFP out to the private sector.  For all we know, they may suggest modifications within their specific plans that make this whole project more cost effective and beneficial for all parties involved.

[JeffreyS]

I would in no way suggest we should start with HSR unless that is the only transit we have money for. Not vetting it with the private rail companies just weeks before they get the RFP is political pandering at best ego maniacal at worst.  You would at least think the Governor and his staff could find a reason that wasn't such an obvious lie to kill it.  Perhaps he enjoys the fact that he can say I am not doing this because the sky is plaid and there is nothing anyone can do to King Scott.