Downtown Revitalization: A Broken Record

[Metro Jacksonville]

Downtown Revitalization: A Broken Record



Metro Jacksonville shares a series of quotes over the last 39 years that highlight an inability to stabilize the decline of downtown. Will any of our mayoral candidates have success where predecessors have failed?

Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2011-jan-downtown-revitalization-a-broken-record

[peestandingup]

It's only productive if it's implemented.  I've seen so many plans in the last 40 years that have talked about the development of downtown that have been put on paper and shelved.

Robert Wilson, Northside resident 11/13/98

Pretty much Jacksonville's mentality in a nutshell when it comes to core development. Either put it on the back burner, trash it completely, or implement it in a very half-assed sorta way without being part of a grand scheme.

[vicupstate]

To be fair, most cities floundered in trying to revive or even mitigate the decline in Downtown/urban cores during the 70's and '80's.  But more recently, cities have started getting it right in a big way, particularly our larger cities. 

Jax isn't learning from those examples though.  THAT, I do fault them for.   

[dougskiles]

Sometimes I wonder if we wouldn't be better off getting rid of all policies and plans, restrictive ordinances, and all of the organizations tasked with 'revitalizing' downtown and just see what happens.  It's a lot like the Everglades.  After decades of spending billions of dollars trying to control it and now spending billions more to fix it, some are realizing that the best thing to do would have just been to leave it alone and it would have fixed itself.

That is probably a little extreme, but seriously, I think we have really been overthinking it.  We could set a few basic parameters and try to provide some good basic infrastructure and then get out of the way.  Let businesses grow 'organically' as we like to say these days.  I'm guessing that is how it ever came to existance and was once thriving in the first place.

Too much of any one thing is bad and planning is no exception.

[Captain Zissou]

Too much of any one thing is bad and planning is no exception.

Well put.  I think the recent growth along Stockton, King Street, and the Avondale strip is a testament to this.  With far less regulation and government involvement these areas have thrived in the past year.  

[dougskiles]

Its a bit like making a baby.  A geneticist could spend another hundred years tinkering with DNA strands, and in the process create a few splice monsters, and leave a bunch of stillborn creatures along the way without ever getting a human being that works and lives happily.

There would be lots of gripping committee meetings along the way, intense debates about why the latest project has a third arm in the middle its forehead, not to mention the funding mechanism which would cost billions of dollars in funding just to finance the equipment necessary for true genetic tinkering.

But in reality, if the outcome you are looking for is just a healthy baby,

It really just takes two people, a little consent and a lack of contraception.

Nobody says it quite like you do.

[thelakelander]

But in reality, if the outcome you are looking for is just a healthy baby,

It really just takes two people, a little consent and a lack of contraception.

ahh....connectivity. Cluster complementing parts together in a compact setting and watch things multiply.  Separate them a mile a way from each other and everything else and watch the cob webs form.

[Bativac]

Sometimes I wonder if we wouldn't be better off getting rid of all policies and plans, restrictive ordinances, and all of the organizations tasked with 'revitalizing' downtown and just see what happens.  It's a lot like the Everglades.  After decades of spending billions of dollars trying to control it and now spending billions more to fix it, some are realizing that the best thing to do would have just been to leave it alone and it would have fixed itself.

That is probably a little extreme, but seriously, I think we have really been overthinking it.  We could set a few basic parameters and try to provide some good basic infrastructure and then get out of the way.  Let businesses grow 'organically' as we like to say these days.  I'm guessing that is how it ever came to existance and was once thriving in the first place.

Too much of any one thing is bad and planning is no exception.

Probably a good idea at this point. I mean, nothing else has worked.

I know you can succeed downtown, in spite of the city itself. My dad's cousin Larry Hazouri is quoted in the above article. He has successfully operated restaurants (or diners or cafes, whatever you wanna call 'em) downtown for many years and continues to do so. But he's the first to tell me that it's a strange environment to try to become successful in. You've got to be able to take advantage of the situation down there and perservere regardless of what the city says it's gonna do, and what committee members and developers claim is going to happen, because despite good intentions, nothing ever seems to work.

Maybe Jacksonville just needs to leave it alone for awhile and see what happens. Enforce no parking or sign regulations for three or four years. Allow no building demolitions. Just let it breathe and see how it goes.

[peestandingup]

Sometimes I wonder if we wouldn't be better off getting rid of all policies and plans, restrictive ordinances, and all of the organizations tasked with 'revitalizing' downtown and just see what happens.  It's a lot like the Everglades.  After decades of spending billions of dollars trying to control it and now spending billions more to fix it, some are realizing that the best thing to do would have just been to leave it alone and it would have fixed itself.

That is probably a little extreme, but seriously, I think we have really been overthinking it.  We could set a few basic parameters and try to provide some good basic infrastructure and then get out of the way.  Let businesses grow 'organically' as we like to say these days.  I'm guessing that is how it ever came to existance and was once thriving in the first place.

Too much of any one thing is bad and planning is no exception.

But then all of those bulldozing companies & building contractors with their government connections wouldn't have gotten work. You're trying to take away jobs from decent citizens. Someone boo this man!! 

[dougskiles]

Perhaps its time to pursue a cross disciplinary conversation in regards to urban planning.

Long overdue.  I confess, I am a civil engineer and have no training whatsoever in urban planning and yet often find myself advising developers about the best use for their property.  All too often it is from a perspective of what will the current zoning code allow and not what is actually best for the area and will have the greatest chance for success.

People in my profession (civil engineering) are probably as responsible - if not more so - than anyone else for some of the craziness that has happened in Jacksonville.

[mfc]

I think a lot that is being said is true. However, The key to moving any part of our city forward especially downtown takes leadership that can build relationships and partnerships. That understands the roi in downtown is high. We have a rare opportunity to elect that person in Audrey Moran.

[Jaxson]

I remember back in the 1980s when the Jacksonville Landing was expected to bring downtown back to life.  Back when it had retailers like The Sharper Image, Laura Ashley and Banana Republic, the Landing was the place to be for sure.  I remember my parents taking out-of-town guests to the Landing.  I remember going there for lunch with my ninth grade art class when we went on a field trip to the Cummer.  Oh, yet another broken dream for downtown Jacksonville.

[thelakelander]

Because it was designed to be self inclusive, like most of Jax's skyscrapers developed during that era, the opportunity for pedestrian scale connectivity with the rest of DT never took place.  So breeding life onto DT's streets never really had a chance of happening.

[dougskiles]

I'm sure it's been discussed before in this forum, but I'll ask again anyway.

What do you think of Sleiman's plan to cut the Landing in half and open the view from Laura Street to the river?  I can't remember the details of the plan, but that seems like it would be a good thing.

[thelakelander]

It was a great plan because it opened the Landing's courtyard (downtown's most vibrant public space) to Laura Street and the rest of downtown.  Converting the interior mall's retail spaces to an outdoor food court, facing Independent Drive would also help make the city side of the Landing into a decent outdoor space of it's own.  Perhaps it's something that can be revived with the next administration.