Are JTA's Downtown Amtrak Plans Already Outdated?

[thelakelander]

In defense of the JTA-TPO office building on the site as opposed to elsewhere consider that if you built a discount store in Durkeeville, you wouldn't want the regisiters in LaVilla.

Not really.  A closer comparison would be like saying every CVS distribution center or corporate office needs to be next door to a CVS store, which is simply not true.  This is the 21st century now, is there a better reason for spending millions on a new office as opposed to consolidating space within an existing facility a few blocks away?

[fsujax]

Take heart my friends. This is what I know. The only part of the JRTC that is anywhere ready for construction is the Transportation Management Center (Phase 1). The design plans are at least 90%. The rest of the facility is not even at 30%. TUFSU1 is right in his account, there are those internally at JTA pushing for a complete redesign of the entire facility. Luckily, the entire rail portion of the JRTC is being revisited and major changes to the original design are taking shape. Most importantly this is due to the major push for relocating Amtrak back Downtown as soon as possible. I know that JTA has been in constant discussion with Amtrak, Rail America/FEC and CSX. Believe me CSX is the key! Hope to have more information soon. I know everyone gets frustrated because things seem to happen so slow, but believe me they are happening, quietly behind the scenes! It would make things alot easier if the City would commit to relocating the convention center.

[tufsu1]

to be fair, its not just JTA....FDOT and the TPO are also partners in the Traffic Management Center/office building....in fact, JTA had been stalling for so long that the TPO and FDOT were about to take their $ and walk.....that got JTA moving

That would be shocking to me.  To find out that the TPO supports this design.

supporting the JRTC design and funding the Traffic Management Center are not the same thing

[Jaxson]

Take heart my friends. This is what I know. The only part of the JRTC that is anywhere ready for construction is the Transportation Management Center (Phase 1). The design plans are at least 90%. The rest of the facility is not even at 30%. TUFSU1 is right in his account, there are those internally at JTA pushing for a complete redesign of the entire facility. Luckily, the entire rail portion of the JRTC is being revisited and major changes to the original design are taking shape. Most importantly this is due to the major push for relocating Amtrak back Downtown as soon as possible. I know that JTA has been in constant discussion with Amtrak, Rail America/FEC and CSX. Believe me CSX is the key! Hope to have more information soon. I know everyone gets frustrated because things seem to happen so slow, but believe me they are happening, quietly behind the scenes! It would make things alot easier if the City would commit to relocating the convention center.

I wonder how soon they mean when they say 'as soon as possible'....

[Ocklawaha]

The convention center is so small that we could move it's limited business to the arena, fair, and other venues around downtown until we could get a new one up. Meanwhile we wouldn't miss the train by having the top facility of it's kind in the South over at 1000 West Bay.


OCKLAWAHA

[Jaxson]

The convention center is so small that we could move it's limited business to the arena, fair, and other venues around downtown until we could get a new one up. Meanwhile we wouldn't miss the train by having the top facility of it's kind in the South over at 1000 West Bay.


OCKLAWAHA

Excellent point, Ock!

[stjr]

The convention center is so small that we could move it's limited business to the arena, fair, and other venues around downtown until we could get a new one up. Meanwhile we wouldn't miss the train by having the top facility of it's kind in the South over at 1000 West Bay.

LOL, just like the good ol' days without the massive expense.  With the ballrooms at the Hyatt, Omni, and UNF Conference Center, not to mention the Club and Terrace Suite facilities at the stadium, the Equestrian Center, etc., we probably could pull it off.  Heck, I bet some of the mega-churches around town have social halls now rivaling a small convention center.  Don't forget the St. Johns County-Radisson Convention Center and the Marriott at Sawgrass.

[dougskiles]

The convention center is so small that we could move it's limited business to the arena, fair, and other venues around downtown until we could get a new one up. Meanwhile we wouldn't miss the train by having the top facility of it's kind in the South over at 1000 West Bay.

LOL, just like the good ol' days without the massive expense.  With the ballrooms at the Hyatt, Omni, and UNF Conference Center, not to mention the Club and Terrace Suite facilities at the stadium, the Equestrian Center, etc., we probably could pull it off.  Heck, I bet some of the mega-churches around town have social halls now rivaling a small convention center.  Don't forget the St. Johns County-Radisson Convention Center and the Marriott at Sawgrass.

There is no doubt we could pull it off.  Who would be against it?  Are there any groups who feel that the convention center in it's current location is a benefit?  I have yet to hear them - here or anywhere else.

[Jaxson]

I would like to know if Jacksonville leaders have thought about one advantage that convention meccas like Orlando and San Diego have over our city --- a more vibrant entertainment scene.  I have been to conventions in Orlando, Philadelphia, Boston, San Diego, Los Angeles and Kansas City.  What impressed me the most about these cities is the way that these cities entertained delegates when we were not busy with convention business.  I particularly loved the way that San Diego invited conventioneers to spend the evening there.  I do not see the same in a city like ours where many downtown streets are about a welcoming as the back of a hearse.  The poorly lit streets, the boarded up businesses, and the overgrown vacant lots aren't helping , either...

[thelakelander]

This is one of the reasons why the convention center should be relocated. You have an opportunity to create a vibrant scene of uses (convention center, Hyatt, Bay Street, Landing) that would feed off each other.  KC did the same thing. They developed a Landing style entertainment center between their convention center, hotels and new arena.  Now that little strip stays pretty active around the clock.

[tufsu1]

btw...what vibrant entertainment scene does Orlando have within walking distance of its convention center?

[dougskiles]

I seriously doubt that Jacksonville is going to invest the money to build a convention center anytime soon that will have much effect on the downtown scene.  So, if the underlying reason for building a new convention center is to get the current one out of the existing location to make room for a more sensible JRTC, then perhaps we should be pushing for the use of existing 'convention' facilities described above instead of pushing for a new convention center.

After the courthouse public relations nightmare, I would be surprised to see a new mayor pushing for another large public building.  And even if they did, would they get enough support from the city council and general public?

How about research facilities to promote a biomedical industry (or something along those lines)?  I would rather see us spend money attracting talented/creative people to live in Jacksonville - not just visit for the weekend.

[thelakelander]

I think you have to look at public/private partnerships for a new convention center. For example, I'd be very surprised if Hyatt wouldn't be interested in having an exhibition hall next door.

[Ralph W]

I know the Hyatt and Omni ballroom/convention spaces are not overly large, but... are they actively marketing for all the right sized conventions they could possibly book? And, are they PUSHING the city to provide and/or promote the development of nearby amenities other than the Landing to fill the free time of their attendees?

I've been to a number of conventions and very low on my list of things to do is wander empty streets or watch the tides swirl by along featureless "riverwalks". I've been to the Landing a few times, too, and I've really seen all I need to see there. I think "stale" is the word I'm looking for. Maybe I'm too old to think the bar scene is still attractive.

I think if I were a convention planner and our group was actively looking for a venue I would vote against a second visit to Jacksonville.

[dougskiles]

I think you have to look at public/private partnerships for a new convention center. For example, I'd be very surprised if Hyatt wouldn't be interested in having an exhibition hall next door.

Do you think they would be interested enough to pay for a chunk of it?