City busses

kitester · December 25, 2010, 09:51:31 AM

I have a question about the law surrounding a city bus on the road.

If a bus is at rest near the curb and you have a clear way around it are you permitted to pass it? I know they have an illuminated STOP and flashing lights to indicate if they are stopped when they are picking up or dropping off riders. Obviously if they are fully in the regular driving lane and moving its not possible or safe to pass on most city streets. Occasionally I see them parked off to the side stopped for extended periods of time either at a stop or not. At what point would you go around them?

Springfielder · December 25, 2010, 11:16:42 AM

City buses don't have the stop sign, that's school buses. They do however have the flashing lights when they apply the brakes. If the bus is pulled over to the curb and parked, then yes, you can go around them with caution.

Ocklawaha · December 25, 2010, 03:58:56 PM

Actually Springfielder the new city buses DO HAVE STOP SIGNS on the rear, but they do not mean for all traffic to stop, they are actuated by brakes... fancy brake lights. You can treat that bus like any other slow moving vehicle in downtown or elsewhere, when that light illuminates and you can safely move left DO SO or you risk being stuck "in the pocket." If you are stuck and the bus is staying at the stop you can put on your left signal, pull-out and pass as soon as the road is clear.

THESE ARE NOT SCHOOL BUS STOP SIGNS, which indicate all traffic stop EXCEPT where a divided highway has a median... no median - STOP even if its 10 lanes wide.

OCKLAWAHA

kitester · December 27, 2010, 04:46:58 AM

Well that is what I thought. I am a careful driver especially where people might be getting on or off busses. I never would try to pass a buss in a dangerous situation or in crowded traffic.

So now I will tell you why I asked. On two occasions now, as I have tried to pass a city buss the driver has very blatantly pulled out to block me. In the first incident I actually passed him and made a right hand turn. The driver also turned. In traffic he came up next to me in the center lane and very dibelatry ran me off the road on to the left sidewalk. I was pulling a trailer at the time. Even my horn and lights did not stop him. if I had not slammed on the brakes and run off the road he would have hit me for sure! It was so obvious. This happen about a year ago on Union St. at about 5:30 am

In the second incident which happened just last week a city buss driver ran us into the oncoming lane as we tried to pass. He was parked on the curb, stationary, as we approached from more than two blocks away. When we got to the bus we slowed to almost a complete stop. As the buss did not move we proceeded around it. The driver waited until we started to pass and then cut the wheels hard right moved across the lane till his bumper was over the center lane. There was no traffic, no pedestrians and no object in the road to go around. He then proceeded to travel down the road at a very leisurely pace. This happened on Park. This happened around 7 PM.

Both times the intention of the driver was clear. To block traffic or use a buss to extract revenge for being passed. I would like to know if anyone else has had a similar experience driving around town. i chocked the first time up to some driver having a bad day. But it seems that there might be a policy amongst some of the drivers to use busses to bully other drivers.

ricker · December 27, 2010, 06:52:15 AM

not to seem too douchey - but Park St has a double yellow line.
frustrating as it may be.
waiting is better than crushing someone on foot, right/

Springfielder · December 27, 2010, 07:39:50 AM

If a bus driver is intentionally cutting you off, then get the number and report them. If they're pulled over to the curb, then you can proceed with caution around it. In Springfield, a bus is often stopped and sits for an extended period of time on Market, by 1st. I always stop to make sure it's just not unloading and then go around if it's not.

There are arrogant people, no matter what...but as I said, in cases like you mentioned, you should've reported that driver.

Ock...thanks for letting me know that...guess I've not been behind one of the newer buses to see the new stop lights. You're also correct, in that it's not like the school bus stop signs.

Dog Walker · December 27, 2010, 10:13:23 AM

I think the city buses have a two stage system. If the yellow lights on the rear of the bus are blinking, they are going to stop at the next bus stop. Then when they brake, the regular brake lights and the STOP sign come on.

That's been my impression anyway.

BridgeTroll · December 27, 2010, 10:33:08 AM

Not sure if the law is new or not but I have noticed an ad posted on the rear of the bus stating that drivers MUST allow the bus back into traffic after stops. Could it be that drivers are exercising this this (new?) law a bit more aggressively?

Springfielder · December 27, 2010, 10:51:41 AM

I'd like to see the law concerning that...hell, they usually force their way back in anyway

BridgeTroll · December 27, 2010, 11:23:05 AM

The practice is called YTB or "Yield To Bus"... apparently there are local or state laws requiring drivers to let busses merge back into traffic after stops. Perhaps one of our crack research staff could find the actual statute...

Ocklawaha · December 27, 2010, 11:25:38 AM

Quote from: kitester on December 27, 2010, 04:46:58 AM
Well that is what I thought. I am a careful driver especially where people might be getting on or off busses. I never would try to pass a buss in a dangerous situation or in crowded traffic.

So now I will tell you why I asked. On two occasions now, as I have tried to pass a city buss the driver has very blatantly pulled out to block me. In the first incident I actually passed him and made a right hand turn. The driver also turned. In traffic he came up next to me in the center lane and very dibelatry ran me off the road on to the left sidewalk. I was pulling a trailer at the time. Even my horn and lights did not stop him. if I had not slammed on the brakes and run off the road he would have hit me for sure! It was so obvious. This happen about a year ago on Union St. at about 5:30 am

In the second incident which happened just last week a city buss driver ran us into the oncoming lane as we tried to pass. He was parked on the curb, stationary, as we approached from more than two blocks away. When we got to the bus we slowed to almost a complete stop. As the buss did not move we proceeded around it. The driver waited until we started to pass and then cut the wheels hard right moved across the lane till his bumper was over the center lane. There was no traffic, no pedestrians and no object in the road to go around. He then proceeded to travel down the road at a very leisurely pace. This happened on Park. This happened around 7 PM.

Both times the intention of the driver was clear. To block traffic or use a buss to extract revenge for being passed. I would like to know if anyone else has had a similar experience driving around town. i chocked the first time up to some driver having a bad day. But it seems that there might be a policy amongst some of the drivers to use busses to bully other drivers.

I am not defending any bus driver that uses his bus as a bully platform on wheels, however their might be a reason for the "across the line" observation that you made.

In a vehicle as long as our standard city buses, or driving the kids to a soccer game in a full size Chevy van, one quickly discovers as you, the driver, are out in front of the front wheels you can make a turn and seemingly be exactly where you want to be. Suddenly there is a rather strange sounding wiggle and scraping sound... WTF? "I think it was a Buick." This happens because the back end of that 40-50' vehicle DID NOT make the same turn as the front wheels, rather you just dragged it over someones car. Shorter stature drivers in a standard van often do the same thing on our narrow streets, taking out the curb, stop signs, posts, and anything else unfortunate enough to be right on the corner. The front makes the turn and the back gets dragged over - or will "cut the corner."

A solution to this problem is to do what is called a "button hook turn." Basically as you can see from the diagram you pass BEYOND where the normal turning point is, then hook into your turn to pull those back wheels out at a sharper angle and to clear obstacles. This can also be true when pulling out from curbside if the pavement ends immediately ahead of you, parking ends, a corner, or another parked car (our Buick) is in front of you.

Just saying...

OCKLAWAHA
Former Transportation Supervisor
Tamiami Trailways Bus System

Ralph W · December 27, 2010, 02:49:14 PM

Title XXIII
MOTOR VEHICLES

Chapter 316
STATE UNIFORM TRAFFIC CONTROL

View Entire Chapter
316.0815

Duty to yield to public transit vehicles.
â€"
(1)

The driver of a vehicle shall yield the right-of-way to a publicly owned transit bus traveling in the same direction which has signaled and is reentering the traffic flow from a specifically designated pullout bay.
(2)

This section does not relieve the driver of a public transit bus from the duty to drive with due regard for the safety of all persons using the roadway.
History.
â€"

s. 9, ch. 99-385.

Springfielder · December 27, 2010, 06:13:17 PM

thanks for posting that

kitester · January 06, 2011, 09:34:54 AM

Thanks to allfor the info...

That is what I expected. I always let the bus back in if they are trying to move. In both cases the bus was completely stoped and off to the side of the road. In the first incident I stopped and waited for the bus to move. When he did not I proceeded around him slowly. In the second case we came to alomst a complete stop. There was no indication that the bus was pulling back into traffic untill we pulled up next to it. There was no reason to cut the wheels so hard as if to make a left turn from the far right. The driver proceeded straight on Park instead. The intention was clear, to cut off the passing traffic. I have heard that allowing buses back into traffic is a law in other countries. It makes sense that it is one here. It should be common sense but, pushy drivers often force thier way by buses. That may make the drivers frustrated but, if anybody needes to refrain from "road rage" I think it ought to be the people driving the city buses.