Obama is Renewing the American Sense of Identity. Unbelievable to Watch

[RiversideGator]

R. Leigh Gillette showed up at a Prince William County, Virginia polling place on November 6 about 30 minutes before the polls closed. Because he was on his way to a recreation facility and his wife was driving, Gillette was not carrying an ID. When a poll worker told him he could not vote without ID, Gillette asked to speak to the person in charge who also told him he could not vote. Gillette was never offered an Affirmation of Identity form as required by Virginia law.

I have never gone to vote without my ID but if the poll workers failed to follow the law, they should be reprimanded.  This doesnt exactly prove a vast vote suppression conspiracy by the Reps as you alluded earlier.

[gatorback]

Ha.  Fair enough.  Since you disallowed the Congresswoman Meek argument, I had to find some totally unrelated point for smoke.  Just for the record, I didn't vote that election but in 2004, I did vote for your boy. Dad is so  proud. 

[BridgeTroll]

Ha.  Fair enough.  Since you disallowed the Congresswoman Meek argument, I had to find some totally unrelated point for smoke.  Just for the record, I didn't vote that election but in 2004, I did vote for your boy. Dad is so  proud. 

Nah... the argument wasnt disallowed.  It just wasnt a good argument...

[ChriswUfGator]

I find this hilarious after reading the Wikileaks documents. As it turns out, all of that and more was in fact going on.

Some of these conservatives really need to take off the blinders...

[BridgeTroll]

It certainly is a blast from the past!  The hopes and dreams of some... the fears and angst of others.  Today we have left wing democrats actually cursing the name Obama... along with right wing republicans.  The rest of us muddle along as we always have.  Disliking some policies, liking others, understanding that politics and realities undo the best laid plans...

What will the future bring?

[NotNow]

"We can't drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times ... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK," Obama said.

"That's not leadership. That's not going to happen," he added.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h-wpxs1Re-8vx2Zk5xnYygW1W67w

Let's dissect this truly radical, bizarre and anti-American statement:
1)  "We cant drive our SUVs":  why not?  As Americans we have the freedom to do whatever we want to within the law.  If people can afford to drive SUVs and want them, it is fine with me.


3)  "We cant keep our homes on 72 degrees all the time":  Really?  Is he advocating that we outlaw central heat and air now?  Perhaps a return to fans only?  Why cant we keep our homes comfortably heated and cooled consistent with our wishes and financial abilities?  Is America now so broken down and bankrupt that under an Obama regime he will have the Feds monitoring our thermostats?  This is truly disturbing and ridiculous.

It literally pains me to read such ignorant statements.  It's anti-American to say that we we need to stop carelessly using energy and start actually realizing that the way we live our lives have consequences?  That is pure nonsense.  WE CAN"T KEEP DRIVING SUVS AND BLARING OUR A/C, and not because people who pause and actually think out these problems have anything against these things themselves (as RG's comments would suggest), but because THEY WASTE ENERGY.  In turn, energy waste will lead to wars for natural resources, and the lifestyle we want our children to have will simply not be possible.

The idea that anyone could suggest that thinking responsibly about energy use is "anti-American" is exactly why people are voting for Obama: we are sick of stupid, know-nothing conservatives spouting off that this or that is "ant-american", in a desire to consistently alienate neighbors from one another, and to keep our society split.  If you want to talk "anti-American", let's talk torture, or spying on American citizens, or suppressing speech and protest; to label discussion of irresponsible energy use "anti-American" is just stupid. 

Sir,  I think that what us stupid, know-nothing conservatives are calling "un-American" is the use of Federal power to tell American citizens what cars they can or cannot drive or what temperature they can maintain in their own homes.  I can't seem to find any constitutional authority for the federal government to legislate either of those.  I am sure, however, that you can find the Article where that governmental power resides.  Please let the rest of us know.  I know that Stephen is an "admirer" of the U. S. Constitution.  Perhaps he can help.  We stupid conservatives are not opposed to energy conservation, but we are opposed to governments or political candidates (or anyone else, for that matter) sticking their nose into how we live our lives or spend our hard earned money.

As for "torture", you have left me wondering what acts you are referring to.  Is it "waterboarding", the media favorite that has been used so few times that you only need one hand to count, requiring the highest authority?  Those uses (Muhammed, Zubaydah, and al-Nashiri) led to intelligence which probably saved many lives in the West.  I'm not sure of what spying on American citizens you are referring to, but again, only very few life threatening cases meet the criteria for no warrant wiretap.  Can you refer me to a case where this was misused?  I would also ask for what instances of suppressing speech or protest you refer to.

I stand by my statements.  Thanks!

[NotNow]

WOW!  You are deleting so much so fast it is hard to keep up with the thread StephenDare!....Does it read the way you want yet?

[NotNow]

You are correct.  My mistake, and my apologies.

[ChriswUfGator]

"We can't drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times ... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK," Obama said.

"That's not leadership. That's not going to happen," he added.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h-wpxs1Re-8vx2Zk5xnYygW1W67w

Let's dissect this truly radical, bizarre and anti-American statement:
1)  "We cant drive our SUVs":  why not?  As Americans we have the freedom to do whatever we want to within the law.  If people can afford to drive SUVs and want them, it is fine with me.


3)  "We cant keep our homes on 72 degrees all the time":  Really?  Is he advocating that we outlaw central heat and air now?  Perhaps a return to fans only?  Why cant we keep our homes comfortably heated and cooled consistent with our wishes and financial abilities?  Is America now so broken down and bankrupt that under an Obama regime he will have the Feds monitoring our thermostats?  This is truly disturbing and ridiculous.

It literally pains me to read such ignorant statements.  It's anti-American to say that we we need to stop carelessly using energy and start actually realizing that the way we live our lives have consequences?  That is pure nonsense.  WE CAN"T KEEP DRIVING SUVS AND BLARING OUR A/C, and not because people who pause and actually think out these problems have anything against these things themselves (as RG's comments would suggest), but because THEY WASTE ENERGY.  In turn, energy waste will lead to wars for natural resources, and the lifestyle we want our children to have will simply not be possible.

The idea that anyone could suggest that thinking responsibly about energy use is "anti-American" is exactly why people are voting for Obama: we are sick of stupid, know-nothing conservatives spouting off that this or that is "ant-american", in a desire to consistently alienate neighbors from one another, and to keep our society split.  If you want to talk "anti-American", let's talk torture, or spying on American citizens, or suppressing speech and protest; to label discussion of irresponsible energy use "anti-American" is just stupid. 

Sir,  I think that what us stupid, know-nothing conservatives are calling "un-American" is the use of Federal power to tell American citizens what cars they can or cannot drive or what temperature they can maintain in their own homes.  I can't seem to find any constitutional authority for the federal government to legislate either of those.  I am sure, however, that you can find the Article where that governmental power resides.  Please let the rest of us know.  I know that Stephen is an "admirer" of the U. S. Constitution.  Perhaps he can help.  We stupid conservatives are not opposed to energy conservation, but we are opposed to governments or political candidates (or anyone else, for that matter) sticking their nose into how we live our lives or spend our hard earned money.

As for "torture", you have left me wondering what acts you are referring to.  Is it "waterboarding", the media favorite that has been used so few times that you only need one hand to count, requiring the highest authority?  Those uses (Muhammed, Zubaydah, and al-Nashiri) led to intelligence which probably saved many lives in the West.  I'm not sure of what spying on American citizens you are referring to, but again, only very few life threatening cases meet the criteria for no warrant wiretap.  Can you refer me to a case where this was misused?  I would also ask for what instances of suppressing speech or protest you refer to.

I stand by my statements.  Thanks!

So after seeing all the documents and pictures and that video of the guy in the helicopter getting their jollies off by strafing and killing an AP journalist and everything else on wikileaks, after all the disclosures by our own government of the secret torture prisons we opened in other countries specifically to avoid our interrogation techniques falling within US legal jurisdictions, you're still sticking by your statements that there was no such thing as torture going on? Really?

[NotNow]

Forgive my ignorance.  I have not seen documentation that the operator of that gun KNEW of any AP "journalist" in the area, or that that operator disobeyed orders in any way.  I have not heard of any "jollies" being gotten off in the case either.  If you would provide that I would appreciate it.  I am afraid that I also missed any real "disclosures by our own government of the secret torture prisons we opened in other countries", could you provide that as well?  

Really.

[finehoe]

George Bush admitted...that Khalid Sheik Mohammed, the self-proclaimed mastermind of the 9/11 attacks, was waterboarded by the US, and said he would do it again...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jun/03/george-bush-us-waterboarded-terror-mastermind

[ChriswUfGator]

Forgive my ignorance.  I have not seen documentation that the operator of that gun KNEW of any AP "journalist" in the area, or that that operator disobeyed orders in any way.  I have not heard of any "jollies" being gotten off in the case either.  If you would provide that I would appreciate it.  I am afraid that I also missed any real "disclosures by our own government of the secret torture prisons we opened in other countries", could you provide that as well?  

Really.

Have you been hiding under a rock?

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/12668/us-admits-to-torture-at-secret-jail-inside-thailand

http://www.amnesty.org/en/news-and-updates/news/lithuania-admits-existence-secret-prison-20091222

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/law/article630672.ece

And regarding the air crew getting their jollies off, have you even watched the video?

http://www.boingboing.net/2010/04/05/wikileaks-video-of-u.html

So I've now provided proof of everything you just denied. Care to admit you were wrong yet?

[BridgeTroll]

The Obama administration certainly seems to have followed the footsteps of President Bush.  Gitmo operates as efficiantly as ever... "Secret " prisons have certainly continued under Obamas orders.  He has learned to leave the interrogations up to Afghan, Iraqi, and Pakistani nationals.  He has found the remote control bombings of Pakistan very useful and continues to fight the good fight in Afghanistan.

As to the video... just what do you consider "jollies"?

[BridgeTroll]

I suppose I made the same mistake as many... I took him at his word.

[BridgeTroll]

Dont watch Fox... and as you are well aware... While I may listen politely to those that seem delusional... I seldom take their advice.