Update from Tampa

[tufsu1]

This is pretty surprising....I'm betting they decide to proceed with the rail route along I-275...which is less than 1/2 mile from a parallel BRT route now being designed...sound familiar?

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2010/oct/16/hart-study-rail-along-csx-could-cost-additional-67/news-money/

[CS Foltz]

Gee..........makes me wonder if we loaned out some of our high level JTA transit planners! They have no vision either...................lots of luck on a sales tax increase in todays economy, but at least the voters get to make the choice rather than being Fee'd or forced down their throats!

[tufsu1]

well CS...they have some of the best transit planners in the country working on their plan....this just shows you there are always trade-offs and it is never as simple as some on this site think it is

[thelakelander]

This isn't suprising at all.  This is something I've wondered about out loud for years now.  LRT and freight don't mix.  That means, somebody is going to have to put up some extra money to keep them from doing so.  With that said, if they'll be wasting money too if they build these things right on top of each other.  Speaking of Denver, I'll have to go and dig it up, but they issued a progress report a few years ago that said if they had to do it again, they would not have built LRT paralleling the interstate. 

[CS Foltz]

tufsu........I know there is commonality between Tampa and Jacksonville regarding the planning end, but there is something wrong with their picture! Tax increase?.......in todays economy hard sell for whatever reason! If the voters approve it............fine and dandy ,but what happens if it doesn't? I guess they would file said plan in that cabinet full of past studies and plans............you know....just like the cabinet full of that stuff we have on the fourth floor! I agree with lake..........LRT and freight don't mix and paralleling interstate or major road corridors is not really efficient or cost effective!

[tufsu1]

CS...if the Hillsborough County tax doesn't get approved this year, they'll try agtain....it took 4 times in Phoenix

and Pinellas County (St. Pete/Clearwater) will likely put their transit plan on the ballot next year....the whole bay area plan is being guided by TBARTA and involves all counties

[JeffreyS]

So they wasted everyone's time and money with BRT to now admit they need to go with rail. Sadly they are still way ahead of the JTA.

[fieldafm]

CS...if the Hillsborough County tax doesn't get approved this year, they'll try agtain....it took 4 times in Phoenix

Do you know what the split is of that one cent sales tax that is going to road projects versus transit projects?

How was Tampa's streetcar line originally financed, wasnt that part of a half cent sales tax increase, or am I thinking of a different city?

[tufsu1]

the sales tax is 75% transit, 25% roads....of the transit, 2/3 goes to rail, 1/3 to better/expanded bus service.

Original streetcar line was only partially funded with local $....of the $52 million, about 70% came from the Feds (prior to G.W. Bush stopping all streetcar funding)

[tufsu1]

So they wasted everyone's time and money with BRT to now admit they need to go with rail. Sadly they are still way ahead of the JTA.

nope...they are moving ahead with BRT regardless of whether rail happens or not....the idea is that it could complement, but more likely will compete with rail...here's the info

http://www.gohart.org/departments/marketing/brt/brt_main_page.html

[CS Foltz]

Thanks for the information tufsu! Brings more questions to mind though.........such as who there directs the main course that TBARTA is trying to travel......county commissioners or TBARTA management! I ask since there could be a variety of ways of that taking place! JTA seems to use tarot cards or a crystal ball made in china and does not seem to have the focus needed for the public. They seem to have their own agenda and this worries me!

[tufsu1]

Like JTA, TBARTA is an independent state agency

[tufsu1]

More on the Tampa plan to put light rail on active freight tracks

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2010/oct/22/csx-to-hart-light-rail-not-compatible-on-its-track/news-money/

[fsujax]

Does not surprise me. It is not even a CSX issue, but an FRA issue. Most LRT vehicles are non-compliant and can not run parallel (w/o being temporally separated) to freight trains. Now if they were proposing commuter rail on that corridor, then CSX would be more willing to negotiate with them. I am surprised that HART officials would push the issue with CSX. They better be careful or CSX will tell them where to stick their light rail train! haha

[thelakelander]

I can't believe they're just figuring this out.  Are they really that unprepared down there in Tampa?  This popped in my head the first time I saw their conceptual plan years ago.