Discussions about How to Approach Improving JTA.

[ChriswUfGator]

The CTA was mismanaged and failed on every front including a substantial fare hike in conjunction with massive service cuts that were documented in the paper DAILY.  We discussed it at the water cooler and waiting on the platforms. And yet, we still rode anyway, knowing there was corruption, incompetence and general stupidity. Tourists and businessmen still took it because it was a viable option and was ubiquitous, even with the cuts. The passengers saw a tangible benefit taking transit over driving.  Where is this being promoted in Jax?

But that's only because, at the end of the day, they had a working system. They at least got the job done, and while people may be upset at backroom-dealing, executives who do nothing but feather their own nests, and corrupt bargains, at the end of the day CTA gets people where they need to go.

With JTA, what you have is all of the B.S. and none of the benefit. Not only do they engage in everything that you found distasteful about CTA, but they don't even bother to have a working public transit system before doing it. We have the worst of all worlds.

[CS Foltz]

Looks like to me, that management is doing their best to keep their jobs! Of course............is there any other way?

[Singejoufflue]

The common tune I have detected in these threads is "JTA isn't how *I* want it". 

JTA works.  If it didn't work, the 10-12K riders wouldn't use it.  It has worked well enough to get me to and from 3 interviews this week, bus and skyway at that!  This can't be a build it and they will come mentality.  There ARE existing convenience routes (trolley, BH1, etc) that aren't being used enough.  How do we get people on THOSE routes before we talk about getting them on light rail from Nassau to St. John's county.

[ChriswUfGator]

The common tune I have detected in these threads is "JTA isn't how *I* want it".  

JTA works.  If it didn't work, the 10-12K riders wouldn't use it.  It has worked well enough to get me to and from 3 interviews this week, bus and skyway at that!  This can't be a build it and they will come mentality.  There ARE existing convenience routes (trolley, BH1, etc) that aren't being used enough.  How do we get people on THOSE routes before we talk about getting them on light rail from Nassau to St. John's county.

That's asinine.

JTA doesn't "work" in any sense at all. Yes, 10k-12k ride JTA in an area that has 1.3mm residents.

Is that really your definition of "success"? If a business loses money and only 2% of the people use it, that's "success"?

[ChriswUfGator]

This can't be a build it and they will come mentality.

And that's about the silliest thing I've ever heard.

So then, what happened when buses and streetcars were originally introduced? There couldn't have been any riders before that, since the routes didn't exist to ride before their introduction. So by your logic, how come anyone is riding public transit anywhere now? According to that thinking, nobody would be riding public transit anywhere, would they? Because without a route existing first, how could anyone ride it?

[Singejoufflue]

I made no point about JTA being a success. 

I can paint a house with a basting brush (works) or I can buy a top of the line paint sprayer that does it in a fraction of the time (works, with efficiency).  I can also consider the third option of buying some rollers and paint trays (also works, and is still more efficient than the basting brush).  The problem in all of these scenarios?  NO ONE WANTS THE HOUSE PAINTED! Except the four people who live inside and the one guy who likes to take up these issues on behalf of the little guy.

One more analogy before I head off to another interview (my 2nd JTA trip of the day, BTW)...and this is a true story.

My daughter wanted a swank camera for her birthday. I told her she had one she never uses.  She said she doesn't like that one, it has Hello Kitty on it and she lost the cord.  I told her I would buy her a cord.  But it's still ugly she said.  I told her if she shows interest in something she already has, I might consider buying her a new camera for Christmas.

[Singejoufflue]

Chris, we aren't talking about implementing a system that never existed prior to today.  We are talking about making use of an existing system in order to have it improved.

[ChriswUfGator]

I made no point about JTA being a success.  

Sure you did;

JTA works.  If it didn't work, the 10-12K riders wouldn't use it.

[ChriswUfGator]

Chris, we aren't talking about implementing a system that never existed prior to today.  We are talking about making use of an existing system in order to have it improved.

Really? Because I was simply responding to the nonsensical logic that you wrote in your words;

This can't be a build it and they will come mentality.

As a side note, since this is the second time in 2 pages you've made me go back and quote you, the fact is that you really can't say one thing, then another, then deny you said the first thing, on a message board. All people have to do is quote what you wrote, and the whole exercise makes everyone look silly.

You clearly said that with transit you can't have "build it and they will come" mentality. Those were your own words. That's asinine, as I've already pointed out, since public transit is one of the few things where indeed you MUST build it before you will have riders, as there is nothing to ride until it is built.

You have everything backwards I'm afraid. The reason JTA doesn't work is because it isn't constructed properly. It is fallacious logic to say that you cannot now construct it properly because it doesn't work. However, that was exactly your point.

[ChriswUfGator]

so your daughter isnt using the camera she already has, and this relates to Jacksonvillle's appalling failure with transit how?

Should we teach those dirty commuters a valuable lesson by witholding better transit until they learn their lesson?

Hate to tell you this, Singe, but you now qualify to sit on the present JTA board!

Just take a copy of this conversation down to the HQ on Myrtle.  Your employment search is over!

You beat me to it, I was just thinking that with logic like this a job at JTA would be a perfect fit.

[Live_Oak]

Congratulations chris and stephen.  I guess you guys won and scared off singe and tufsu from this conversation with you typical bullying and condescending and insulting remarks.  Good for you guys.

[Live_Oak]

Thanks for the tip stephen.  And the winks.  I love it when you wink at me.

[BridgeTroll]

I think part of what singe was trying to comment on is the issue of marketing and community awareness.  Unless you actually try to use our current crappy system you would have no idea where it goes or how it works.  Unless forced... few of us will ever take the time or effort to figure it out.  Even seasoned riders such as Stephen have difficulty with cryptic signage.  A little public outreach might go a long way towards boosting usage.

[ChriswUfGator]

Congratulations chris and stephen.  I guess you guys won and scared off singe and tufsu from this conversation with you typical bullying and condescending and insulting remarks.  Good for you guys.

LMAO! Unlike JTA's buses, Tufsu's shill is right on schedule! Now we know you don't take the bus to work!

I literally had just gotten done laughing about when you were going to show up, as you always do whenever Tufsu's figures are challenged, when you posted in this thread. Like something out of a movie.

[Live_Oak]

Please tell me when I'm allowed to post and on which topics.  I would like to post on more but can't hang out on this board 24/7 as others do.  Well, really just stephen.